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Anon says
Curious how couples who both have access to parental leave after childbirth have managed it – did you take it concurrently or consecutively? I’ve heard good things about both approaches and am interested in what’s most common, esp in the US.
AwayEmily says
My husband and I are both professors so we each get a full semester off from teaching (works out to about 3.5 months). We were lucky that our babies were all born in Jan/Feb, so we functionally had about seven months til the new school year started. We opted to take our leaves concurrently — both of us REALLY struggle with the newborn stage and needed the other person there to support. All our kids went to daycare at around four months, but being on leave made it so that we could do a more “gradual” start to daycare — for example, we often let the baby take their first nap at home and would bring them in closer to 10:30am.
Anon says
We are planning to do concurrent and to ease the baby into daycare in month five, which is the first month we could find a slot anyway. Tentative plan right now is to start the baby on part-time days when we have about two weeks left of leave. Then if he gets sick, we’re both still home and can tag team, and if not, we can go out on a few day dates before we go back to work. It feels nice to look forward to that!
Anonymous says
This sounds lovely but do make sure you have enough of a leave cushion for the first year when baby will have illness about monthly.
Anon says
More like twice monthly for the first winter, at least for us.
Anon says
My husband has a HUGE sick bank and I have a small combined PTO pool so he’ll get his turn to “solo parent” then :)
AwayEmily says
That sounds perfect!
Anon says
In the US, a lot of men don’t have much paternity leave but most couples I know where they both had it used the bulk of the dad’s leave after mom returned to work.
My situation was a little unusual. I had the standard 12 weeks (that I extended to 14 with vacation time) and my husband is a college professor who had one semester off teaching as his paternity leave. We used it consecutively, so I was home from the baby’s birth in late January until May and then he was home over the summer and fall semester, so kiddo had a parent caregiver for almost a full year. Because he didn’t take leave in the semester in which I gave birth, he taught the Monday after I gave birth on a Friday, but he kind of did the bare minimum at his job for the first couple weeks, and we had my mom here to help for two weeks as well, so it was doable.
Anononon says
Most of the men in my circle has 6 weeks paternity leave. The trend seems to be taking 2 ish weeks off together. Then the birth parent takes off the remainder of her leave and turns to work. Then the non birth parent takes the remaining four weeks solo. Usually works out to starting the baby in childcare at 6ish months.
That’s what we did and it worked out really well. There’s lots of studies out there that show men who take some of their leave as solo caregivers remain more active caregivers for their children since they’ve had experience just figuring things out solo.
Anon says
+1 To dad taking solo leave. It made a huge difference in my DH’s confidence level, bonding and independence with the baby.
My DH was home for about a week with me and the newborn and then went back. But his first few weeks back he would leave work a bit early so he was home to make dinner and help with witching hour when the baby tended to get fussy. It made a big difference for both of us for him to only be at work for ~7 hours instead of ~9-10 hours (including commute) but didn’t cost him much leave. Then he took all his remaining leave when I went back to work.
Anon says
+1 to this. We did 2 weeks at birth, then a few weeks of solo dad time at the end of my leave. Dad spending a bit of solo time with baby is the best way to get them to be aware.
anon says
When we had our first daughter in 2018, I had 20 weeks mat leave (big law) and my husband had 9 weeks (tech). My husband took 2 weeks at the beginning, which was so nice for us to bond as a family. Then when I went back to work at 20 weeks, he stayed home as primary caregiver for 7 weeks. I credit this 100% with giving him the confidence to parent by himself and bonding incredibly with our daughter. I still shake my head when moms of infants tell me they can’t meet for dinner/drinks in the evening or brunch on a weekend because their husband wouldn’t know what to do with the baby (when to feed? how to feed? what to feed? how to change diaper? not sure).
Unfortunately he only took a couple weeks off when our second daughter was born in 2021, but by then he was completely comfortable/competent at solo parenting when needed. I do think he bonded less intensely with our second daughter at that age, but can’t say for sure that is the reason.
Anona says
I had 14 weeks with partial pay and then too another 2 weeks unpaid (or maybe it was 12 weeks partial pay and 4 weeks unpaid, I can’t quite remember). My husband had 6 weeks. He took the first 2 weeks off with me right after our son was born, and then 4 weeks at the end. My mom came at the end of week 1, and he probably could have gone back earlier and then taken 5 weeks at the end – a 3:1 adult to newborn ratio felt a little unnecessary, but I had an uncomplicated labor and I know friends with c-sections who felt differently.
For us, there were a couple benefits – one was that my husband had the same full-time parenting skills that I did, so we both felt equally comfortable with solo care. And second, we could start daycare later – my son was 5 months old, sitting independently, and just felt more sturdy than he had even 4 weeks prior.
Boston Legal Eagle says
We did it consecutively for both kids, which I encourage everyone to do! Husband did 3 weeks after I gave birth, I had a little over 3 months with the kiddo, and then husband took 6-8 weeks after I went back to work. That worked out really well for us to give each parent solo time with the baby and (I think) set us up for a great equal parenting dynamic. I was certainly lonely during my leaves, but I could handle baby just fine after the first few weeks (I had easy physical recoveries). You’ll have to figure out the nighttime wake-ups in those first few months if husband is back at work – split shifts probably makes the most sense, although we both just ended up waking up. Made for tired days, but then husband got the cute 5-6 month baby phase!
AwayEmily says
Reading some of these responses…it kind of seems like the “better” option depends on on your priorities. If your priority is “have lots of support during the first few months” then do it concurrently. If your priority is “keep kid cared for at home/out of daycare for as long as possible” then go with consecutively. Both seem totally reasonable to me!! Of course, both also have other pros/cons but those seem like the major ones.
anon says
I disagree. It’s not about keeping kid out of daycare for as long as possible, though for us that was a silver lining. It was about giving the dad equal stakes in parenting, the opportunity to bond and the confidence to solo parent.
Anonymous says
This. It’s a big difference in responsibility when you are the sole caregiver and responsible for packing the diaper bag and dealing with a diaper blowout on your own at the grocery store. Any families I know where they took concurrent leave, it seems like mom is more the default parent.
