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I have zero desire to purchase or wear any sort of heel nowadays. Maybeeee I’d consider a block-heeled sandal, but the days of wearing uncomfortable shoes are now firmly behind me. I’ve always been tempted by Cole Haan’s Oxford shoes and hybrid sneaker/office shoes, and now may be the time to grab them.
I like this version because it has laces (always a bonus for someone with a narrow foot), a black sole (better to disguise a sneaker as a dress shoe), and an almond-shaped toe. I also like the gold on the toe to further dress it up a bit.
The shoe is $89.97 at Nordstrom Rack. Grand Ambition Oxford
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Sales of note for 3.28.24
(See all of the latest workwear sales at Corporette!)
- Ann Taylor – Up to 40% off your full-price purchase; extra 50% off sale
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- J.Crew – 50% off select styles
- Lands’ End – 10% off your order
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- Nordstrom: Give $150 in gift cards, earn a $25 promo card (ends 3/31)
- Talbots – 40% off 1 item; 25% off everything else
- Zappos – 37,000+ women’s sale items! (check out these reader-favorite workwear brands on sale, and some of our favorite kids’ shoe brands on sale)
Kid/Family Sales
- Carter’s – 50% off entire site
- Hanna Andersson – 30% off all swim; up to 30% off HannaJams
- J.Crew Crewcuts – 40% off sitewide; 50% off select swim; 50% off kids’ styles
- Old Navy – 50% off Easter deals
- Target – 20% off Easter styles for all; up to 30% off kitchen & dining; BOGO 50% off shoes & slippers for the family;
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And — here are some of our latest threadjacks of interest – working mom questions asked by the commenters!
- If you’re a working parent of an infant with low sleep needs, how do you function at work when you’re in the throes of baby’s sleep regression?
- Should I cut my childcare down to 12 hours a month if I work from home?
- Will my baby have speech delays if we raise her bilingual?
- Has anyone given birth in a teaching hospital?
- My child eats everything, and my friends’ kids do not – how should I handle? In general, what is the best way to handle when your child has some skill/ability and your friend’s child doesn’t have that skill/ability?
- ADHD moms, give me your tips to help with things like behavior in the classroom, attention to detail, etc?
- I think I suffer from mom rage…
- My husband and kids are gone this weekend – how should I enjoy my free time?
- I’m struggling to be compassionate with a SAHM friend who complains she doesn’t have enough hours of childcare.
- If you exclusively formula fed, what tips do you have for in the hospital and coming home?
- Could I take my 4-yo and 8-yo on a 7-8 day trip to Paris, Lyon, and Madrid?
Interview while on mat leave says
I’ve been networking with a former colleague and friend the past couple of months about a potential opening at his organization. They have my resume, and he has vouched for me.
Of course timing had to work out where they emailed me to set up a screening interview mere days after I gave birth. My former colleague texted saying I should have received an email from so and so to set up an interview. I responded letting him know I had just given birth and would get back to the interviewer, but it has continuously slipped from the priority list with all the newborn chaos.
It’s been a little over a week now, and I have got to send a response today. Is there any way to even salvage my very delayed response? Should I mention that I just had my baby (which they likely already know from my friend)?
For some context, I’m pretty happy in my current role, but started networking over lay-off concerns which are still possible but a lot less likely than 3 months ago. Though the new org is remote now, they are located In a different city that could force me to relocate eventually and I don’t want to.
TLDR, I’ve been a crappy candidate so far due to new baby for a job I don’t necessarily want, but that company is doing really well compared to my current employer. Should I and can I even salvage this? Don’t want to burn any bridges especially with my former colleague who vouched for me.
Anonymous says
Just respond! No need for all this dithering! “Hi Susan, thanks for your email (which I’m just now getting to after giving birth last week!) would love to set up an interview blah blah blah.
Pogo says
Yeah, I wouldn’t worry about it at all. I’m sure you’re not the flakiest candidate they’ve ever had.
And go for it if you have a gut feeling that current employer is not well positioned for the rest of the pandemic and recovery. Always better to job hunt on your own terms. Might as well see if you get an offer and evaluate it. On the ‘needing to move’ part – I’d also put that out of your mind for now. My company has traditionally been VERY anti-remote work and if you want to climb the ladder you need to put in your time at specific locations. While I see them still being rigid on this if you are looking to be VP or higher, I know for a fact they have relaxed relocation requirements for most other roles because we’re all remote now anyway. Good luck and congrats on baby!
Clementine says
A dude wouldn’t apologize.
Just reply. I would include a phrase about a ‘new baby who just joined our family last week’ or something like that.
I personally think you learn a lot about a company from how it reacts to you when Life happens. I want to work in a place where they get that sometimes people have babies or go on vacations or have to take their dogs to the vet. I don’t just want to be a productivity work robot in their eyes (thinking about you, old job…)
Anonymous says
These just look like men’s shoes.
Pogo says
right?! Also, I have no desire to purchase anything ‘nice’ these days except jewelry and glasses and other things you can see from the neck up on video calls.
avocado says
Katharine Hepburn could pull off these shoes. I am not Katharine Hepburn.
Boston Legal Eagle says
Even before the pandemic, people at my work were wearing sneakers and Toms-type shoes to the office. And my husband definitely wears athletic shoes everywhere and only ever wears fancy shoes to weddings and parties. Reminds me of that recent article about how formal clothing stores are going out of business while sales of sweatpants are up 80%.
