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Fallen says
Any advice for a 4 girl sleepover so that we all sleep? My daughter and her new group of friends have them what feels like every weekend and it’s my turn to host this Friday and I am dreading. 4th grade. She’s fine with just one friend but I am dreading 4. Regret agreeing to this!!
Anne-on says
We tell the kids ahead of time when we expect lights out to be (usually 9/9:30ish) and then go check on them shortly before we go to bed, they’ve all been conked out cold by 10pm at the latest. We put a noisemaker outside the door to help muffle the sounds of adults/pets in the morning and let them sleep in. We also assume everyone will be an overtired crabby mess the next day and plan for a chilled out day at home and an easy dinner. Sorry – I know our kid loves sleepovers too but I hate them for this reason!
Anom says
You are a sleepover wizard! I’ve never had a group of 4th graders down by 10!
Anne-on says
It helps that it’s an all boy sleepover and we typically have a big nerf gun war/basketball tournament/flashlight tag game outside first to tire them out. The desire to stay up for gossip/makeovers is also just not really there for them – once you remove devices they start to wind down naturally.
Anon says
My 4th grader is in a similar group. They tend to stay up until midnight and still get up around 7 or 8.
We usually let them start a movie around 9, which they half watch/ half talk through until 11. Then we have them get in sleeping bags with lights off but let them stay up talking as long as they are decently quiet, and if they’re still up at midnight we give them a “okay enough talking time for sleep” reminder. In the morning we keep it easy – usually my DH does pancakes or sometimes we do cinnamon rolls from a local bakery – and let them hang out until parents come pick up. We just make sure she has an hour of reading/ quiet time before an early bedtime.
All of the parents just explained to our girls that we’re happy they have such good friends, but if they are grumps the next day, or if they are disrepectful to one of the families and don’t let them sleep, the sleepovers will end. The girls are good kids and are pretty good about quieting down when we give them reminders, so it’s worked out well. They even do a good job of cleaning up before parents pick up, because they want to be able to do it again the next weekend. Good luck!
Anon says
They sound like a great crew!
Anonymous says
I mean…4 9/10 year old girls aren’t gonna sleep. Are you worried about your own sleep or theirs?
I would say for them, tell the lights out at, say, 10 then expect them to stay up 1-2 hours after. Tell them at 10 it’s bedtime, let them giggle and stay up late, then go down at 10:45 with a “now girls….” And again at 11:30 “for real! Bedtime!!”
I would take away all personal screens (if they have any) at 9. At 10:45 take the tv remote.
Separately, tell your daughter you expect her to take a nap the next day.
– mom of a 4th grade girl
Anon says
What are the most attractive play tents/forts? This is likely going to be a permanent fixture in my house so I’m hoping to find something I like, too.
Anonymous says
I like the pyramid-shaped canvas ones with wooden poles.
Anonymous says
We have a pop-up tent, cube, and tunnel that attach together. Love that they all fold up flat and can be stashed away when we need the space back.
Isabella says
LB is receiving one from Hearthsong for Christmas. It looks pretty cute, although I can’t speak to use over time.
Anon says
Anon for this.
I was on parenting leave and cut my planned leave short mostly because it had gone from ‘oh, work a little from home’ to ‘I’m in meetings for 6 hours a day and am just doing a bad job, plus using up all my sick and vacation time.’
I understand that I could have just said no, but I didn’t and I know why. Today though, I’m really sad that I didn’t get the break I got with my older kids. I wanted to just be able to go out for lunch with me and the baby… or do some crafting. Realistically, I did some errands and took care of the baby and will want sick and vacation time later.
anon says
I’m not an employment lawyer but if you were working on days off, you might be entitled to get them back. You shouldn’t be charged PTO for days you were working.
Anonymous says
Did you get special parental leave, or were you using sick days/vacation days for parental leave? I’m not an employment lawyer and I don’t know your situation, but I was told not to work at all during my parental leave, and if I did have to do a work thing, to tell HR so they could count it as working time rather than leave time. Hopefully you can get back the time that you were working and use it later at least.
Aside from that, I’m really sorry you didn’t get to have the leave you wanted.
Anon says
My job offers either unpaid time or you can use sick/vacation time to get paid. Government, fwiw.
I should have clarified – I wasn’t charging time for the time I worked; however, it was more so the ‘not being off but still taking time’ that made it not an actual break.
Anonymous says
Absolutely not. You are an adult it is time to advocate for yourself. At a minimum you are taking every day you took off as sick or vacation time and then worked back.
No says
What? You were in meetings while on leave? You need to get that leave back!
Anon says
Yeah this sounds illegal! My state government employer was very strict about me not working on leave. They weren’t even happy with me checking email.
anon says
Whoa, how in the world did this happen? That’s not even legal, if you were on FMLA.
Spirograph says
I’m sorry this happened and agree with everyone that you should get that time added back to your leave bank. Even if you “let” yourself get pulled back into working when you had leave scheduled, if you worked, you shouldn’t need to spend that leave.
In my company, you can take parental leave at any time during the first 12 months after birth or adoption. Maybe you can take a few more weeks at another time?
Anon says
Op here. Yeah, I know I’m a bad mom and generally suck for not being able to draw a clear boundary… but to clarify I didn’t charge time for the time which I was working.
I could have just said ‘don’t talk to me’ and they probably would have but I would be paying for it for months of nonstop cleanup work.
I am sad that I can’t take it back even though I know why I came back early. I took tomorrow off and am just going to allow myself to check out.
Anon says
Yikes you aren’t a bad mom and you don’t suck. It is what it is and totally fair to be sad about it. But you also need to figure out what’s going on with yourself and how to feel good about yourself in this new and different phase of life.
Anonymous says
It’s your job that’s bad for not respecting your time off, not you! We’re angry on your behalf, not at you. <3
Anonymous says
This. I have an employee out on leave right now and as far as I’m concerned, she doesn’t exist as a resource unless/until she contacts me or comes back to work. Earlier today, I got a maternity leave ooo message from someone who I was trying to contact about a compliance requirement and *my* response was to go back to the auditor and say, “so-and-so is on maternity leave, so we’ll have to exempt her.” I was livid to learn that some other dude apparently called her up after that and asked if she could please just do this little 5 min thing to check the box.
Anon says
Rule of thumb that has served me well – never work for free. You’ll get your groove back, but until you do, listen to the advice here!
H13 says
Recs for husky boys clothes in sizes 6/7? Having trouble finding non-jeans.
Anonymous says
Have you tried Walmart?
Anonymous says
Ugh this is tough – I don’t know why husky sizes don’t start until 8 or 10 at a lot of stores. The Children’s Place has a few options in husky sizes starting at 6-7; they are cut pretty generously IME. Clothes marketed as school uniform wear also tend to have really expansive size ranges – look for French Toast on Amazon if you need dress pants or shirts. I’ve actually never found jeans that my son likes but get most of his husky pants at Target (Cat and Jack khakis with elastic waist) or Old Navy (sweats). I think I was able to get away with sizing up in straight sizes when he was that age; you can always hem pants if they are too long but fit in the waist.