Anon says
Yes and no – I have a colleague who did consecutive and it’s her husband’s turn with the baby now (5 months old). She’s constantly fielding calls from him about what to do. I think it depends on the person/family how well it works to fly solo.
Boston Legal Eagle says
Agree with this. In an ideal world, each parent would have 6 months, you could take the first two months together to get through the toughest stages, and then dad/non-birthing partner could take the last few months at the end. But given the length of leaves we have, we do what we can and I think each parent having solo time is so crucial.
Anon says
If the DH has that many questions, he must have been super hands off and let her be the main parent until now. It may be a pain for her to receive calls, but it does seem to be forcing him to be more hands on. I’d call that a big win.
It seems like the next step is for her to be unavailable for some of his calls so he has to figure it out on his own.
Anonymous says
I find the calls thing wild. DH asked questions before I left the house or the night before and I also took calls while pumping (2x/day) but otherwise I didn’t take calls. I didn’t call him constantly at work while I was on leave. Don’t know where the extra diapers are stored? Instacart a box or go to the store.
Anon says
If I can’t find something I text or call my husband at work and often he’ll know where he/a kid stashed it or remembers seeing it around. And he does the same to me. It’s weird to go buy something you already have just because your spouse doesn’t want to answer a question.
Anonymous says
I think it depends a lot on your job. I can’t be answering texts in a courtroom and DH probably can’t wait an hour or two until a break to change the baby so if he needs extra diapers, he would have to buy them or hunt around the house.
Anon says
Yeah I agree. I’m the one who said “had a parent caregiver for almost a full year” above and for us it wasn’t really about keeping kid out of daycare/nanny, although the financial savings from that was a nice benefit. But the real upsides are what you mentioned: the dad bonding and learning how to become an independent caregiver.
Also after living through Covid lockdowns, I don’t think I would have wanted my husband around all day during my maternity leave! I’m an introvert and am just not made to spend that many hours a day with another adult, even one I love. In the first couple of weeks I definitely appreciated extra adult hands to help with my physical recovery, establishing breastfeeding and things like giving a baby a bath for the first time. But after I was recovered and breastfeeding easily, which for me took less than two weeks, my husband’s presence felt really unnecessary and (based on what happened in 2020!) I think I would have been really annoyed with him if we were both home 24/7.
Anon says
Personally, I feel we have the best chance of that with a concurrent approach. We’re planning to split nights and he’ll get plenty of solo hands-on time then, as well as when I’m out of the house. We also have a strong foundation of an equal division of labor. It’s all about finding what works for your family.
Anon says
We found that a single infant wasn’t enough to keep us both busy. We were both ready for one of us to go back to work after a week or so. I was happy for a bit of space and he needed more to do.
I know you seem very sure of your plan, but you never know what sort of baby you’ll get. We had an easy infant who ate and slept well and there just wasn’t that much to do. But you may also end up with a needy baby with horrible reflux who doesn’t sleep. Just be ready to pivot if you need to change up your plan.
Anon says
We know ourselves and that we will NOT be dying to go back to work – if we find ourselves with spare time and the world’s easiest baby, great, then we’ll have time to send each other out on bike rides. If he poses a lot of challenges, we’ll be together to address them. I’m not planning for what kind of baby he’ll be, but for what the best coping mechanisms *for our style* are.
Anon says
+1 to “We found that a single infant wasn’t enough to keep us both busy.” I think in general on parenting subjects you mainly hear from people who had a tough time, so it was surprising to me how easy maternity leave was and how little I needed another adult there (after the brief physical recovery period). I think the advice to not set your plans in stone and make decisions about how to split your leave once you meet your baby and you see how your recovery is going is very good advice. Different approaches work for different families and you really don’t know what will work for your family until you’re in it.
Anon says
Some of it depends what you plan to do with your time. I found it really helpful to go to meet ups with other moms on maternity leave and their babies, as well as activities like stroller strides. Those moms became a network for me as we navigated everything from sleep training to preschool applications to potty training together. I found it really hard to build networks once I was back to work, as I was just too busy with a BigLaw job, so those friendships I built on leave became super important. Those were the moms I met at the playground on Saturday morning at 7 AM with my early riser and the moms I texted when I needed to find a new nanny share or get the scoop on the next community yard sale. It was great knowing other moms with babies the same age in my neighborhood. My kids are now 8 and 11 yo and I still talk to those moms, but now we’re discussing first periods and middle school.
I don’t know what my DH would have done all day while I was out making friends with other moms.
AwayEmily says
Some of these responses seem off-base to me. You really think the only way a dad can develop confidence, bond with their baby, and have equal stakes in parenting is if they watch the kid while the mom is back at work? I feel like this is unfair to many fathers who are all-in from the start.
My husband, and many husbands I know, was an equal parent from Day 1. He didn’t need to be left alone with the baby to learn how to care for her, any more than I did. We both just figured it out together, because we are partners. We don’t have a “default parent” — my husband is just as capable at all aspects of parenting as I am, and he always has been.
So yes, I guess if you think your husband will only step up if forced to, then maybe having him take leave on his own is good. But I think most dads are capable of so much more.
Anon says
I don’t think anyone is saying that it’s the ONLY way for a dad to develop independence and involvement, just that it’s a good way. I agree with you that good dads will care about their children and want to be involved from Day 1, but for a lot of new parents, there’s a big learning curve and for me it seemed like a better approach to have each parent go through that learning curve independently. My husband is an amazing dad and certainly wouldn’t have ignored or child or refused to parent if we’d done 100% our leaves concurrently, but I do think he would have overly relied on me for answers to his questions, which is only natural – when a more knowledgeable person is right there in the room, why wouldn’t you ask them your questions? It was better for our family for him to be alone with the baby all day and to have to figure out the answers to his questions from google, the doctor or trial-and-error. And it doesn’t make him a crappy dad who had to be forced into active parenting, which is basically what you’re implying.
Anon says
I tend to agree. It depends on the individual and the couple in question – it’s not like splitting up the time guarantees a 100% involved and competent father (and neither does sharing it). I don’t think approaches like “everyone should do this” are really relevant in parenting, TBH.