Redux says
That is the point! I love them.
Anon says
Can anyone speak to the quality of cat & jack or the stride ride for target sneakers? I usually buy regular stride ride for my twins but they don’t have exactly what I’m looking for right now
Cb says
I like Cat & Jack, I find they hold up decently well, my son is the destroyer of shoes and his Cat sneakers held up just fine. He needs like 5 pair given his prediction for puddles and mud so I refuse to spend Clarks or Stride Rite prices.
Anon says
I like Cat & Jack sneakers, especially these: https://www.target.com/p/toddler-39-s-madge-adjustable-easy-close-sneakers-cat-38-jack-8482-pink-5/-/A-53866245
They’ve never worn out, but we only get ~6 months of wear due to growth. They’re super easy to get on and off.
Anonymous says
We buy one pair of “good” shoes per size at the children’s shoe store and then one pair of cat & jack as a backup pair. You only get one pair of feet so I want my kids feet to develop with good supportive shoes (this is a wealthy woman’s concern, privilege acknowledged)
OP says
i agree with you on this and am happy to spend on regular stride rite, but am having trouble finding the ones i want/need in the right sizes
Anon says
The stride rite for Target does not hold up as well as regular. Depending how fast your kids grow out of shoes, that might be fine. Generally, I’ve found I can buy one pair of “quality” shoes per season, or two pairs of cheaper shoes (since they wear out). But my kids also only have one pair of sneakers at a time; YMMV if yours have multiple shoe options they rotate through
rosie says
I got c&j little sneakers and they are nothing special, definitely did not seem as high quality as SR or See Kai Run. I thought the Stride Rite line at Target was good, but only tried it when my toddler was much younger (like her first shoes), so don’t know how they hold up for older kids. Target also had a See Kai Run line at one point that got terrible reviews, just a heads up.
DSW is another place I often find kid shoes if you’re having trouble finding what you want. Zappos has Stride Rite, I think, if you know what you want and just cannot find it on SR right now, it might be another place to look.
Nursing PJs/Robe Set for Hospital says
Hi, I am expecting my first child in October and trying to get my hospital bag ready. Does anyone have recommendations for a pj/robe set to bring to the hospital? Or anything else that I should include in my bag that I might not think of?
Thanks!
Anon says
With the caveat that I’m also expecting my first child in October, so these recommendations aren’t battle-tested, I purchased the following:
Robe – https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01N59INJG/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o05_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Nightgown – https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07KK77F4Z/ref=ppx_od_dt_b_asin_title_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Both are super soft!!
I normally wear PJ sets at home, but decided against pants since I plan/hope to deliver vaginally and gowns are easier for nurse checks.
For me, I’m packing the above, warm socks, birth ball, toiletries, nursing bras, boppy, technology (phones, chargers etc), and paperwork (insurance info, contact info for HR to kick off my maternity leave, etc). Plus an outfit to wear home. For baby, I’m packing an outfit to go home in (newborn and 0-3) plus some extras in case I’m not a fan of the hospital things, plus pacifiers and nail file. And blankets. For both me and husband, I’m packing a ton of snack food since he won’t be allowed to leave my room once he’s cleared his Covid test, and so we’re planning on worst case scenario of being there ~ 5 days. He’ll pack his own clothes. I plan to use hospital supplies for me (mesh undies, pads, witch hazel, peri bottle, etc) and baby (diapers, wipes, etc) until we get home.
Anonymous says
I wore regular, dark ccolored PJs with a nursing tank underneath. I ran really warm after giving birth with all the hormone fluctuations. Bring snacks for yourself when you are starving at 4am and breakfast is 2 hours away.
AnonATL says
Something with buttons in the front or intentionally made for breastfeeding if you plan to do that. And I preferred pants, especially after a couple days of leg stubble that rubbed together. Yes the nurses will have to check you, but they can easily pull your pants down a bit. Mine did without complaint.
Regardless of which style you choose, go with dark colors. There’s a lot of blood and other stuff that tends to drip while you are trying to spray the peri bottle, dermoplast, or other things on your southern region.
Anon says
Only a couple days!? Lol. I’m pretty sure I didn’t shave my legs during the last trimester.
Anon says
Oh yay, you had your baby! Congratulations AnonATL :)
anon says
Congrats AnonATL!!
Anonymous says
Whatever looks pretty to you on Nordstrom
Boston Legal Eagle says
Buy yourself some nice n*pple cream if you plan to bfeed. The hospital will have some, but maybe not enough/not the kind you’ll be able to buy outside. Boppy pillow comes in handy too – I found the hospital pillows didn’t prop my baby or arms up enough. Phone charger. Snacks for you and partner. I too brought my pj pants and a nursing tank top. I wanted to get out of that hospital gown asap.
Also, I’ve heard that some “baby friendly” hospitals (which I would avoid in general, but that’s another post) don’t provide formula so bring a couple bottles of the premade formula to give to your baby if they don’t take to bfeeding right away.
Anonymous says
Or don’t because there is a reason why giving formula immediately is bad. I hate always seeing this advice. Like baby friendly is not something dreamt up to hurt moms.