Anonymous says
PS – specifically, these are the pants we get every year – https://www.target.com/p/boys-stretch-straight-fit-pull-on-woven-pants-cat-jack/-/A-54549387
The jogger fit version has an elasticized cuff, which is useful to avoid hemming if they are a bit too long. https://www.target.com/p/boys-stretch-pull-on-jogger-fit-pants-cat-jack/-/A-54555133
H13 says
It’s really frustrating that they don’t start husky until the bigger sizes! Thanks to the suggestion above, I think I may have found some wide looking sweats at Walmart. I need to pull out his older brother’s larger sizes to see if it does the trick. They are just built so differently.
Anon says
I think Kohl’s house brands skews wide but I don’t know off the top of my head how it runs in size 6/7. Might be worth looking into, though.
H13 says
Any recs for 6/7 husky pants? Or brands that skew wide/large? I’m having a hard time finding non-jeans.
Anon says
Lands End used to have looser fitting pants that fit my husky child.
Boots says
We have good luck with Old Navy’s joggers and sweatpants. What jeans brands work for you? That’s been a big challenge for me to find!
H13 says
We just avoid jeans all together!
traveltime says
Traveling for the first time on a plane with 4 year old and almost 2 year old. Got both of them seats, 4 hour ride. Partner will be there too. Give me all the tips please.
Cb says
Ipad, kid’s headphones, and snacks!
Pogo says
+1 this. IME the 4yo will be fine, the almost 2yo will need more distractions, and you’ll need to change it up – like 20min tablet, 20min stickers/craft, 20 min snack, rotate.
Anonymous says
Reuseable sticker books, water wow marker coloring books, small snacks like Cheerios they can eat one at a time. Bring extra changes of clothes for everyone. Good luck!
Anonymous says
Don’t bring too much on the plane! All the snacks and treats are of no use if your bag is so crowded you can’t find anything. Arrive early at the airport.
Anonymous says
Disclaimer- this has worked well for us, YMMV. For boarding, I wait with kids and we board dead last. Partner boards at the regular time with the car seats and gate checked stroller and sets everything up/installed car seats. This way, while we wait for everyone to board, we get in one last potty trip/diaper change, fill up the water bottles. This way kids are strapped in their seats for an additional 30 minutes while they wait for everyone else to board.
Anon says
Same!
Anon says
extra diapers and wipes and changes of clothes in case of delays. consider putting 4 year old in a pullup. let 4 year old do screen time, but try to start with something else. we got my 4 year old twins one of those reusable color tablets which they loved. The almost 2 year old will be harder – at that age, looking at pictures/videos of themselves, reading books, moving things from one container to another (i asked the stewardess for two cups and my kid moved snacks back and forth),
octagon says
Small pack of post-it notes always bought us 30 minutes or more at that age, at least one for each kid. They can draw a small picture, then tear it off, make another. You can write one letter on each and rearrange on the tray table. Play games like tic tac toe. Etc.
Also, if you have the energy, wrap each activity in paper to make it feel fun and exciting (and to avoid any chance of them seeing what it is beforehand).
Anon says
An obscene amount of snacks. We flew during thanksgiving and the 2.5 year old ate an entire container of puffs before we were at cruising altitude.
He was mostly entertained by the seat back entertainment (delta) and we walked up and down the aisles a couple times.
Anon says
Minority opinion here, but I’ve traveled a lot with my kid including solo and never brought inflight entertainment other than a tablet and headphones and snacks. 4 year old should be a breeze. Almost 2 is a much tougher age for travel generally but we never found flights themselves that difficult. Screen time and people watching should be enough for a 4 hour flight.
Anon says
What we personally do is we get 2 seats in 2 rows, immediately in front/back of each other, and each parent gets assigned a kid for the flight basically including each parent having everything that one kid needs for entertainment and snacks in that parent’s own personal backpack/carry on. (But since we’re right in front/back of each other we can obviously pass stuff back and forth if needed). Might be too late for this seat configuration for you, but having the responsibility of the separate carry ons is nice because otherwise 2 iPads, 2 headphones, 2 water bottles, snacks, whatever me as an adult needs, etc etc for both kids is a lot for one adult to stuff in a backpack and under the seat.
Obviously whoever gets the 2 year old has the harder job, but you just switch on the way back.
Cb says
Reporting back on names from my son’s Scottish year group in case someone needs some Celtic inspiration: Orlaith, Isla, Merryn, Struan, Eilidh, Freya, Romilly, Eilish, Hamish, Callum, Mhairi, Archie (x2), Alfie (x2), Ailsa. Alongside an assortment of flower girl names (Poppy, Ivy, Holly) and old fashioned boy names (Teddy, Benji, Oscar).
I teach in Ireland, and before every semester, I have to watch Youtube videos of name pronunciation in preparation. So many vowels.
Anonymous says
Lovely this is exactly what I hoped for thank you!
Clementine says
Aiofe (pronounced Ee-fuh) was one that I had to google.
Cb says
I have multiple Aoifes in class and I think it’s really pretty. It must have been a trend amongst Catholic families in the early 00s. In NI, there are Protestant first names and Catholic first names, but I suspect the names will converge at some point, with trendy American names taking hold.
Anonymous says
I know an Eilidh! She is, of course, Scottish. I’m always tickled with 8 out of 10 Cats Does Countdown has Ainsling on and Jimmy calls her “Ashlynn.” I know that’s correct but I’m a phonetic reader. I’d never make it in the UK (or Europe).
Vicky Austin says
Haha we love Catsdown in my house here in the US!
Anon says
I’m OP from yesterday and my friend who has the new baby Alphonse is calling him Alphie (they’re not Scottish, but both European from different countries). Love the other names you included, although I need help on pronunciation too…
Cb says
I know a lot of cross-cultural Theodores because it works well in different languages. Meanwhile, my posh English in laws think my son’s name is “dreadfully American…”
anon says
I studied abroad in Ireland and love Irish names. Caoimhe is my favorite but I don’t want to set up a child for an (American) life of having to tell everyone how to pronounce her name. I also love Niamh but same problem. Plus, we aren’t super Irish and I feel like it would be weird to give our kids ethnic names when we are only like 20% that ethnicity. Alas.
anon says
I really struggle with pronouncing Irish names. How do you pronounce those? Not being snarky, I’m genuinely curious.
Anon says
Not Irish, but I believe it’s “Kee-vah” for the first and “Neeve” for the second.
Anonymous says
That’s how I feel about Roisin (Ro-sheen) and Grainne (grahn-ya)
Anon says
I’m reading a book (the first Stella Rimington spy novel, which I think you recommended on the main page Cb? It’s good!) and there’s a character named Peregrine. Made me think of birds, lol, but fits with the vaguely aristocratic name request.
Vicky Austin says
I really like Orla, but had never heard Orlaith before. Isla is cute too (and vaguely royal-adjacent!).
Anon says
I love Orla! I’ve never heard it before, but it is easy to pronounce and sounds so pretty. Orly is a hebrew name I know of some people with. There are some other pretty hebrew name as well – Leora, Talia,
Anonymous says
Since you watch Catsdown…have you seen Derry Girls? Orla is my favorite.