Anon says
My DH was all in from the start and very hands on, but being solo with the baby for several weeks did change his confidence level. It changed him as a parent in a lasting way.
Anon says
Agree. My husband got ONE week with each of our first two kids (who are now 10 and 12), and he bonded/stepped up with both. We both wish he had more time to be home for everyone’s sake, but it didn’t keep him from bonding with/being able to handle the kids solo.
Anonymous says
I don’t think it’s about having to be forced to do more. In our case, it was more about experience prior to parenting. I babysit a lot as a teenager for spending money. BF was new to me but I was familiar with changing diapers and how to dress a baby or feed a baby solids. The first diaper DH changed was our daughter at the hospital. He was willing but not as confident and had a much bigger learning curve so there was a lot of asking how to do something or if he was doing it right. Having to deal with situations solo gave him confidence that if would be okay even if things went wrong, that he would be able to figure it out.
Anonymous says
I agree with this. I was just reading, not participating, because my husband didn’t have parental leave (he used the two weeks of PTO time that he had when our baby was born), but our house didn’t have a default parent. If anything, my husband was a more confident and bonded parent during the newborn phase than I was. We both went into parenthood with zero meaningful experience with babies so we were both very deer-in-headlights in the beginning and supported each other, but it turned out he’s great with babies and I’m better with toddlers. We’re done having babies but if by some medical miracle we had another one now that he does have a job with parental leave, I would want him to take it concurrently for that support from him.
Anonymous says
I really think it’s unfair that with consecutive leaves the dad gets to take his when the baby is older, more interactive and fun, and easier, and that he isn’t dealing with physical recovery at the same time. My husband didn’t get any paid leave other than regular PTO he took at the time of the birth, but I would have deeply resented having to go back to work at 12 weeks while pumping, while he was at home relaxing and doing fun things with the baby. If paternity leave is given, I think it should have to be taken right after the birth just like maternity leave.
Anon says
I disagree with forcing men to use parental leave right away. I know not everyone has as smooth a recovery and newborn period as I did, but it would have been a huge waste to have two adults home for my entire maternity leave — after the first couple of weeks once I was recovered and breastfeeding was established it was just not a two person job at all. I was a little jealous that he got an older, more interactive baby, but I wasn’t angry at him about it. It was dictated by biology. And the flipside of the less interactive baby is that I had much more of a vacation during my maternity leave. Older babies are harder to care for, and I had way more free time on my leave than he did.
Anon says
I think it also depends on how you’re viewing it – is taking care of the baby a job you want to allocate the appropriate resources for, a time to bond as a family with both off work, or both? There isn’t one right answer because we’re not guaranteed great leave options (at least in the U.S.) and families have to cobble together an approach that sounds appealing and keeps the electricity on.
Betsy says
After the mom recovers from birth, parental leave isn’t about the parents, it’s about the baby’s needs. Consecutive leaves obviously result in each parent having very different types of babies, but that’s ok! There are hard and easy parts of every stage.
Anonymous says
It just seems like another way to take advantage of working mothers. Let’s make you gestate and give birth to this baby and then serve as its primary food source, all while working harder than then men to prove that you are still dedicated to your job. Then to add insult to injury, let’s give your husband several weeks or months to laze about with the baby, while he isn’t even recovering from vbirth or a c-section, and while you keep pumping during the day and BFing at home! Paternity leave is inherently sexist because it ignores the biological reality of motherhood and attempts to treat non-birthing parents as equals to birthing parents.
Betsy says
That…..is quite a take.
Anon says
I completely disagree. What’s sexist is NOT giving men any time off, which sets the expectation that the mother is the default parent who does everything. Men can do every part of parenting except giving birth and breastfeeding, and birth mothers generally have longer leaves to account for the added recovery from childbirth.
Do you also think adoptive mothers should get zero leave? Because they don’t birth or breastfeed…
Anon says
Isn’t the mother on disability for a set period of time and then she has baby bonding time? So the father would get the same baby bonding/paternity leave. The father obviously wouldn’t qualify for disability.
Anon says
Yeah in my workplace birth moms get 6 or 8 weeks of disability to recover from birth and then 6 weeks of parental leave for bonding. Dads and adoptive parents only get the 6 weeks for bonding. I think that’s very common and it’s a rare workplace where birth moms and dads get the exact same amount of leave. Academia is one notable exception and I do think that’s unfair.
Anonymous says
In academia the mom uses her leave to recover and care for the baby. Then the dad puts the baby in day care and uses his leave to write articles for tenure.
Anon says
I mean, life isn’t fair, and 3-month-olds can still be tough. Moms HAVE to take the initial weeks because we are healing and often establishing our milk supply; it seems like cutting your nose to spite your face to take an attitude of “I’m suffering, so should you” (if you both want to be home together, that’s a different story!)
Plus I’d much rather be the person sitting and nursing and watching TV with a newborn who can sleep all day than the person who has to get a 4-month-old on a schedule.
anon says
I’ve done both. Concurrently was super important for baby #1 as we both figured things out together.
Anonymous says
On both pregnancies DH took one week off after birth and then two weeks of part time (using vacation days), then the rest of his leave when I went back. Made it easier when I went back, plus financially we were better off doing that.
A big factor many people underestimate is how much time you will need to take off in the first year of childcare. Less of an issue if you have a nanny. But if using daycare, you can expect baby will be sick about once a month for the first year. Not having to use any leave for illnesses when I first went back (because DH was home), meant I had more leave left to use for that when he did go back. If you do nanny over daycare, whenever they start preschool it’s usually the same rate about one illness a month for the first year.
Mary Moo Cow says
For our first, I had unpaid leave (I had just started a new job and wasn’t eligible for paid leave yet.) DH was self-employed so he didn’t have paid leave. He took one week off totally, one week part time, and then went back to work (but worked fully from home). Then, when I went back after 8 weeks, he took a week, then part time for 2 weeks with help from grandparents before DD started daycare.