Anon says
Giving formula is not bad. Breastfeeding is good (though certainly not something everyone wants or can do), but there are lots of studies that early formula supplementation actually lengthens the duration of the breastfeeding relationship. Taking the pressure off new moms to be their hungry baby’s exclusive food source means they are more willing to continue attempting breastfeeding and eventually become successful at it. Point me to one solid piece of evidence that withholding formula from exhausted new moms actually translates to longer or more successful breastfeeding relationships. The only people I know who gave up entirely on breastfeeding did so because they though it was all-or-nothing and they couldn’t take the pressure of exclusive breastfeeding. If they’d been offered formula in the beginning, they likely would have combo fed.
AnonATL says
I’m a combo feeder by force originally and now I love it. Kid wasn’t getting enough food and lost too much weight after birth.
I 100% agree with this sentiment that it can improve and lengthen a breastfeeding experience. In the first few days when I was trying to be his only source of food, I was miserable and he was starving and cried constantly. I was ready to give up and strictly formula feed. The pediatrician telling us to supplement when he was 4 days old was such a relief and now he’s about 50/50 formula and breast milk. He’s growing properly. I still nurse for pretty much every feed, but his dad can give him a bottle when I’m exhausted. It’s really nice to not have him attached to me for the third straight hour after a long day of taking care of him.
I’m glad exclusive breastfeeding works out for a lot of women, but sometimes it just doesn’t or shouldn’t.
Pogo says
??? what is with the trolls lately
Giving formula immediately is not “bad” unless you define “bad” to mean “baby may not exclusively breastfeed, but will at least not starve to death”. Comments like this are so hurtful to women who can’t breastfeed for WHATEVER reason. Like two of my close friends who had breast cancer and don’t have breasts. /endrant
Anonymous says
Omg she asked for pajama options and the advice was “smuggle in formula” and I’m the OTT one?
Boston Legal Eagle says
The OP asked for other suggestions on what to bring to the hospital. A lot of new moms are not familiar with what “baby friendly” hospitals are (I wasn’t, although mine wasn’t one), so that was one suggestion. Giving formula is not bad. Feeding a baby in any form is good and should be encouraged.
Pogo says
Agree it has nothing to do with pajamas, but the anti-formula comment felt like it was intentionally meant to spark controversy, and like I said, hit close to home because of close friends who physically cannot breastfeed and had to give their babies formula.
Anonymous says
OP didn’t just ask about PJs. She asked what else she should bring. Formula is exactly the kind of thing that she needs to hear about–it is natural to assume that it will be provided if needed, but that’s not usually the case.
Anon Lawyer says
Also can we push back on use of the word “smuggle”? It’s a regular consumer product. You can bring it wherever you want.
Anonymous says
Yes, the actual purpose of “baby friendly” policies is to force new mothers to bf without supplementation and to force them to keep their infants in the room 24/7. This harms mothers by depriving them of rest and recovery, sending them home exhausted. It also puts babies at risk of being dropped or smothered when their exhausted moms nod off while holding them in the hospital bed. “Baby friendly” = unfriendly and dangerous to both mothers and babies.
Anon says
The nursery thing is so crazy to me. I’d been awake for over 48 hours when I delivered. I could not safely care for a newborn. If I hadn’t been able to send the baby to the nursery, I don’t know what I would have done. Of course I think mom’s mental health and wellbeing matters, but even if you don’t, it’s extremely dangerous for a newborn to be cared for by a person who is that sleep-deprived.
Anonymous says
They have nurseries. It’s only a change in the base position. For the baby friendly hospital designation they start with the assumption that the baby will room in with the mom and that the baby will go to the nursery if the mom asks vs. the older way which was to take the baby to the nursery and only bring them to the mom if the mom asked.
I generally sent my babies to the nursery for 2-3 hours at night, they came back to nurse, then back to the nursery for another 2-3 hours. Nurses will wake you to nurse when baby is hungry.
Anonymous says
No, that is not how most baby-friendly hospitals work. They will only take the baby to the nursery on medical orders, not upon request. What you describe is old-fashioned “rooming in,” which gives moms choices.
Anonymous says
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/shouldstorm/201911/breastfeeding-wars-when-baby-friendly-is-mom-unfriendly
https://nwhn.org/my-baby-friendly-hospital-harmed-my-baby-and-how-hospitals-can-do-better/
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/18/parenting/pregnancy/baby-friendly-hospital.html
Anon says
Defaulting to rooming in and taking the baby to the nursery only on request is how almost all hospitals work now. To be “baby friendly” you either have to close the nursery completely or only allow babies there with a doctor’s note, just like formula is only available with a prescription. There are definitely baby friendly hospitals in the US that do not have nurseries. Because apparently it’s “friendly” to your baby to drop them or suffocate them due to exhaustion. https://time.com/4216289/nurseries-babies-moms/
Anonymous says
“To be “baby friendly” you either have to close the nursery completely or only allow babies there with a doctor’s note, just like formula is only available with a prescription.” This is totally false.