Vicky Austin says
It’s on my list, but not yet, no!
anon says
Orla McCool is the best.
anon says
A name I love but can’t use is Delphine. Would love to see it make a comeback.
Traveling mom says
I would love to hear the group’s thought processes in driving versus flying when going on trips with kids. My husband really loves to fly, but I feel like it’s often more hassle and expense than it’s worth, and doesn’t usually save much time in the long run. I’ve noticed that most families we know seem to drive, even those who are clearly better off financially. I grew up with lots of kids, far-away family, and little money, so we took long car trips frequently (with, my kids can hardly believe, no iPads at all!).
I’d like to travel to Orlando next year, which is about a 10 hour drive (plus stops) (we’ve flown before, which, when you consider getting to the airport in time, first leg, layover, second leg, getting bags, and transportation to the hotel, is usually still a full day commitment.) Kids are 10 and 7, very good travelers. Husband (for all his wonderful qualities) is a very bad passenger and does not like to let anyone else drive (which would actually work well, as I could work a full day from the car, but that’s harder when flying).
How do you guys decide how to travel, if you’re going somewhere that can be reached in a day-long drive?
Anon says
This is hypothetical because we haven’t done a long trip since Covid/our toddler was born, but unless something changes, we’ll fly. Reason: she gets carsick.
Anonymous says
Former carsick child here to note that we can also get motion sick on plane. Never on a train though.
Anon says
It’s worse in cars for a lot of people. It also tends to be messier in cars. Once your kid is old enough to use an air sickness bag (which my not especially coordinated kid mastered around age 4) it’s not that big a deal to throw up on a plane.
Anon says
I have a fairly strong stomach especially as an adult but as a kid I threw up on trains and in cars a few times. I’ve never vomited on a plane or boat. I don’t think there’s a one size fits all rule. It varies by person.
Pogo says
I’m Team Fly if the driving time is over 6 hours. That’s me personally, even before kids, I just don’t like being a car that long. You’re totally right though that the breakeven time can be a drive as long as 8-10 hours depending on how far you are from an airport on each side of the trip, if you can get a direct flight, if you need to rent a car at destination, etc. Really just a personal preference.
Anonymous says
This is our thought process as well. The other factors- what kind of place are we staying and how close is the nearest airport? For example, we live in Charlotte and, even though the outer banks are also in NC, it’s like a 6 hour trip and don’t stay in hotels there and there’s no convenient airport. So that’s a drive because we need more stuff (food) and no easy airport. I also have a “me” thing where if I drive it’s a “trip” and not a “vacation.” Driving is so much more work to me and no part of it is relaxing.
Anonymous says
We are kind of cheap but it depends on how much plane tickets cost, whether we will need to rent a car when we get there (and if so, how expensive rentals are), how much stuff we need to bring, and how hard it is to get from where we are flying into to our actual destination. E.g., we live in NYC but usually drive when we visit my parents’ house on the outer banks because it is 2+ hours from the nearest airport anyway, we want a car when we get there, and flights aren’t that cheap. Orlando I would probably fly to as it is a popular destination and I’m guessing flights and cars would be relatively inexpensive. But I also spent half my childhood driving up and down I-95 and am really over it.
Anonymous says
If cost isn’t a limiting factor I much prefer flying if it’s longer than 5 hours in the car. I would never drive 10 hours to Orlando when there are plenty of flights.
Anonymous says
The longest one day we do it about 8 hours. That’s for our annual trip to a national
Park where we want to bring bikes/outdoorsy stuff and drive a lot to differ t spots in the park. Usually broken up into about two 4 hour blocks with a solid lunch break in the middle. I might do 10 hours if it meant not having to rent a car. Would not do 10 hours do a vacay that is resort based.
Anon says
+1 this is how I feel exactly.
govtattymom says
We got to Disney most years and have alternated between driving and flying. We are also about 10 hours from Orlando. Although both driving and flying have pros and cons, I prefer flying, especially if you can get a decently-priced direct flight. It saves so much time even after factoring in time wasted in security, baggage claim, etc. If you take a morning flight you may even have time for a fun activity and dinner on your travel day. I hope you have a wonderful trip!
Anonymous says
We drive for anything under about 14 hours. There are very few direct flights out of our airport. We are often weighing a 12-hour drive against an 8-hour door-to-door trip flying, and when you factor in the stress and risk of delay flying usually doesn’t seem worth it. Now that renting a car has become more difficult and expensive, driving seems even more worthwhile than in the past unless we are going somewhere 100% walkable.
For some trips along the northern half of the I-95 corridor where we don’t need or want a car at the destination, we take Amtrak to avoid traffic and parking hassles.
Anonymous says
+1 to Amtrak, traveling by train is my favorite. I take it from DC to NYC frequently for work, and it’s so much better than flying or driving
Anon says
We normally fly. I only have one kid which may be a factor (flying isn’t as expensive as it is for a family of 5) but she’s always done better in planes than cars. In 2020 we did a long (~12 hour) drive to our winter vacation since none of us wanted to fly pre-vaccine, and then we repeated the drive in 2021 since we were returning to the same place and the drive had gone smoothly. But that’s the only time we’ve done a one way drive over about 4 hours with a kid.
That said, we live 2.5 hours from the airport we fly out of and often visit family who live at least an hour from an airport, so even plane trips involve a non-trivial amount of driving.
Anon says
We fly anywhere over around 5 hours drive. Driving is a hassle too. And honestly my time is super valuable – we both only have limited vacation time so even saving a few hours of travel time feels worth it to me.
Anon says
Agreed. I also do the majority of the driving by in our family, which adds to the “cost” when it comes to my time. Also in a car we find that one person (usually me) is driving and one person is on kid duty, so no one is really off, whereas on a plane we can trade who is on kid duty and the other person is genuinely off and can read a book or watch TV.
Anonymous says
We drive if it’s under 6 hours, otherwise fly. Even better if we can take the train! If we do fly, we try really hard to get direct flights — layovers are The Worst.
Spirograph says
It’s more art than science for me, but driving is our default. Growing up, my family of 5 drove everywhere except Hawaii, even if it took 2-3 days.
We generally plan our vacations places that are drive-able or that the flights are relatively inexpensive. Coming from DC area, we fly to visit TX family but drive to everyone else (8ish hours drive time for the farthest, which we prefer to split into 2 days with a motel stop). We haven’t taken the whole crew to FL, yet, but it would depend on how long we had for the trip. We flew there last time we went, but we had only one kid then and it’s a very different calculus with 3.
We drive if
1. travel time is less than one day
2. we need to bring a bunch of gear as long as the trip can still be done in 2 reasonable days of driving. We drove to Vermont from DC to go skiing, for example
3. flights are “too” expensive. I don’t have a hard and fast dollar amount for this, but 5x plane tickets can really add up
We fly if
1. We need to be somewhere far away for a short time (eg, weekend trip for a wedding or funeral)
2. The flight is direct and the cost seems worth it for the amount of time we save… factoring in getting to the airport early, renting a car at the destination if needed, etc etc.