With our second, I had FMLA and paid leave, so I took the full 12 weeks. DH took the first 2 weeks off, then went back to work, and took a few weeks of part-time when I went back at 12 weeks and DD went to daycare.
Anon says
i just have to say that i am so glad that there are multiple people responding whose partners also have/had leave. DH had one week. I ended up in the hospital for two days prior to the birth and he was able to work from the hospital for those two days, but when he went back to work one of our daughters was still in the NICU (she was only there for 2 weeks fortunately). i was such a mess. it would’ve been amazing to have him home with me for the first month at least.
AwayEmily says
That sounds so incredibly difficult. Glad you are on the other side now <3
Anon says
My reply got eaten, but this was us. My husband’s leave was done before I was discharged from the hospital for a very routine birth. Neither of us knew anything about babies, so it would have been lovely to both be home, figuring it out together. Neither of us knew anything at all about babies (and none of our friends had babies yet), so we were going on basically one two hour hospital course that focused mainly on giving birth – not actually having a baby. He’d come home during week 2, and I’d be a weepy, miserable mess – still in my PJs, having not eaten anything all day, because we took the safe sleep stuff so literally. My mantra was “it’s safest to put baby on his back, in a cotton onesie, on a hard flat mattress,” but then would be all *shocked picachu face* when the baby NEVER SLEPT or stopped crying. My husband would have been such a lovely comforting presence to let me chill a bit, so I wish we could have done concurrent leave for #1.
Betsy says
I effectively had both scenarios. My husband was finishing out a contract and then staying home with our baby. He took two weeks off when the baby was born, worked for another 5 or 6 weeks, and was then home with me for the rest of my maternity leave, and is now a SAHD. Two weeks up front is key unless you have another family member staying with you to support you physically. I had a great birth, but even a great uncomplicated birth is a significant event that requires physical recovery time where someone else is making your meals and doing laundry and basic household maintenance. I did find it really hard when he went back to work after the two weeks were up. I had pretty bad baby blues, so it was emotionally overwhelming to be on my own. Plus I was still learning how to be a mom. On the bright side, being on my own during the work days really pushed me to get comfortable faster, and I developed really good routines that I think helped me get past the blues. It was wonderful once my husband finished his job and was staying home with us – truly the most lovely bonding time for all three of us. And then going back to work and leaving him home with the baby was a lot easier. I think every dad should have some solo parenting time like that. Even though we had been home together for a while, the nature of giving birth and breastfeeding makes it easy to fall into being the primary parent. Being home alone with the baby for full days meant that he developed his own way of doing things and his own instincts, and has put us back into good habits about sharing the load where possible.
You asked what was most common, though. My company offers 10 weeks of paternity leave for men, and from what I see it is most common for them to take the full leave right after the baby is born. I think their families are really missing out on the dad having some solo baby time! If that were my scenario, I still think it would have been important for my husband to have at least two weeks of leave once I went back to work.
GCA says
How lucky to have a choice! DH had 4 weeks of parental leave only with our second. (He was a grad student with our first, almost a decade ago, when grad student dads definitely did not get *anything*.) I really, really struggled with recovery and the newborn stage with kid 1, a colicky infant with jaundice who required additional care, doctor’s appointments, etc for the first six weeks. Learning from that experience, he took most of his parental leave concurrently with part of mine and we felt like we got a bit of a pleasant do-over. Lots of morning walks and lunch dates with the baby while the big kid was in daycare. Because it was our second kid, he was already fully competent at active parenting.
Anonymous says
To be fair, grad student moms don’t get leave either.
Anonymous says
For our first kid, my husband had 6 weeks paternity leave and spent 5 of them at home with me and the baby, then 1 week with the baby when I went back to work (at 18 weeks) — it happened to be the week of Thanksgiving anyway so his job was fine with it. We started off planning only 2 weeks for him at the beginning, but he discovered he’s really sensitive to lack of sleep and didn’t feel like he could return to work while we were still getting woken up every two hours.
For our second kid coming soon, DH does not have any paternity leave (different job) and is planning to take 2 weeks PTO at the start. After that we will likely be hiring a night nurse so we can get more sleep.
All of this is to say that we should all get more mandated parental leave! I’d say at least 6 weeks for dads/12 weeks for moms is important.
Anonymous says
My husband did not have paternity leave, but if he did I would have had him take it concurrently just so he wouldn’t have been able to say “you get up with the baby–I have to go to work in the morning.”
Spirograph says
Consecutively, although DH took a couple days off immediately after the babies were born. It delayed childcare expenses, and gave DH a chance to solo parent, which was very helpful in establishing his confidence and competence, and also a good balance between the two of us in caregiving. Highly recommend.
Cb says
Thanks for those who recommended Greeking Out. My son has listened to an absurd number of episodes over the last few days.
anon says
For #1, I had 14 weeks and DH had 4. He did 3 right out of the gate at birth, and saved one for the week I went back so I wasn’t going back to work and sending my baby to daycare on the same day. It worked well for us.
For #2, I had 16 weeks and DH had 12. We took them concurrently and it was great. Like, amazing. I suspect #2 is always going to be a little easier than #1 given it’s not all new, but I genuinely enjoyed my leave and it was 100% because I had him there with me and could really lean on him for the overnights and other things in a way I didn’t want to for #1 because he was back at work. My mental health was so much better through the first 12 months and I fully attribute it to having the help, and not feeling like I had to handle the load, particularly the overnight load, all by myself. [To be fair to DH, for #1 he was willing to help overnight even when he was back at work and I was still on leave but I had a bit of a martyr complex, I suppose, and didn’t want to do that to him knowing he still had to go to work and function whereas, in my mind, I framed it as I was “just at home.”]
Anon says
This is what we are planning to do and I think it will be the best choice for my mental health and his. We want to tackle those early weeks as a team and learn together. Of course you can also do that with a consecutive approach, but for us I think concurrent will be better.