Baby Friendly is a WHO initiative but the designation is adapted at the national level. In the United States there is ZERO requirement to close nurseries or only to dispense formula on prescription. Both of those things are flat out false. It actually says “when supplementation is chosen by the breastfeeding mother (after appropriate counseling and education), it is crucial that safe and appropriate methods of formula mixing, handling, storage, and feeding are taught to the parents.” and “When a mother specifically states that she has no plans to breastfeed or requests that her breastfeeding infant be given a breast milk substitute, the health care staff should first explore the reasons for this request, address the concerns raised, and educate her about the possible consequences to the health of her infant and the success of breastfeeding. If the mother still requests a breast milk substitute, her request should be granted and the process and the informed decision should be documented.” – The reason for the documentation is to maintain their hospital records on the BF rate at that hospital. It’s the facility (hospital) that decides on access to formula given by the hospital – the BFHI is not strict on that point “The facility should develop a protocol/procedure that describes the current, evidence-based medical indications for supplementation. Staff and care providers should be trained to utilize the protocol/procedure as guidance in the case of supplementation. A facility may utilize the recommendations of national and international authorities ” And nowhere does it limit mothers bringing their own formula and it expressly calls for requests for access to formula to be granted.
And on rooming in “When a mother requests that her infant be cared for in the nursery, the health care staff should explore the reasons for the request and should encourage and educate the mother about the advantages of having her infant stay with her in the same room 24 hours a day. If the mother still requests that the infant be cared for in the nursery, the process and informed decision should be documented.” I actually personally think they should push the rooming in less but the idea that BHFI requires no nursery is just not factual at all.
The actual guidelines that hospitals used to get the designation are here: https://www.babyfriendlyusa.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/GEC2016_v2-180716.pdf
Jocelyn says
Doesn’t even have to be a “baby-friendly” designated hospital, I gave birth in 2016 and 2018, a different hospital for each, neither one had a nursery baby could go to. My son born in 2016 stayed in my room as there was no other place for him and looking back it was so dangerous, I had been awake for over 24 hours, first in labor and then in an emergency c-section. With my daughter, a planned c-section, one of the nurses took pity on me and took her to the nurses station for an hour so I could get a little rest.
Anon says
They don’t all have nurseries. One of my 3 delivery options has closed theirs following their baby-friendly certification.
Anonymous says
My friends gave both in a baby friendly hospital that has no nursery at all. They had their babies with them all the time. I gave birth in a non baby friendly hospital but I still had to ask to send my baby to the nursery. They took her when I asked but were definitely a little shame-y about it (“you won’t miss her?” Uhhhh not as much as I miss sleep!) Even with the baby at the nursery I still got woken up every 2 hours to nurse.
Not having a nursery is unfathomable to me. I think it’s so incredibly dangerous, particularly for women who don’t have a partner there to help.
Anon says
It may not be a WHO requirement, but in the United States, most “baby friendly” hospitals do not have nurseries or severely restrict access to the nursery.
Anonymous says
Super surprised by this no nursery thing. I’ve never heard of it in Canada. I wonder if it’s becoming popular because it’s cheaper for hospitals to close their nurseries instead of paying for staff.
Anonymous says
The no-nursery thing is another stupid U.S. mom-shaming fad.
Anon Lawyer says
This thread makes me really appreciate the hospital I delivered at. I thought they were going to be really shame-y from the tour which was very “we have no nursery, breastfeeding is everything.” The nurses were super practical though and were like “okay, now we’re going to take your baby to the nursery so you can get some sleep.” They also brought up formula supplementation proactively, which turned out not to be necessary. And one of them brought me a pacifier saying “she’s an oral soother, you’re going to want this.” Zero shaming or judgment, even though clearly that was the image the hospital as a whole was projecting to the outside world.
FVNC says
Adding to the chorus to say that while WHO may not require it, baby friendly hospitals may not allow access to a nursery. I delivered my second baby at a major university medical center with a baby friendly designation. With my first, I delivered at a non-baby-friendly designated hospital but had bad luck with the nursery, so with my second, I *asked* to send my baby to the nursery. I was told there was not one. At my “checkout” interview, I mentioned this, and the hospital admin I spoke with said “oh, there’s a nursery!”. So, apparently the nurses who I otherwise really liked flat out lied to me about a nursery availability. Awful.
rosie says
Yes, I loved the nurses who were like, “here’s baby to breastfeed, you just call me when you’re ready for me to take her back to the nursery.” And OMG I even had one nurse who changed a blowout when she brought baby into the room before she handed baby to me in the middle of the night to feed.
Less good was the L&D nurse who told me I had to hold the baby in the wheelchair when I was being transferred to postpartum even though I told her I was dizzy, puking, and seeing stars. She had me smell an alcohol wipe and we were on our way…hemorrhage discovered in postpartum. Just grateful we’re all ok and I didn’t pass out and drop my newborn.
Anonymous says
Again, while the initiative is started by the WHO, the specific rules in each country are set in that country. For the United States – as shown at the link I provided earlier ( https://www.babyfriendlyusa.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/GEC2016_v2-180716.pdf ) there is zero requirement in the US certification process to remove the nursery.
The BFHI certification has nothing to do with whether or not a hospital has a nursery. That is an individual hospital decision.
Anonymous says
Who is this person so assiduously defending baby-friendly hospitals? In practice, most baby-friendly hospitals in the US will not allow you to send your infant to the nursery or to feed your infant formula. That is the reality. Are you an undercover lactation consultant or something?
Anonymous says
I wouldn’t bother bringing formula. It’s just one more thing and your DH can pick some up if the hospital doesn’t have it and you want to use it. Baby doesn’t need much in first 24 hours and stomach is like the size of a cherry so doesn’t need much milk to fill up. You’re usually discharged before deciding to combofeed or not is an issue.