My husband also doesn’t like to let me drive, and my kids are similar ages to yours and also very good travelers. I would not attempt to work a full day from the car, though!
anon for this says
I only have one child, and he does well in the car. He’s 7 now and pretty much plays on the ipad, but he was pretty good on road trips even as a toddler and preschooler. I enjoy road trips. DH, not so much. DH and I trade off driving pretty frequently, usually making at least a brief stop every 2 hours.
The decision to drive vs fly depends on how much time we save flying vs driving, the amount of time we have for our vacation, the economics of each, whether we need or want a car when we get to our destination, whether we can stop to see family or friends along the way, etc. Honestly, we can’t afford to fly too often, so I plan many trips based on what’s in a reasonable driving distance.
We also live about 10 hours from Orlando and travel there at least once a year to visit my parents. We drive if we’re staying a week and fly for a long weekend. If going to Disney, I prefer having a car, and my parents don’t have one large enough for all of us. We can leave around 6 am, “lose” an hour due to a time change, and still arrive in time for dinner.
Anon says
We fly almost everywhere. We do 6-8 plane trips as a family every year. We don’t have as much money as many people here and it’s a significant chunk of our disposable income but it’s worth it to me. I hate long drives. I would only consider driving somewhere if it took less than 6 hours to get there by car and there were no direct flights.
NYCer says
We almost always fly. But we live in NYC, so there are direct flights to many / most places. I have never enjoyed long drives, even pre kids.
Anonymous says
We almost always drive. We live in Texas though: driving hours to see friends or family is the norm here. We have three kids and two are toddlers. Our last flight neither toddler slept: they both screamed for four hours. I doubt we’ll make it to Hawaii before they’re 10. Anyway, my reasoning is similar to Spirograph’s:
1) DH likes driving, so he usually drives the whole time. My limit on driving is about 4 hours, which I can do by myself with 3 kids if I have to.
2) you can easily bring all your gear if you drive
3) it’s cheaper
4) I’ve never been stranded on the side of the road: I’ve had flight delays, flight cancellations, inability to land due to smoke, flight times moved, a plane malfunction that turned a 4 hour flight with a teething toddler into 12 hours…it’s just not worth the risk for me.
5) the dog prefers driving…because then he can come :) and I save money on boarding.
Anon says
We mainly drive unless it’s a short trip (like a weekend away for a wedding). The road trip is part of the vacation – we stop a lot along the way to is it new playgrounds, go hiking, eat special regional foods. This works well because I don’t mind driving, my husband loves both driving and trip research, we have two kids who are great in the car, and we’re fine with letting them have screens many hours a day (with car games, songs, dolls, and napping mixed in). I can usually get a few hours of work done so not a total PTO time suck. And it has made it possible to visit old friends spread across the country as we pass through their cities.
I enjoyed flying pre-kids, but now having to worry about delays/cancellations, car rental, lugging car seats around, etc feels pretty stressful compared to the flexibility of driving.
Preschool Mama says
My five-year-old preschooler attends full-day preschool at a prek-8 school and then an after-school program. He loves school, but frequently reports that some boys in his after-school program aren’t nice. Yesterday, he said a group of boys about his age designated him the “bad guy,” chased him, and shot him with pretend guns while saying “Let’s shoot him!”
My son was confused because our family has had conversations about guns and how they are not toys and we shouldn’t make jokes about shooting others, so he didn’t want to engage in this activity, but the kids wouldn’t leave him alone. He told me that two of the boys have done this before — the same two boys who he’s mentioned aren’t nice in the past.
I’m a school district administrator (different school system, older kids — I work at the district level, so not usually directly with kids), and my district has issues with kids making threats about weapons. We take these threats seriously, and involve the police, parents, etc. We also communicate with families/students about how it’s never appropriate to make jokes or threats about weapons. With older kids, it’s usually easy to discern when something is a threat.
I don’t consider what my son is reporting to be a “threat,” but it is concerning to me, but I don’t want to overreact. My 5-year-old is my oldest kid, and playing with pretend weapons isn’t a “thing” in our house, so I don’t know what is acceptable for this age group.
With all the school violence in 2022, do kids really still play with pretend weapons and use language like “I’m gonna shoot ya!” Where do you draw the line?
Anonymous says
My son went to the crunchiest, most progressive preschool ever in Brooklyn, run by a group of left-wing women, and even there, the teacher said they had given up trying to ban pretend shooting as it just never worked. Kids were encouraged to say “that’s not my style” (really) if they didn’t like pretend gun play; the teachers all would say that. (It was definitely not their style). For me, the issue would be your son didn’t want to do this and they didn’t listen to him, not that they were pretending to shoot each other, because they do grow out of that. They just want to chase each other. I would ask the teacher for help with the non-consent issue if your son can’t navigate this. It might be enough for him to suggest an alternate plan, like, I don’t want to play guns but we can use lasers to zap each other . Or I don’t want to play guns but let’s play tag.
Anon says
Yes, they do, and Nerf starts to get big around that age (maybe slightly later). My older boys are 7 and 5 and we as a family are very anti-gun (though we don’t perseverate so as not to make it a forbidden fruit; we state our point and move on). Still, there is lots of weapon play (with finger guns or foam swords) and good guy vs bad guy play scenarios that crop up.
Anon says
+1 I’m definitely not excusing what is going on with your son, you are getting some good suggestions as to how to handle that specifically….but fyi agreed nerf guns become a big thing soon for better or for worse, and therefore fighting the pretend gun thing in general would be an uphill battle. Even if you don’t have them at your house, they will be at play dates, birthday parties, you name it. (To other’s points though, you can try to establish ground rules).
NYCer says
+1. My bff has a son in Kindergarten, and from what she has told me, many kids from his class go to the playground after school and playing “bad guys” is one of their favorite activities.
Anon says
Same as above. My kids’ very liberal preschool even gave out a handout at the beginning of the year explaining that pretend play with “swords” or “guns” was developmentally appropriate, but they had two clear rules about it – 1. Couldn’t be directed at a person (like what is happening with your son), and 2. Everyone had to be okay with the game.
I would do two things – ask your school director to step in and implement the rules above for the whole school. Don’t target the kids (who will then target your kid). The director should explain to the whole class what the new rules are, and an agreed upon phrase if a kid doesn’t want to play the game. Our school also had some policy where the kid says no once, then can get a teacher to back them up.
I would also role play with your kid how to respond when he wants out or how to redirect the game appropriately. My kids loved role playing conversations at this age, and I swear they are better at tackling conflict than me from practicing these Conversations again and again.
Anonymous says
In public school I would teach my kid never ever to participate in these games at any age, simply because public schools are very bad at using common sense to differentiate real problems from imagined ones. I wouldn’t want my kid called into the counselor’s office because some other kids dragged him into a game of finger sh00ting, which would absolutely happen at our elementary school (and somehow my child would be the one blamed even if he was not the initiator of the game, while the other kids would get off scot-free).
Anonymous says
Yes. Kids do this. There’s zero reason why you couldn’t call after care and ask them to keep a closer eye but this isn’t unusual or uncommon.
Anon says
From an adult perspective (knowing about how real violence is these days), this behavior is disturbing, but from the kid perspective, they are just playing. It would be nice if they didn’t call your son the bad guy, but this is the type of imaginary worlds that kids create stories about (like every action movie ever). I think you are coming from a good place, but you should let it go.