Anonymous says
Martyring yourself on the nights can really be tough on mental health. We had the parent on leave get up M/T/W/TH nights and parent working outside the home get up F/S/S because then they just have Friday with a tough night and can nap on S or S if needed. I EBF on all the babies so DH would just bring them to me and I would nurse sidelying and go back to sleep after. Not having to even sit up mean it was easier for me to fall back asleep right away and I didn’t have to pump overnight to keep up my supply. He dealt with diaper changes/resettling. Whoever was ‘off’ slept with eye mask and earplugs.
Boston Legal Eagle says
Agree on sleep being a key component of mental health! I think the night splitting conversation is different than the leave conversation – if you’re doing it consecutively, you should still figure out how to split nights. Shouldn’t just default to whoever is at home.
AwayEmily says
YES agreed on figuring out the sleep thing ahead of time. With the third kid we ended up with a system where I would take the whole night (I slept in the guest room with the baby) and he’d get a good night’s sleep, and then he was primary caregiver during the day (and I would take lots of and lots of naps). That was my favorite approach. But there are lots of great options. With our first we failed to have a deliberate conversation about it and ended up having a lot of sleep-related arguments.
Anon says
+1 I have a 6 wk old and I handle the nights, then he gets up at 6ish and I sleep til 9/10 while he cares for all four kids. I think I get the better end of the deal, as my “awake time” is in a peaceful house with just a baby.
For the first month baby was not sleeping while put down at all and I’d nap in the evening then stay up until 4 or 5 am, and he’d take over and I’d sleep a long stretch. He’d greet me with a hungry baby and cup of coffee in bed at 9am and I felt very cared for. It doesn’t really seem practical to have him handle middle of the night when I still have to wake to feed anyway.
(And I am lucky he has generous leave. Not a big paid job, but one with a union!)
Anon says
The every other night thing wouldn’t have worked for us. We ended up splitting up each night with me sleeping early, him doing a pumped bottled around midnight and then going to bed, and then me doing the early wake up around 3-4 AM while he slept. This way we both got sufficient REM stretches each night and split the wake ups. It worked better for us, but there are many, many ways to slice the salami and they may change as your baby’s sleep evolves.
Anon says
Logistical question about this – how soon did you start pumping? We’d like to do split nights like that, but then I’m getting conflicting advice about pumping from the start vs. not interfering with EBF too soon. We’re also very open to combo feeding, though.
Anon says
My baby was readmitted into the NICU at 4 days old so I had to pump then. She was released within 36 hours, but I
we’d already done pumping and bottles so we weren’t afraid to use them as needed.
Pumping that early did result in me ending up with a pretty substantial oversupply, which was somewhat painful and sometimes made latching difficult. But also meant that I had enough supply that she never had formula, even after I went back to work and my supply dropped a bit. It wasn’t perfect, but not a disaster either.
Anon says
The issue is you’d still have to wake to pump at regular intervals, and that’s often more annoying than just breastfeeding. Going too long stretches can impact milk supply, and/or lead to mastitis (happened to me at 1.5 weeks pp and I’m pretty sure it’s because I had a couple quite long sleep stretches).
Anonymous says
I never had a problem with bottle confusion and I pumped overnight from the start, but babies may vary. My baby had a poor latch at first so I needed to nurse, then pump, then bottle feed in order to keep up supply until he got the hang of it.
Anona says
I started pumping in the first week so that my husband could give the 12pm bottle while I slept. I did not end up with an oversupply (was a “just enough” pumper until I got COVID when my baby was 11 months and my supply tanked). But I also added an extra pump in during the day instead of waking up to pump and replace the 3am feed I was sleeping through, so that might have been part of it.
Thread OP says
Clearly this was a nesting fail but following some of the narrative above about the risks of default parenting with concurrent leave…
We were on concurrent leave for #2 as I indicated and we were genuinely 50/50 parents. I went out to deliberately to leave him alone with the baby. He didn’t need any convincing – he’s an amazing partner – but I honestly did it for myself to make sure that I didn’t just fall in to defaulting because of said martyr syndrome mentioned above.
On the other hand, a good friend is on concurrent leave with her husband right now and he’s golfing daily, goes away with his buddies and I just…. cannot watch it. This is their third child so I guess it’s less scary than #1, but she’s home with three kids under 4 and no childcare for what feels like the whole summer (June 1 baby). It’s awful.
I think you and your partner have to be really intentional about the concurrent leave such that no one becomes a default, each of you taking time for yourself. But, and I swear this is true, my husband has “bonded” so well with the baby in a way that I can’t quite describe but is very different than he did with #1. I feel like he’s found a lot more enjoyment in the baby months with #2 than he did with #1 and I think it’s because he had all of this time with her, vs just me handing him a screaming baby when he got home at 6pm each night like definitely happened (a lot) with #1.
AITA? I-MIL-TA? says
My MIL firmly believes in strapping a baby into their stroller to roll around inside the house, especially when they are being fussy. This sounds bonkers to me, because I’ve always been taught comfort and closeness (ie, babywearing) or exploring and stimulation (ie, going outdoors, tummy time) are best for babies, especially when they fuss.
Where would you side? Is indoor stroller time more normal than I think?
Anon says
Neither of you is an “a-hole,” just different parenting preferences/styles, likely the first of many. Personally I can’t imagine pushing a stroller around inside my house just because of what it would do to my hardwood floors, but we did take our baby on stroller walks many times when she was fussy and it seemed to help, even when she was fully covered and couldn’t see the outdoors at all. There’s something about the motion that soothes them.
Cb says
My son would only sleep in the buggy or a sling. We’d get him to sleep and then roll him in the front door and let him sleep in the hall.
At nursery, one of the staff would take him with her to get her lunch and then leave him sleeping in the garden. Other kids would fall asleep in their prams with someone rocking it back and forth.
I’m in the UK and all kids were over 1, so this isn’t the regulatory scandal it would be in the US.
Anon says
My husband works a lot in Denmark and he said the moms put the kids to sleep in the prams and then leave the prams outside, because apparently it’s considered very important for the baby to sleep outside in the sunshine. You walk by cafes with sleeping babies in prams outside and moms inside having coffee and catching up. Most of the time I’m very happy with our life here in the US, warts of this country and all, but anecdotes like this make me really mourn the parallel life where we moved to Europe before having kids.
anon says
I head this book Happiest Kids in the World and it talked about how kids in the Netherlands sleep hours more than US kids and they also believe outdoor napping is excellent for the mind and body.