I combo fed my twins so I’m not anti-formula but it’s pretty rare that it’s necessary to have it at the hospital as you’re likely to be discharged in 24-48 hours anyway.
For pyjamas, I just brought my favorite comfy ones from home. Felt comforting to have something familiar vs new pyjamas when everything else was so new.
Anonymous says
It’s not necessarily the case that her husband can run out for formula in the age of COVID. Some hospitals are not allowing the labor support person back in if he leaves.
Anon says
Totally disagree on the formula timing. It wasn’t medically necessary for me (by the 10% weight loss definition, although I later learned that’s controversial and children can be dangerously dehydrated even without that much weight loss) but it was absolutely necessary for my sanity. My milk didn’t come in and my child screamed hysterically and literally would not sleep until we gave her formula, and then she drank 4 oz in one sitting and slept for more than 3 hours straight. In total in the hospital she drank 20+ oz a day. She was big but not giant (8.5 lbs). When my milk finally came in on day 5, that was when I could start cutting back on the formula, so for me it was most necessary in the beginning. From talking to friends, it isn’t uncommon at all to supplement in the first 48 hours.
Anonymous says
+1. Also had an 8.5-lb baby who came into the world starving and could not wait for my milk to come in.
Anon says
And I really hate that “their stomach is the size of a marble” thing. SO many lactation consultants told me that when begging me not to supplement, but children are not all the same size so it’s pretty logical that their stomachs aren’t all the same size either, and even a baby with a tiny stomach can be ravenously hungry if the mom isn’t producing enough milk. I still feel guilt that my daughter spent the first 24 hours of her life literally starving and crying hysterically about it, and I deprived her of a perfectly safe, healthy food alternative just because of the pressure to EBF.
GCA says
+1 to bringing in a bit of premade formula, even if you aim to breastfeed. There are many, many reasons that a baby may need supplementing initially – baby born early, mother’s milk not in, baby has jaundice, or baby has latching difficulties. In the case of my 2nd, she was borderline jaundiced – formula might not have been clinically indicated, but the ped and nurses all agreed with us that supplementing could certainly help and I honestly believe it helped us leave the hospital with a healthy baby. And combo feeding played a big factor in extending my nursing relationship well past a year for both kids.
Anon says
I ended up just staying in the hospital gown the whole time. If you do plan to change, I would definitely recommend a nightgown style over pants. They come in to check you every hour or two and I really wouldn’t have wanted to get up out of bed to pull my pants down every time. I had a relatively easy V delivery but getting into and out of bed was difficult for me for a couple days.
Anonymous says
The nurses at my hospital never checked me. They woke me up every 3 hours to force me to nurse the baby, but they never once checked *me*. The only person who checked me was my doctor, once a day during rounds.
Anonymous says
That’s a pretty awful hospital. I was checked by the nurses at least 2-3 times a day on all three births – v deliveries so not even a c-section scar to check or something.
Anon says
Anonymous @10:55, how is that a horrible hospital? I’ve given birth twice at a major, high-ranking teaching hospital in a very “medical” city. Both times, I was checked once about 24hrs postpartum by my doctor while she was on rounds. I also never got the dreaded belly massage that everyone talks about. Doctors and nurses asked questions re: my bleeding and my pain level and I’m sure I would’ve been checked more if an issue was indicated, but I wouldn’t go so far as to say my hospital was horrible!
rosie says
I am not a medical professional, but that does seem terrible. Postpartum complications are real and should be very preventable, but unfortunately it seems like many hospitals do not have established routines to detect and treat them.
I had a postpartum hemorrhage that was discovered by my nurse in postpartum pressing on my belly and seeing way more blood come out than she expected. I had no idea how much I was bleeding at that point and wasn’t in particular pain, so a verbal check in would not have caught this, and my BP was on the lower end of normal but didn’t prompt follow up. I’m fine and didn’t require a transfusion — unclear if that would have been the outcome had no one checked until the dr came by the next day.
Anonymous says
I am the one who said I was never checked. I was never asked about bleeding or pain either. I got one dose of Advil after the delivery and that was it. The nurses were concerned only about the baby. I was just a milk cow.
Anonymous says
She said she was ‘never once checked’ except by a doctor once a day. There wasn’t asking about symptoms of issues or checking blood pressure etc. The maternal mortality rate in the US is awful and care like this is part of the reason why. Regular monitoring of mom in first 24-48 hours after birth is important.
Pogo says
Oh wow – they definitely checked me. But my nurse pulled my pants down like I was a toddler and she was checking my diaper. Which… I was essentially wearing a diaper so yeah. I for sure did not get out of bed.
Pogo says
Not required at all, but I bought one of the cute sets from Everly Grey. Agree that darker colors are good in case you have a mesh panty incident, although this time I’m planning to go full Depends.
octagon says
My MVP was a sleep mask – the room never really got dark enough for me to sleep in, and the nurses would come in and turn the lights on with very little warning.
Anon says
+1
Anonymous says
I brought battery powered candles to take care of that one. Turned off the overhead florescents, and the candles made it much easier to sleep while others could still sorta see. My hack for the nurses that really wanted more light was to ask them to turn on the light in the bathroom, rather than the overhead ones, which always gave them enough light.