Anon says
I have that kid. She’s a girl but mostly plays with boys and pretend shooting is big. I never ever thought we would allow her to have a toy gun but she got one with her allowance and she loves it and her friends love it and I’ve been surprised by how little it bothers me.
Pogo says
My son is also a young 5yo in after school with kids as old as probably 10 or 11, so the dynamic is there even if I have not heard complaints about being chased and called the bad guy. In my son’s case, I asked why he didn’t play in the gym and he said, “because I don’t know how to play basketball, so the big kids don’t want me in there”. Instead I tried to focus on what he DOES enjoy doing – building Legos or doing art projects. I also asked him about specific kids I know are closer to his age and in afterschool – his buddy who sits at his table, and several friends from his old school – and remind him that they don’t exclude him and are always happy to play with him. I try to focus on giving him the skills and confidence to be happy doing what he likes with the other little kids so he isn’t as bothered by the big kids.
Boots says
Someone here recommended Bogs as boots for my preschooler, suggesting that they might serve for both rain and snow. Can anyone shed any light on what style of Bogs would work (I see lots on their website, and the relevant child is growing out of toddler sizes—I think we’re going to need a 10 or 11). We’re in San Francisco so are looking for mostly rain use but will go up to Lake Tahoe several times a year and will also visit family in the (potentially) snowy East; I’d love to have one pair of boots we can use for everything.
Boots says
Sorry, should clarify: trips to Tahoe are wintertime trips during which the kid will play in the snow.
Anon2 says
We live in New England and get the rain boot style. Haven’t tried them in a super snowy area like Tahoe, but they work great for regular afternoons playing in the snow, or just cold/wet days. We do use wool socks if the kids will be out for a while.
Full disclosure: we switched to the Dicks Sporting Goods version a couple years ago and they seem just as good for half the price
TheElms says
The insulated rain boot in the kids size or the Toddler Rain boot (if size 10 still works)
DLC says
We have the Snow Shell Bogs for rain and snow – a little thicker than just the rainboots. In years past, I did do just the rain boots with wool socks underneath and it seemed fine.
Pogo says
We have the Bogs Bmoc for this purpose.
Anonymous says
FYI, Dick’s Sporting Goods makes a less expensive but adequate Bogs knock-off, which I learned about from this board.
Anonymous says
DSG Kids Snowbound Winter Boots
Anon says
We use the Baby Bogs all year round.
Anon says
i am probably going to make a lot of mistakes in this post, – yesterday one of my best friends told me that her daughter has decided to identify as a boy. my friend is trying to be very supportive of this – using the new pronouns, purchased the clothing her child wants, cutting child’s hair, etc. As I’m sure you can imagine, this is hard for my friend. One thing my friend is struggling with in particular is that a lot of the stories she hears, articles she reads, etc. about other kids who’ve transitioned is that they’ve often expressed that they feel like the wrong gender since they were very young, but my friend’s kid is 9 and has only expressed anything about this over the past 6ish months. I of course asked my friend how I can best support her, but if anyone has been through this and has any suggestions please let me know.
anon says
I think being a safe space for her to process her feelings is the best thing you can do. It sounds like your friend is supporting her kid, which is great, but I’m sure she is dealing with the grief of her child’s life being different from what she anticipated or expected. I really feel for parents in this situation. Our culture doesn’t give them much room to express doubts or sadness.
Anon says
Yeah I think being a safe space for her to express her feelings when they’re not ones she wants to air publicly is great. It’s ok for this to be difficult. And therapy could be really helpful too – not because she’s doing anything wrong but because she deserves a space where she and her feelings can be centered.
On the age, I would say that 9 is very young? I know we hear stories about 4-5 year olds expressing this too. But of course not every kid will know how to identify what their feeling AND how to express is to their parents when they’re a preschooler. That’s true of everything in their lives!
Pogo says
+1 to being a supportive safe space.
For anecdata, I have a friend whose child is trans, and was only like 6 or 7 when they made that declaration and changed clothes, hair, pronouns, etc. It’s been several years now and kiddo seems happy and well adjusted. It must be very hard to let go of what you imagined for that particular child’s life, but at the same time, you want your child to be happy and healthy and loved, whatever that means for them. I think just letting your friend be honest with you about this will help!
Spirograph says
+1 to this. I think being a non-judgemental listening ear and reassuring her that she’s doing the right thing in supporting her child’s identity is the best thing you can do. I have no first hand experience on this specific topic, but your disclaimer that you’re probably going to make a lot of mistakes in the post makes me want to remind everyone: if you’re coming from a place of love and acceptance, it’s always better to keep engaging even though you’re afraid you’ll say the wrong thing than it is to ghost because you’d so scared that you’ll say the wrong thing. It can feel really isolating when friends avoid ever talking about Major Thing because they don’t know what to say.
Anon says
Read Irreversible Damage by Abigail Shrier. If your friend would like help with specific resources, especially about the harms of puberty blockers, there is more and more data coming out all the time. Finland and the UK have (in the past six months) pulled back from allowing children to take puberty blockers for this purpose because of the harms to bone density and brain development and the experimental, untested nature.
Anon says
Omg what is with the TERFS here. Usually they stay on the main site. Go away.
Anon says
Not the previous poster but can we not with labeling everyone who has different views about this a TERF? I support the rights of trans people and fully support trans adults getting gender affirming care. I think it should be covered by health insurance the way other medical procedures are. But I don’t think it’s crazy to think that 9 year olds shouldn’t be doing irreversible things to their body. They’re children, and pretty young ones at that. And statistically there are a reasonable number of kids who question their gender identity at some point but don’t identify as trans as adults, so it’s not like this is some crazy fearmongering hypothetical that never happens in real life.
Anon says
Literally nobody has suggested this 9-year-old do anything surgical or medical and that’s why you’re getting called a TERF.
Anon says
OMG do not read this author. Also, the rest of your post is inaccurate. Read the information from reputable sources — the AAP is a good place to start. The rest of your post is alarmist and wrong for a 9 year old especially. Hormones/puberty blockers are years away from being part of the discussion. At 9 years old, the only thing you have to do is be supportive. Even if the child’s expression is “new,” you have no idea how long the child has felt this way.
I am the parent of a trans child, so I come at this with experience. Your job is to be supportive of her and her child, and not conditionally so. It is not your job to question “when” or “why” – just encourage her to be continually supportive of her kid, while you are continually supportive of her child.
OP says
thank you for this. I looked up that book and it sounds horrific. i will most certainly not be suggesting that to anyone. this friend is not local to me, so most of my support to my friend is via text/phone and I want to be a safe space for her to share how she is feeling. She and her husband are definitely trying to provide their child with unconditional support and are not questioning the when/why to their child, but was just something she shared with me that she is feeling.
Anon says
OP thank you for your immediate rejection of this author. Given how supportive you are, I will try to provide some additional information. I have so much to say, and I will try to answer concisely.
1) Your job is to tell your friend she’s doing great. She likely knows all the scary stuff already. You can encourage her to stay off the Internet (I’m currently not taking my own advice), but that in real life, people may have questions – but IME, people are kind.