Boston Legal Eagle says
Apparently this was common in Russia too back in the 80s (according to my mom…) Baby asleep on the balcony while mom was inside.
Anonymous says
Sometimes I think I am secretly Scandinavian because my solution to everything is opening the windows or taking a walk. I think I spent my entire maternity leave pushing a stroller or walking around with the baby in a carrier.
Anon says
Yep, can confirm it was done in Russia in the late 1980s.
AwayEmily says
I haven’t done that but it seems fine to me. Honestly, whatever works.
Anonymous says
It does make sense to me in that babies are often soothed by motion. Depending on the weather maybe she feels like walking outside is too hot? My mom babywore me but wasn’t comfortable doing babywearing with grandkids as she was paranoid about falls and didn’t like to carry them for long periods of time.
FWIW, DH walked our babies to sleep for their naps around the neighborhood and then brought the stroller inside all the time so that might be impacting my view.
anon says
It would never occur to me to use a stroller indoors because my house isn’t that big, but we will put a fussy baby in a bouncer or swing, which is probably a more similar strategy to being in a moving stroller than either babywearing or tummy time.
Anoon says
Same, I was going to say that with our first, the nurse discharging us after birth told us her pro-tip was to strap the baby into their infant carseat and swing them to get them to settle. I did a lot of babywearing in the house, but would be totally fine with a carseat, stroller, etc. Motion really does calm them and they are safe and cozy in a carseat/stroller.
Cerulean says
Neither approach is necessarily better (my niece loved stroller naps, but my own kid was a Velcro baby and loved the carrier). You clearly have a preference and so does MIL. If she prefers to use the stroller method while she’s watching your baby, then I would let her try it out. If she’s trying to dictate what you do while taking care of the baby, then let her know that a carrier is what works best for you.
Anonymous says
Whatever works! My oldest wanted to be carried in football hold constantly and walked around and liked car rides. My second liked a stroller. My third was happy doing whatever. None of them liked being worn and would freak out being in a carrier except the one where they were front facing and only if we were out and about and they could check out the world.
Anonymous says
I never did this because our stroller wheels were gross and would have damaged my floors, but I think it’s a whatever works for your baby scenario, not a philosophical one? My baby went through a four-month phase of napping best in the stroller, during winter, and there were days I would have liked to do this rather than trudge outside in the snow!
Anon says
my parents did this living in an apartment building in nyc. they found it was easier to transfer me after
Red Shoes says
This is not a “TA” situation, or even close to it, other than to the extent judgmentalism is being injected into the conversation.
Whatever is actually working for the baby and the person caring for it is fine.
Anonymous says
There’s nothing wrong with indoor stroller time (I see it all the time in mg apartment building hall), some babies just really like sleeping in a stroller. And you sound super judgy like we aren’t not comforting and distant our kids just like the feel of a stroller? But ultimately why is this even an issue for you.
Anon says
we just found out our soon to be first graders’ teachers. i was surprised the kids didn’t ask about who might be in their class. they were just interested in the name of the teacher. their reaction was a big improvement from last year when one twin was hysterical that she had a ‘boy teacher’ (who ended up being fabulous). hoping this means they wont be too disappointed when some besties from last year aren’t in their class
Anon says
That’s funny! My first grader was the opposite – only cared about the names of kids in her class, not the teacher. I don’t think she even knew any of the first grade teachers by name before school started, although it was clear she recognized a few of them by sight. But she had her first day yesterday and loved her teacher. Hopefully you’ll have the same experience!
Anon says
Same, my kids don’t know that many of the teachers for the next grade up, but do care a lot about who their classmates are.
anon says
Mine were this way too. I cared way more who was in their class than they did. They made new friends and I think they only thing they were concerned about is that their teacher would be nice to them.
anon says
My 3rd grade son is petrified of public speaking. Anything that involves talking in front of the class or Lord help us, in front of the school like even a class choir performance. He won’t even do show n tell. He is outgoing and talkative, but quite rigid in his thinking (feels like there are expectations and follows them, doesn’t improv well). I think his basic fear is that he will be laughed at or embarrassed and he hates being embarrassed. Last year his PE class had to do a coordinated dance to Dynamite. He cried and cried about not going to school that day. In the end the performance was totally great. I think he had in his mind that the level of performance had to be like Olympic synchro level, but it’s a bunch of kids moving around on stage, no one was all that amazing but they were perfectly awesome for this age. He’s very self conscious. Any tips to help get him more comfortable?
Anon says
you could consider therapy, but what happened in class when it was his turn for show and tell? the teacher just let him not do it? i’d work with his teacher to create opportunities to have him participate in small groups, in class, etc. I have a kid who is fine with performing, but doesn’t like speaking and we really worked with her teacher last year
Anon says
YMMV, but I firmly believe frequent “performances” within supportive environments are very valuable. School will have some, but church or music recitals can add a lot more.
Anon says
Wow, all of this talk about leave really got me thinking about how we approach it in the USA vs. the rest of the world. In my parents’ country of origin, while there are not good leave policies like in much of Europe/Canada, it’s expected that the new mom has other family members around, outside of the husband, to help with recovery (including specific meals/foods that help recovery and nursing) and the baby. I feel like we’re one of the few places with both no culture around recovery for the birthing parent AND no culture of family leave.
Recovery for the is a huge thing, and I know for me, for both my kids, I had a really really tough time mentally (definitely PPA/D) and physically (for different reasons) despite relatively straightforward deliveries. For my first, even the thought of bundling up the baby in the stroller, taking the elevator to the ground floor of my building, and going outside for a walk was overwhelming.
OP says
*Recovery for the birthing parent – whoops!
Anon says
Agreed, although I know a decent number of Americans who had family visit and take care of them. My mom stayed with us for the first two weeks and between her help during the day and my husband being around evenings and weekends, I really didn’t do much except rest and recover for the first couple of weeks which helped a lot with mental health.