Pogo says
Oooo good reminder. My doula brought battery powered candles last time, as well as bluetooth speaker for music. But due to COVID, no doulas allowed, so I will add these to my list! The nurses all commented how much it felt like a spa because of the music and candles, ha. Exactly 0 of them complained or asked to turn the lights on.
Mamaroo says
PJ/Robe – GapBody Maternity. I also liked the 3 in 1 gown for labor and delivery,
Things you may not have thought of: Actual towels for you and partner, nice blankets and pillows for you and partner, using packing cubes to keep partner/baby/your stuff separated. A zippered or velcro swaddle, nail clippers, lots of snacks, small white noise machine (sometimes you have some noisy neighbors and also, can help soothe baby), flip flops and slippers, always discreet underwear (if you don’t want to fight with all of the pads.) On the toiletry front, I packed all of the “nice” samples I’d stashed away and it made that first post-labor shower extra enjoyable. I also used the Mario Badescu face spray a lot. I prefer to say I packed with purpose! Congrats!
Pogo says
Multiple people from my OB’s office told us specifically to bring our own towels and pillows because the hospital ones are so bad.
TheElms says
Extra long cord for your iphone/ipad. The outlets are often not conveniently located. Chapstick and all the lotion. I found the hospital very cold and very dry. A cozy sweater. Lots of people run hot after delivery; I ran very cold. A nice cozy cardigan would have been awesome. A small amount of makeup with your toiletries. I think I had BB cream, some blush and mascara.
I had the Kindred Bravely robe in black which I liked because it was light weight and black and could easily be put on over a hospital gown. Any light weight dark colored robe would work.
I expected to change out of a hospital gown but after my c-section I never did, so I never wore the button front night gown I packed. I packed yoga pants and a maternity t-shirt and a dress as going home outfits for me. I’m glad I put the dress on and took a picture of me (after my first shower and I put on some makeup) with kiddo in the hospital. Its not a great picture but it is much better than all the other pictures I have from the hospital. I reacted badly to some of the drugs I got and scratched the heck out of my face without realizing it (apparently not that uncommon). So makeup made everything much less awful looking.
Anon says
+1. I certainly wasn’t trying to look glamorous, but a little bit of makeup really made me feel good. I’m so glad I brought it and took some nice pictures in the hospital.
Anonymous says
I did a maternity nightgown that buttoned down the front for both kids. With the second it was because my first birth wasn’t that long and my water had broken, so it was just in case I had the baby very fast on the way (I did not). Bring an extra pair of bottoms in case you pee yourself right before you go home. Ask me how I know (this isn’t to scare you, it’s a short lived issue for just a few days for some women following birth).
TheElms says
My original comment seems lost in moderation. I would pack the following things:
– extra long phone/tablet cord – outlets can be far away!
– nice going home clothes for a picture before you leave the hospital (I had a maternity dress that was nursing friendly)
– button front nightgown if you plan to nurse
– lightweight dark color robe
– a small amount of make up (I scratched my face badly during labor without realizing it) / toiletries
– cozy cardigan (I ran cold after delivery)
– lip balm and lotion (found the hospital air very drying)
No Face says
I personally wore the hospital gown as a default because I didn’t have to care about bleeding all over it. When visitors came by, I tossed on the undercover mama house dress.
Party Animal says
I’m extra, so you can take this with a grain of salt, but I brought an essential oil diffuser and some of my favorite oils for aromatherapy. It really comforted me and made it feel more like home. The nurses got a real kick out of how cozy my room was.
Realist says
I think this is a great suggestion. I had made playlists on my phone and we brought a small portable speaker. I really enjoyed having my own music to play in the room. We also brought our own beverages because I am finicky and appreciated having my favorite bottled water and electrolyte drink on hand. Anything small you can bring to easily create comfort for yourself is worth bringing.
Anonymous says
Without getting into it- bf isn’t for everyone. I had a LOT of trouble getting formula at a regular (not baby friendly) hospital. It was like a hostage situation where they were more than willing to let the baby go hungry if it would convince me to BF. Bring the formula. Best case you won’t need it.
layered bob says
Nursing pillow and frozen expressed b r e a stmilk from a currently-lactating friend to supplement with if needed (I’ve only ever needed two ounces, so doesn’t have to be a lot). Lip balm, toiletries, slippers, going home outfits for me and baby. Changes of clothes for DH. That’s pretty much it.
I tend to have medically-complicated c-section deliveries so don’t really pack for the labor part of the hospital stay, just for the postpartum portion, and because of all the IV lines and various wires etc. can’t get anything on that goes over my head or arms, so no clothes.
Anon says
I didn’t use a robe in the hospital but brought a maternity nightgown I could pull down – maybe baby be mine brand? It was fine but I kind of preferred maternity leggings and a tshirt.
Other than the obvious stuff, bring ear plugs and an eye mask so that you can sleep! Also food – hospital food sucks and you’ll be very hungry after not eating for a while. Also lanolin cream stained some of my clothing pretty bad – I liked the earth mama butter instead. I also brought my pillow + nursing pillow (a firm one is easiest to use).
asdf says
Tylenol, tums and a blanket for your partner. Since the partner is not a patient at the hospital (unlike you and baby) the hospital can’t give him any over the counter meds that might make his life better. It’s a stressful experience and my husband had a huge headache for quite a lot of my labor (only found out because he asked the nurse for asprin, which she could not give him).