3) Yes, as more people become aware of what being trans gender is, there will be more kids who perhaps go through stages where they “try” it out for a bit, then go back. That happens any time there is more exposure to something. For some kids, that may mean trying a different pronoun or dressing differently for a while, then going back. No long term effects, no damage done. No one — especially not doctors who are actually working with these kids — is suggesting that hormones be given to a little girl who wants to cut her hair or a boy who says in passing “Hey! Today I tried on a princess dress, so I must be a girl.”
For the folks who are truly trans, it’s wildly different. My child (trans female) drew herself as a girl from the time she was 3. All of her self portraits were of her as a girl — I have saved them all. When she played pretend, she was always a girl. All of her stuffed animals were girls. At 4 years old, she regularly told me she wanted to be a girl, and felt like a girl on the inside. Getting dressed starting at age 3.5 was nearly impossible for her. She is not trans because she wanted to play with dolls; she is trans because of who she is fundamentally (which was expressed before she even knew what being trans was – I don’t think she heard that word until she was 6 or 7).
Even with all this, she still didn’t transition socially until age 6. She has been monitored by doctors (therapists and an endocrinologist) for the last five years. None of these doctors would have prescribed anything to her without appropriate monitoring and risk assessment. She has never taken a drug or hormone but will when she is ready. I have read everything, and I know all the risks. For a child like mine, refusing her this care is more harmful than giving it. I don’t see it differently than giving her chemo to save her life. And, to the other commenter regarding the UK and Finland, which I will not directly address, she would qualify for hormones in each of these countries, hence the earlier statement that this poster is alarmist and wrong.
OP says
to the Anon at 12:27 – appreciate your response! I think part of what is hard for my friend is because her child is not like your child where they drew themselves as a different gender since a young age, etc. but this is a more recent thing over the past 5 ish months (or at least that is how long her child has verbalized it to her). That being said – my friend is supportive of her child, she has a therapist for herself, her child, her husband. So far the child has asked to change hair style, clothing and pronouns, (but not to change names) and to tell grandparents, all of which they have done. My friend is completely following her child’s lead on all of this. One thing my friend mentioned to me is that she has always thought of herself as a mom of two girls, and so this is obviously a switch for her. She is supposed to come visit me in a few months and I have two girly girls and I told her if it is too hard for her to come, I completely understand, though she says she still wants to. To any parents out there navigating these types of challenges, sending lots of hugs your way – it all sounds extremely challenging!
Anon says
I forgot my second point — the most important one!
2) My kid is trans, and is absolutely and wholly thriving. Not just surviving, not someone who is rejected by other kids, but a happy, healthy, and amazingly awesome person. She is confident, and she really is excelling. Before she transitioned, it was clear she felt out of place in her skin – and spent more time focused on this body/person that felt completely wrong to her. Now, she is active, engaged in school, and able to just be a kid. If we had not let her transition socially, she would be a ball of mental health issues. Once we let her transition, it was like all these other issues disappeared, and she could just focus on growing up – not like she was an outsider watching her life go by. I firmly believe we saved her life by letting her transition. Most people do not know she is trans, and that is by design. This thread reminds me of how much ignorance there is about the issue, and possibly I would have felt the same way if I didn’t have a front row seat to watching her grow up. But I am happy to be several years ahead of your friend, and can say with confidence that it was really scary at the beginning, but I’m grateful we trusted our guts (not listening to the fear mongering) and did what was best for our child and family.
Anon says
It sounds like she’s doing all the right things, as are you by being supportive! Regardless of what happens to her child longterm, that sadness is part of raising a child, I think. We all have visions of what our children might be, and whenever they deviate from our expectations, it’s hard. I have a lot of feelings on this topic, but am not going to post here, as it feels like the wrong venue right now. I will just say you are a good friend to listen to her, and she’s a good parent for separating what is hard for her from what is best for her kid.
anonM says
To anon with a trans child that they are supporting and championing – thank you! I was able to learn a lot from my sister’s ex who is trans and also exceptional at explaining trans issues, as he did training on related topics professionally. The main thing I learned from him parenting-wise was that parents that do what you are, are setting their kids up for success. Kudos to you and hope you aren’t left from this thread just focusing on some of these weird AF comments. Your kiddo sounds amazing.
Anon says
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/11/14/health/puberty-blockers-transgender.html
Took the New York Times a long time to run this piece, but it’s out there now. We’re witnessing a scandal of epic proportions. I would never in a million years allow my child to disrupt her natural bone, brain, and bodily development because her interests and personality do not align with sex-based stereotypes.
OP, do your research. That’s how you can help your friend. Don’t take my word for it, or anyone else’s – seek answers for yourself.
anon says
Yikes, I commented above about parents needing support, but this book sounds pretty awful!
Anonymous says
I hope your friend can avoid the dogmatic hysteria of the posts here. It’s not helpful to anyone. There is indeed evidence around hormones and bone density. The fact that that data exists should not be an attack, in and of itself. I’m not familiar with that author, but I am very familiar with the way that certain voices seem to feel empowered to silence any discussion around trans medical interventions, etc etc. Just read the tweets posted in response to articles like this one: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/11/14/health/puberty-blockers-transgender.html.
I’m sorry your friend is going to have to deal with a climate in which questions are shamed. Btw, the AAP statements are well-intentioned, but are based on advocates’ views, not science.
Anon says
+1. The AAP and similar organizations have long misinterpreted scientific evidence. When the same drug that is used to chemically castrate sex offenders is prescribed to children as young as 8 for long-term use, parents SHOULD ask questions. That’s part of their job to protect their children from harm. These drugs have not been studied in high-quality trials in this population and are not approved to block puberty. They are only approved for chemical castration, to treat some types of prostate cancer in older men, and to stop precocious puberty in rare cases for short-term use.
Anon says
They’re used to treat precocious puberty all the time you creepy weirdo.
Anon says
+1 to the commenter at 1:09PM. There is so much wrong with this statement, it’s not worth deconstructing.
Anon says
What’s creepier – setting nine-year-olds on the path to sterility and osteoporosis when they’re still 11 years away from being allowed to get a tattoo, or calling for caution before treating non-stereotypical behavior with hormones and surgery? I’m so glad I was allowed to be a tomboy and that no one ever suggested that my preference for playing sports and wearing jeans and being respected as a human meant I “wasn’t actually a girl.” What a regressive way to live.
Anon says
The creepy thing is obsessing over other people’s kid’s genitals and pretending it’s “concern.” Nobody has suggested any medical intervention here. And the idea that it’s about what toys and games kids like to play is beyond insulting and reductive. If you don’t have an intrinsic sense of gender identity that’s fine. Lots of people do. Including me – I’m a cis woman but there’s no doubt in my mind that it has nothing to do with whether I liked “girl” things as a kid. Often I preferred the “boy” things. There’s still never been any doubt in my mind I’m a woman.
Anon says
Good lord, no one is suggesting that a tomboy take hormones. As a person with actual firsthand knowledge of these issues, there is no reputable doctor who would prescribe any medical treatment in any of the circumstances that have been described. These comments are pedantic, reductive, and unhelpful.