OP says
This kind of speaks to my original comment. In places where there’s a culture/tradition around recovery, 2 weeks is considered a drop in the bucket when it comes to supporting the mother/birthing parent. But in the U.S. with the demands on other family members (e.g. work, tending to other family members/spouses with medical needs) and no family leave, it’s often a best-case scenario.
Anon says
That’s fair. I do think for me personally even though two weeks sounds “short,” the difference between no help and two weeks of help was much bigger than between two weeks of help and a year of help, because the first two weeks was when I really needed someone. And there’s a trade-off for the help – neither my husband nor I wanted a parent or in-law living with us for months on end, even though I know that’s normal in many Asian cultures. So for us it really was the optimal amount of time taking into account both our postpartum needs and desire to not have a multi-generational household long term, but certainly every family is different.
Anon says
Yeah, sadly this is what happens in our culture that valorizes some medieval, saintly version of motherhood while giving women almost no practical support. It’s barbaric. I know women who won’t refer to their unpaid time off as “maternity leave” because it makes outsiders think it’s better than it is. They say “my unpaid leave” or “my disability leave” instead.
Boston Legal Eagle says
It’s all about independence, for better or for worse. The drawbacks of other cultures with highly involved family after leave (almost always women) is that they feel they have a say in parenting decisions. And it’s expected that it’s more of a group effort. Which is great when you all agree and can respect boundaries! But if not, there can be issues. Best of both worlds is grandparents who come in to help, but respect the parents’ decisions.
GCA says
I come from one of those cultures with highly involved family members for the postpartum period (Chinese), and yepppp the cost (also part of the benefit?) is that grandma, great-grandma, all the aunts, etc have a say in your parenting decisions! It’s really luck of the draw…
Anon says
I’ve heard that some women have been totally controlled in the postpartum phase by their mothers, MILs, and other female family members – “no, you can’t do that” or “you’re harming your baby” and worse just for expressing preferences or wanting something different. It’s not all sweetness and support, that’s for sure.
Anon says
Ooh this is a great point. Strong relationships have amazing benefits, but they are work. You can’t have your cake and eat it, too, etc. Here in America we want our autonomy…but the flip side of having the control is also having the responsibility.
Anonymous says
It’s not just a maternity leave difference. US is a large country where it is common to go out of state for college and many people move cities or states for work. Add in the distances involved and it’s more likely that families don’t live close to each other. Other countries are often either smaller or a greater tendency to live closer to family which facilitates visits to support new parents. European Union has some similar labor mobility, but language barriers still mean it’s more common for people to live closer to their parents and siblings who can provide support.
Anon says
+1 although even within the US there are big cultural differences about how much people move. I think at least 50% of the people I went to high school with in a small Midwest city currently live in the same zip code where they grew up, and probably 98 or 99% are within a ~4 hour drive. My BFF and I are the weirdos – she moved to Europe and I moved to the east coast and then the west coast before settling back in the Midwest but several states away. I believe moving long distances from home for college/career is correlated with higher income and education, and also seems to be more of a thing on the coasts than in the heartland.
busybee says
Life is a lot right now. My very strong willed 2 year old is in a full body cast for 7 weeks and likely won’t be walking again till November. She can hopefully get back to daycare next week but they may not be able to accommodate her. She doesn’t qualify for an aide there because she has no medical needs; she just can’t walk or sit. My husband and I both exhausted our FMLA for leave for our twins’ birth this year. Are there any programs or resources I’m not thinking of that could be helpful? I’d take a leave from work if I could but I don’t think that’s possible. I’m in the US.
Anon says
No ideas, but a big hug from this corner of the internet. Your poor toddler, and you! That is A LOT, and you’re still recovering from birthing twins.
If you have the resources, outsource everything you can – grocery delivery/meals, extra childcare at home, etc. I know that even if you have the money, the planning can be a lot, so maybe you and DH can divide and conquer. Good luck and keep us posted.
Anon says
Yikes, what happened? That sounds awful! Is it in the budget to hire a mother’s helper or similar? Or a nanny?
busybee says
Late diagnosed hip dysplasia necessitating pretty major surgery. And good point- I should have mentioned any budgetary constraints! I think we can throw money at things like grocery delivery but swinging a nanny probably isn’t feasible since we still have to pay for her daycare even if she’s not attending. Daycare for 3 kids ain’t cheap! We’ve thought of a mother’s helper to help out with the twins and I think that might be more doable for us, even if it’s just on weekends. Going to work on sourcing one.
Boston Legal Eagle says
Switch to nanny to take on all the kids seems like your best bet here. It doesn’t have to be permanent, but you’ve got a lot going on! The twins will probably get sick a lot throughout the first year, so maybe you can avoid some of that too.
Granted, you’ll have to find a very good nanny who can handle all of the various needs, which won’t be cheap.
Anon says
+1 on reducing illnesses. That’s huge. The nanny can also help with kid laundry, toy clean up, meal prep, etc. Plus you won’t have to get all three up and dressed and put the door each morning or deal with daycare pickup. Making the switch to a nanny saved me at least 1.5 hours a day in stressful kid transitions.
Anon says
One option may be to give up on daycare for now, give up your spots, and do a nanny for all three. Often it works out financially that a nanny is less than daycare by the time you get to three kids.
Anon says
Yeah, I would try to do this. And also, ask for some grace and flexibility from your and your husband’s bosses during this time. I would hope that any reasonable boss would allow you to work from home more or even slack off a little bit during this period.
I know you said taking a leave of absence may not be possible, but I would also fully explore that option.
Anoon says
What state are you in? If you haven’t already, you should call your local child care services agency (meaning the county or the state or whoever licenses child care). They may be able to point you to services that your particular day care is not aware of or does not provide. And if your daycare tells you they cant accommodate your child, definitely seek help from the licensing agency– the ADA and your state parallel likely apply and the daycare cant refuse to accommodate a child with a disability without demonstrating that it would be a threat to health and safety or that an accommodation would fundamentally alter the program.
Big hugs. This is a lot.