Anon says
My 2 year old has a very clear preference for two of her daycare teachers over the other one. When we get to school in the morning and Ms. A answers the door she says “Where’s Ms. B!? I wanna see Ms. B!” and then when she sees Ms. B she runs right past Ms. A to give Ms. B a hug. In the afternoon she has Ms. C who she also adores. Is this behavior we need to try to correct and if so how? My gut is that if she said something like “I don’t like Ms. A” then we would talk to her about how that’s hurtful, but just acting more enthusiastic about B and C isn’t something she should be scolded for. I definitely don’t want to tell her to hug Ms. A if she doesn’t want to (I’m a big believer in teaching bodily autonomy even from a young age) but maybe I should be discouraging hugging the other teachers? I can tell Ms. A is annoyed/hurt but honestly I do understand my daughter’s preference – from the brief interactions I’ve observed I think B and C are way better at interacting with kids in general and especially my daughter.
Anonymous says
Nope not your problem. And if Ms. A seems overly annoyed or hurt by normal toddler behavior talk to the director.
Anon says
Do what you think is appropriate to talk to your daughter about beginnings of considering other’s feelings in actions (spoiler alert, you won’t get far now but at least you can feel like you are building towards something), but honestly this is SUPER common and if Teacher A can’t handle it she is not in the right job.
Anonymous says
I wouldn’t worry about it. In fact, it’s entirely possible that she doesn’t like Ms. A because she has perceived that Ms. A has favorites and she isn’t one of them.
Anon says
Oooh that’s a good theory. Ms. B and Ms. C do gush a lot more to me about my daughter than Ms. A does so it’s very possible she’s picking up on their attitudes about her.
Clementine says
This is 100% developmentally normal and actually shows that she’s a child who is able to form healthy attachments.
It is normal to have preferences, to feel more bonded to some people than others, and for a child to seek out a particular caregiver with whom she feels a bond. This is the opposite of a problem – it shows that you’re doing a great job raising a kid with secure attachments.
(Also, daycare teachers are really used to this.)
Anon says
Oh I know it’s normal and healthy for her to feel this way – just wasn’t sure to what degree it was ok for her to express it.
Anonymous says
She is 2. I wouldn’t encourage her to internalize feminine norms of being “nice” to everyone just yet.
Anon says
Hmm I get the point that it may not be possible to teach because she’s only 2, but being kind is a really important value to me, and I don’t think it’s inherently gendered. When I think of her peers, the child who is the kindest and whose behavior I would most like her to emulate is a boy. I tend to think I’m very cautious about gender stereotypes but I feel like teaching kindness should be a priority.
Anonymous says
Kindness is saying hello to all the teachers. Forcing her to treat them all equally, including hugging the one she doesn’t like as well, tells her that other people’s feelings are more important than hers.
Anon says
I specifically said in my original post that I would never force her to hug someone she doesn’t want to hug. She is currently not saying hello to A, she’s greeting A with “where’s B?” It’s definitely behavior that would not be considered polite in an adult, although I realize politeness standards are different for toddlers.
IHeartBacon says
I kind of agree with this comment, but I don’t want to turn this into a battle of the Great Gender Divide. OP, I understand that being kind of a really important value to you, and I would never try to convince you that it’s not a good value to have, but I also think the specific issue with your daughter is not an issue of whether she is being kind. It’s that she is being rude to Teacher A. I don’t force my 3 y.o. son to be kind to everyone, but I also do not allow him to be rude to anyone. For your daughter, perhaps the thing you could try teaching her is that she needs to greet whomever opens the door with “Good Morning, Teacher __,” before saying anything else or running off to find her favorite teachers. Every morning as you two are walking toward the door, tell her, “When someone opens the door, we say ‘Good Morning,’ ” and then prompt her to do it when the teacher opens the door. Good manners are gender-neutral.
Anonymous says
She’s 2 – she’s allowed to be excited to see her favorite people.
Anonymous says
School what would you do?
I have a Kindergartener and a 2nd grader. 2nd grader, like many, had a terrible experience with distance learning last year. We have two options for this coming school year, and DH and I are leaning different directions. Assume we’re equally comfortable with the health&safety measures for both. We can cover tuition for either, but it’s not nothing-money.
Option 1: Private Montessori school. ~100 total staff and students, age 2-3rd grade. Ends at 3:15, no after care, about 20 min drive with light traffic, could be 30+ min if traffic returns to pre-pandemic levels. In person for K beginning in a couple weeks, in person for 2nd grade starting in October. Total cost ~$45k
Option 2: Public school via learning hub at our neighborhood elementary school. Enrollment TBD, but the aftercare program running it usually has about 100 kids. 8:30-5:30. The after care program is fantastic and we are 100% confident they’ll make the best of a bad situation. Cohorts are 13 kids + 2 counselors, who supervise and facilitate distance learning and do fun stuff during the breaks and outdoor games after the school day, but are not actual teachers. Instruction is via the public school’s virtual offering. School is fully virtual through at least January, *if* the second semester starts phasing back in to a A/B in-person schedule, I have no idea what options we’d have on the at-home days. Total cost ~$25k
Obviously I think the Montessori school will be a better academic experience whether or not it stays in-person, but I can’t realistically supervise remote learning during work hours long-term, and I wouldn’t want to afford a babysitter on top of that tuition. I believe the school and the hub will be subject to the same county orders on open/closing, but if the hub closes we wouldn’t be on the hook for payment. School offers only a slight discount if they have to do remote for more than 2 weeks.