Anon says
Anon @ 1:36 – I really, really appreciate your comment. Thank you for saying it so well. I’m the mom of the trans kid, and am probably going to step away from this thread as it’s making me want to bang my forehead onto the keyboard, but wanted you to know that I really appreciate your words here.
Anon says
You don’t sound dissimilar from the other poster, and all of these posts about hormones are frankly inapposite for the OP — who is just asking how she can support her friend. Short answer – it’s a tough thing to grapple with hypothetically, but in real life, it usually works out just fine if the parents are supportive. Tell her to try not to listen to the noise out there in the media and on chat rooms right now, and just love her kid. As with most things, the real world is less scary than how it is portrayed in the media.
Also, no one actually going through this process is being shamed for asking questions. As noted above, for those people for whom this treatment is really needed, there is ample informed consent, with a lot more detail than you can get from any news article.
OP says
I am the OP and I would like to shut down this conversation. I asked for how to support my friend and appreciate those who offered productive responses. At no point has she asked me or mentioned anything about hormone therapy for her child, and I am not a medical professional, and I most certainly do not plan on supporting her by sharing unsolicited information about topics that she has not even mentioned because I do not think I would find that helpful if I were in her shoes.
Anon says
You said this is hard for your friend and that she is struggling. If you want to help, listen to her concerns and don’t dismiss them as “bigoted” or “TERFy” or anything else. You don’t have to offer advice if you don’t want to, but far too many parents going through this feel totally silenced whenever they try to raise reasonable concerns. You can be there for your friend.
Anonymous says
Is it all at once? A child in my kids’ school / a neighbor friend has gradually moved from typical girl clothes & hair to very “boy” hair and clothes. It was sort of a slow process- first not wearing dresses, then “ew, yuck”-ing girl clothes, and eventually opting into a more hybrid outfit for swim team (she wears boys jammers + a rash guard in the team colors). I do think the big change was her hair, which went from “typical girl hair” to pulled back all the time to now a sort of shaggy boy style ‘do. She has not changed pronouns at all- and probably won’t. In terms of practical advise, there are so many gender neutral clothing lines now, which I’ve learned about from this child’s mom who finds it harder and harder to fit her in clothes she likes as she starts puberty at age 10. H&M, Gap, Old Navy & Target all have stuff that is just plain clothing- not girl-y or boy-y.
On balance, my 1st grader has a child that was born female but has apparently opted into boy stuff since he had the option. His birth name is a female one, but he goes by a boys name and uses male pronouns at school. He uses the single bathroom at school, not the boys or girls room. Oddly, his birth name is what’s in the yearbook and online directory, which confuses the heck out of everyone that knows him by “Matthew.” Also confusing is that plays on girls sports teams in town, which is confusing for my kids because they call him “he” and “Matthew
and generally accept/categorize him as a boy and have trouble at their age (6) understanding why he’s on a girl’s team. FWIW it’s just that it’s confusing, not that they care. I think this stuff can be confusing for everyone, so just be kind. We have had to have some talks about the difference between “wanting to dress in clothes that boys might also wear” and “being a boy” and “having male parts” and “feeling like a boy today vs forever”. I have 3 girls and one will often declare they want to be a boy after having to wait in a long bathroom line, for example.
Anon says
OP, based on the questions you are asking and how you responded to some challenging moments on this thread, you’re doing great – your friend and this kid are lucky to have you. Keep it up. I have a number of trans and non-binary friends and relatives. Some have always expressed it like drawing self as a particular gender or saying they were a particular gender but that’s not the case for everyone. I’d encourage you to get to know as many adults as you can across the gender spectrum – seek out affirming spaces so you can learn and get exposure. When people can be honest about their gender identity and supported in it, it can be life-saving, so this really is a blessing, even as it comes with new challenges.
Anon says
My 5 year old did dance this fall and enjoyed it. It’s the first time she’s ever stuck with any activity. She said she wants to sign up for dance again in the spring, but the big spring recital is the day we leave for vacation so unless we change our travel plans she’ll miss the recital. She says she’s ok with this, but I know that her saying this now doesn’t mean she’ll actually be ok with it when May rolls around. Would you sign her up knowing she can’t attend the recital? Or should I just tell her we’ll do dance another time?
anon says
Skip the recital.
Also, if you want dance to be a serious endeavor, find a studio that does not do recitals. True ballet schools that teach classical ballet don’t do recitals or competitions or have “dance teams”
Spirograph says
I disagree with your second sentence. My daughter really liked her dance class last year, which did have a recital. That was her favorite part — she liked the costume and makeup and having a chance to be on stage and show off with her friends. It’s a serious school once you get to the “academy” program later in elementary school, but there’s a (very long, 3-part) all-school spring recital with each class ages 5 and up doing one piece. This year she’s in a different program that is a more-serious school and the little kids classes don’t have any performance opportunities. I was surprised at this, I had kind of assumed they’d at least be mice in The Nutcracker or something, but no. Daughter still likes dance, but she misses the performance prep and has said many times that this class isn’t as fun. It’s more important to me that she enjoys her activities than that they become a “serious endeavor” at this age. We’ll see how she feels by summer and which school (if any) she wants to do next year.
Anonymous says
I mostly agree, bur professional ballet school does have one performance in the spring for the older classes and has an optional ensemble that performs at community events for outreach purposes. And then, of course, there is Nutcracker.
Anon says
Lots of ballet studios here have recitals. There’s also nothing wrong with doing dance that isn’t serious classical ballet! Becoming a professional ballerina isn’t all that great of a job anyway.
Anon says
Yes all our 5-year-olds must be engaged in Serious Endeavors which can never be ruined by such frivolities like showing off what they’ve learned to their families.
Anonymous says
The thing is that a serious ballet school is usually going to be much more fun, and surprisingly more low-key, than a competition studio. At our school, affiliated with our city’s professional company, even the littlest ones get a live pianist instead of recorded music. They do fun stuff with props and scarves and hats and have a parent observation day at the end of each semester to show off what they’ve learned. The older ones do a show every year that takes up one weekend, for which they wear their class uniforms with accessories provided by the school. The only high-pressure thing is Nutcracker, and you can opt out of that. They learn much stronger basics and are set up for a lifetime of enjoying dance without the crazy toxicity of competition dance. There are no costumes, makeup, or endless weekends of competition. When they get to high school they can choose between “I want to do this at a high level for enjoyment” and the “I want to be a professional dancer” tracks. Many continue to take adult classes throughout college and afterwards.
Anonymous says
Adding: I took dance at one of those storefront studios as a kid and was incredibly bored and frustrated by the fact that for half the year we spent all our time rehearsing for the recital. That kind of thing does not happen at a serious school, where kids get to do the real work and learn every class.
Anon says
Ok but that’s not “no recitals.” Just because they don’t call it a recital doesn’t mean it isn’t one. A competition studio is a whole different thing.
Anon says
Eh, that is coming off as a bit snobby. Studios that aren’t serious business professional ballet schools can still be fun without being toxic Dance Moms wannabees. There’s nothing wrong with a child taking a hip hop class or tap, jazz, etc. There are also many wonderful ballet instructors that teach at all kinds of studios. Misty Copeland took classes at the Y just like the Ops’ daughter.