Anon says
all the hugs. this sounds like A LOT. not necessarily a permanent solution, but any family you could call in to help for a bit? friends? if i had a friend in this situation, i’d happily leave my own kids for a weekend to go help another friend. would a meal train help with meals portion of this? i’d be more than happy to bring a meal to a family i didnt even know well. this is very very much the time to lean on your village. i also know some people who’ve gotten lucky with bored retirees who are willing to help out for a nominal fee
Anon says
I don’t think daycare is realistic tbh. At least not for full-day care. I would either try to get a nanny for all three as others have suggested or try to take unpaid leave from work. I am sorry you’re dealing with this!
Red Shoes says
I would ask your and your husband’s employers what is possible before assuming no leave is possible — in situations like this, some employers will be OK giving a short term non-FMLA leave to a good employee. And agree with everyone else about pricing out a nanny; it may well be your cheapest option!
Anonymous says
Do you have space for an au pair? Could you have all 3 at home, use an au-pair and some unpaid leave from one or both of your workplaces.
Reach out to your village as well. I have zero interest in a childcare job but I work a 4 day week and if my friend needed me to do a day or half day of childcare on Fridays between now and November, I would step up. Similarly, you might have a friend whose recently retired parent is interested in a short term nanny job.
Anon says
You really can’t leave two infants and a 2 yo in a cast with an au pair. They’re untrained childcare and that’s far, far too much to expect.
— au pair host parent for the last 8 years
TheElms says
Big hugs to you. I would ask your employer if you could have 7 weeks of unpaid leave or however long until she can go back to daycare or to drop to a very part time schedule and work on daycare to take her for 3 hours a day so you could get some work done during that time. I know it seems like a huge ask but if you are a good employee with a good track record it will take longer than 7 weeks to replace you and get a new hire up to speed.
Anonymous says
I’m sorry, OP, our friends and their daughter went through this several years ago and it was rough on them even with a nanny and only a singleton infant! They did find a specially built desk that their daughter could sit in and play with stickers, color etc. Iirc, they got it from another child who’d recovered from hip dysplasia surgery; it’s worth checking listserv s, etc to see if there are any local families with tips, helpful items, or resources. FWIW their daughter is now in middle school and runs, dances, etc all with no issues, so the surgery was a total success.
I agree, I think you need to talk with your supervisors and ask for some temporary adjustments to your schedule and/or workloads. Possibly add a mother’s helper for a few hours a day…a late elementary / middle schooler won’t be able to do all the things for a child in a full body cast, but can at least sit with your daughter and keep her company. Boredom is going to be one of your biggest enemies. Good luck to you all!
How to talk to kids about therapy says
My 10 year old is going to start therapy for anxiety per her doctor’s recommendation. I need a suggested script for how to tell her. I dont want to give her the idea that there is anything “wrong” with her or exacerbate her anxiety by telling her she has anxiety and needs help managing her anxiety thereby triggering a new anxiety… It feels so fraught and I want her to go in with a positive idea of what it is. (Side note: do I have anxiety?? sad LOL.) Help?!
Anon says
“We go to see doctors to help us be healthy. This is a doctor that helps people manage stress and bad feelings so they can feel healthier. She’s going to have ideas for things we can do to manage our stress better.”
Anon says
ask the therapist what she recommends
Anonymous says
“We know that you are experiencing a lot of worries and stress. Moms and dads don’t always know different ways to help kids deal with that so we are going to have appointments with a therapist who will help you. Just like we have dentists who teach us how to take care of our teeth and eye doctors who teach us how to take care of our eyes, therapists help us learn how to take care of our minds.”
Assuming here that you have a dentist like ours who shows kids how to floss and an eye doctor who educates about distance for screens and taking breaks from screens.
Anon says
I think asking the therapist is a great idea. Otherwise, I probably wouldn’t label it as anxiety at the outset / give her a “diagnosis.” I would tell her that everyone needs help sometimes managing their feelings so they can be healthy and do what they want to do, and that her doctor has suggested she talk to another type of doctor who is an expert specifically about feelings and helping people feel their best.
anon says
Yeah, my nine year old sees a therapist and has never learned her diagnosis. Don’t know that you need to go there.
Anon says
Valid concerns, IMO. What about something like “this woman is going to listen to you and give you some advice on how to manage worries and stresses throughout the day?”
Red Shoes says
Agree with asking the therapist. If it were up to me, I’d just spin it as a cool thing she gets to do to help her transition to middle school and being a teenager, personally. Like music lessons, except for learning adulthood skills. I wish that’s how my parents had spun sending me to a therapist as an adolescent instead of making it a Big Thing.
Red Shoes says
And I think most of the other commenters here are suggesting way too serious of scripts for a 10 year old. You know your kid and you should defer to the therapist, but as a kid who was on the receiving end of this conversation, low stakes-ing this would be how I’d do it.
OP says
Thank you for this perspective.
Anonymous says
+1
Anon says
The same way we have teachers to help us learn facts and coaches to help us learn sports, we have therapists who help us learn how to manage our emotions.
Anonymous says
Yes you also seem like you could benefit from treating your anxiety
Anonymous says
“It’s good to have caring adults who will listen to you. Therapist X is another adult in your life that you can talk to.” I think I said something like this when I took my son to therapy.
Yes, you may need therapy too. When my son went, it unearthed some of my own anxieties.
Clementine says
One kid goes to behavioral therapy with the goal of emotional regulation. We framed it as ‘Dr Beloved Pediatrician was talking with us and we know you’ve been working a lot on regulation. She suggested you go meet with Therapist. The goal of you talking with Therapist is going to be to put more tools in your toolbox to help with regulation and help you have more great days at school.’
Also, this is the child who I tried to have a serious conversation about his ADHD diagnosis and gave me a whole explanation that it’s actually 80HD who is a robot in the dog man book series… It went fine.
Anonymous says
I wanted to use MyFitnessPal to track protein intake. I went to log in and it seems that it’s no longer a nice straightforward calorie and nutrient tracker–it’s asking me all sorts of questions so it can preset my goals instead of just letting me set my own the way it used to. Is there another free app or website where I can calculate and save the nutrition information for recipes and track food intake in a flexible, customizable way?