Anon says
Also, it’s ok for kids to dance casually in elementary school? Plenty of kids don’t want it to be a high level activity later.
Anon says
Op here – my kid is barely 5 and not even in kindergarten yet. I do not expect her to be dancing seriously in high school, let alone a pro ballerina. My #1 goal is her having fun and secondary goals are having her move her body and develop social-emotional skills. The Y dance classes are very low key and perfect for what we want. The pre-K class is called ‘fusion’ dance but seems to involve a lot of running, jumping, twirling and falling on the floor laughing, which I’m pretty sure is what my kid likes about it. I can’t imagine my particular kid doing actual ballet where you spend the whole time at the barre practicing the feet positions, at least not at this age. She is waaaay too active and silly to do that right now. And like I said our real ballet school doesn’t accept children until they’re 8 anyway (probably because they know many 5 year olds would find it really boring?)
Anon says
Very true
Spirograph says
I probably wouldn’t sign her up, or would look for another class/school where you don’t have a conflict with the performance. My daughter’s dance class last year had a lot of recital prep beginning in mid-February … like a good chunk of the lesson time was just learning and practicing the recital dance. I guess they could still teach her the choreography and assign her to stand in a spot where the fact that she’s not there won’t matter, but you definitely should let the teacher know up front.
Anonymous says
Could you put her in a different dance school with a different recital date?
My kids all dance and the recital is a big focus of the spring. If it were fall I’d say it’s fine but so much of spring is recital prep.
Anon says
I’d sign her up – she’ll still have fun. Plus 5 is when “real dance” instruction starts (I mean they’re still 5, but…) so while she could def start at 6 if she does she might need to catch up a little.
DLC says
I’d vote to sign her up. I think it’s a good way for her to see that what matters is not the recital but her own personal enjoyment of dancing. Activities don’t have to be about results or an end product or competing in a big meet/game, and actually it may serve her better in the end to be able to take part in something with no endpoint. (I was reading something lately about telic vs. atelic activities and the meaning of life recently and it really stuck with me….)
Anon says
Thanks all. I think the main reason she’s had such a good experience is that she loves the teacher here, so I’m not sure I want to move. This is also a really low pressure environment (the Y) where the focus is on fun and fitness above beauty and perfection, and I am personally not very enthusiastic about moving to a competition studio where makeup, etc. is required. I would do it if she were begging for it, but she’s not, so I’d rather avoid it for now. I also think the recitals in our small town all tend to be the same weekend or thereabouts, so it’s pretty likely we’d have a conflict with other studios. Our town’s only “real” ballet school doesn’t take children under 8, so that’s not an option for several more years. I’m not sure ballet is her thing anyway.
I will definitely tell the teacher up front!
Anon says
I wouldn’t do a spring class where she’s going to miss the recital because at that age they’ll be super focused on it for weeks – a lot of class will be rehearsing for it.
I also disagree that serious dance schools don’t have recitals. My daughter’s in a pre-professional dance class and they call it the “spring showcase” but… it’s still a recital!
Anonymous says
They don’t spend most of every class for months on end rehearsing for the spring showcase, though, do they? And does pre-ballet participate in the showcase? There is plenty of educational value to older kids’ preparation for and participation in a performance, but for 5-year-olds recital preparation takes an inordinate amount of time and has virtually no benefit other than getting parents to ooh and aah and shell out for the next session of class.
Anonymous says
I would move the vacation a day. It’s months away.
Anon says
I did look into it but it would cost quite a bit of money to shorten the trip by one day. Plane ticket prices have gone up a lot in the last few months. Summer is already too booked up to just find a different week.
Anonymous says
With the additional information that this is a Y class and not a competition studio, that’s what I’d do too. If it were a competition studio I’d go somewhere else–like the Y.
Isabella says
I just found out I lost my Thanksgiving holiday pay because I took an unpaid sick day on Wednesday. The money isn’t an emergency, thankfully, but I am just kicking myself because I knew the policy, I knew I didn’t have any PTO accrued, and I wasn’t that sick! It seemed like a good idea at the time to rest up and de-stress before dealing with my inlaws, but ugh!
Anon says
that is a silly policy.
Anonymous says
Yep. And one I was also subject to at my last job. I’m sorry OP. Maybe frame it as the stress management was worth the pay cut?
Isabella says
Yeah, I’m trying to reframe my thinking. I’m de facto part time anyway at this point, because of daycare germs. I’m working for the sake of future earnings, which is important but not necessarily satisfying.
Anonymous says
It is important and I’m proud of you for playing the long game. I didn’t pick up another contract when my twins were born and they’re 22 months now. I’m trying to find new employment and it’s challenging. It’s all hard: staying, leaving, all of it. I hope you find some peace and rest soon!
Listeria Hysteria says
Does anyone know how common it is to have food poisoning and have listeria be the source?
I’m pregnant and had three bouts of food poisoning last month: two separate instances caused by lettuce, and one instance caused by me not realizing our garage freezer had broken down and heating a meal from there. I’m mostly recovered back to my usual pregnancy-nauseous self, but over Thanksgiving my MIL kept telling me that I needed to go to the doctor and get antibiotics to prevent possible listeria from hurting my baby.
Yes, I contacted my OB. They told me to contact my PCP (primary doctor). My PCP’s nurse took days to respond and today told me to book an appointment. The next available appointment is 3 weeks out, and I don’t want to go to Immediate Care unless necessary.
Ugh. I just want to know. Should I be worried? Or is my MIL just making me paranoid?!
Anon says
Listeria is super rare. Most food poisoning is salmonella, e. coli or a virus like norovirus. I wouldn’t worry. Urgent care won’t be able to do anything except tell you to follow up with a PCP, and you just risk picking up a respiratory virus like flu, Covid or RSV there.
OP says
Exactly! There is sooo much flu/COVID/RSV circulating in my area (and everywhere!), and I want to avoid going anywhere near it!!
CCLA says
If you just want to know, I’d push OB office for a blood test (or if they won’t support that, understand why). I’ll drop a link to ACOG’s guidance below. They note that OB may suggest a blood test and then antibiotics. I will say my recollection is that it is indeed super rare, so this isn’t meant to be alarmist, but to note that there does appear to be some official guidance on point that I’d want followed were I you.
CCLA says
https://www.acog.org/womens-health/faqs/listeria-and-pregnancy
OP says
Thank you for the link. I think I’ll follow up with my OB now with the link to see if they’d recommend a blood test. My guess is that they’ll tell me to bring it up at my next prenatal appointment, which is Dec. 10.
Anon says
I think you should be worried that your PCP is not capable of doing sick visits. I’d be looking for a new provider.
OP says
I’m thinking about it, even though I really like my PCP. My PCP belongs to a large medical group in Chicagoland that changed ownership and its name in the last year. Ever since then, I cannot get in to see my PCP or my children’s main two pediatricians for sick visits. There are sometimes other doctors with available appointments, but it’s always a random assortment of doctors I don’t know and don’t have a long-established relationship with, and often at different locations.
Anonymous says
Do you have any kind of nurse advice line you can call or can you email your doctor? Our system has both available and they are godsends.