DH thinks this school year is a wash anyway, so why pay extra? He also thinks the hub will be more fun for the kids, but I’m still concerned about the 5 hours with a computer every day to do the actual school part. I’m also concerned that my 2nd grader is already not a huge fan of school and I don’t want my kids forming lasting opinions about school based on a terrible computer-based year if I can avoid it. The hub wins on logistics, and saving $20k would be nice. DH also is annoyed with how the Montessori school has backed out on their initial “in-person unless required not to be” stance, and thinks (based on nothing but preconceived notions) that he won’t like the subculture of parents at the school.
I could argue this either way, and I feel like I’m going in circles. What am I missing? How would you weigh these?
Anonymous says
Not sure how I would weigh these but you’re going in circles because there isn’t one obviously right choice. Be gracious with yourself as you work through the decision. These are tough decisions with not clear answers and you’re doing the best you can in a very imperfect situation.
Anonymous says
I am with your husband here. It is extremely likely that governors will require all schools to close again at some point during the year. I would only go with Montessori if you and your husband both strongly preferred that instructional approach and signing up now were only way to secure a spot for the future, and it doesn’t sound as if that is the case.
Anonymous says
I think it depends where you live. Newsom, for example, has shown a strong desire to keep schools closed until it’s much safer than it is now. But I don’t see my red state governor closing anything unless our hospitals get completely overwhelmed and at this point I think that’s relatively unlikely since we made it through our summer surge without hospital crowding and without our governor walking back our reopening at all. Since kids are so unlikely to get severely ill, school reopenings won’t contribute much to hospital crowding.
Anonymous says
Even if you aren’t concerned about the kids, so many staff will get sick that schools will be forced to close. Some schools in our area have just closed down due to outbreaks among teachers who have returned to prep, and there aren’t even any kids back yet.
Anonymous says
Sure, but doesn’t that apply equally to both options? There are adult staff members at both places, I’m not sure why Montessori would be more likely to have an outbreak.
Anonymous says
That’s the point–it applies equally to both options, so she’s not more likely to get in-person instruction with Montessori.
OP says
Blue state, with even bluer local government that is reopening more slowly than the overall state guidance. I will not be at all surprised if public schools stay virtual all year, or if both the hub and the school have to shut down again esp during flu season.
It’s unclear how the local health department might mandate closing for an outbreak, but the school has told us that their intention is the whole school will quarantine if there’s one positive case (in which case, why even cohort? doesn’t make sense to me). Learning hub would likely only quarantine the cohort with the positive case. Based on this, our chances of having off-site school/childcare are probably higher with the hub.
Anonymous says
Yeah, the hub definitely wins. I would not pay $20K extra per year for less chance of getting the in-person care you want.
Anonymous says
Yeah, I’d go with the one who has a better handle on cohorts.
Anonymous says
I agree with your husband 100%
Anonymous says
While my 2nd grader did not hate the computer based learning last year, the quality of the distance learning this year has been much better than last year. It is about half synchronous, and the teacher has done an excellent job in engaging my second grader. FWIW we got very little information before school started last week.
OP says
This is heartening, thank you!
Anonymous says
If your husband is strongly in favor of public school and you “could argue this either way,” it doesn’t sound as if Montessori is worth the extra $20K and logistical hassles.
Anonymous says
This made me LOL: “and thinks (based on nothing but preconceived notions) that he won’t like the subculture of parents at the school”
I would do the other option, but not because of that. I think the hub sounds just fine, will be cheaper, and will offer more coverage on the days it is in session. Hopefully interacting with the other kids during the off-device time will make up for the device time.
Party Animal says
I’d go with Option 2. I think it gives you more flexibility, and you don’t have to pay a babysitter.
Katy says
The one that gives you the longer coverage and is in your neighborhood! seems like for the next 4 months it will be a better option. Overall family stress levels are important for kids success too.
Who knows what either one will be the situation for either school by January! I totally get that it is stressful to have to make a whole new plan in January (I am struggling with the same). But trying to convince myself not to borrow trouble?!
OP says
Thanks, everyone! The clear consensus here is helpful framing for me.
Anon says
What do y’all think Halloween will look like this year? My kids have started discussing costumes and I’m not sure how far to let it go…
Anonanonanon says
I’d let them wear costumes so they can take pictures in them to send to friends and relatives regardless
Anon says
Ugh I’m stupidly sad about this. My kid is 3 and I was so excited for trick or treating and her school’s Halloween carnival, which I assume are both canceled. Last year we missed them both because of snow and illness and before that she didn’t understand Halloween. I hope the kids will at least get to wear costumes to daycare and maybe have some kind of class party?
Anonymous says
I’m sure they’ll be able to wear costumes. Parades. Waiving at neighbors from side walks. Zooms.
OP says
Oh I think they can wear costumes, I should have been clearer -mine was planning x costume for parties and school and things and y for trick or treating. I’m nervous about what will happen and won’t, especially trick or treating.
Anonymous says
I would not promise that there will be parties, or school, or trick-or-treating. I’d let them go to town with one costume that they can wear to whatever events do happen (socially distanced neighborhood parade?).
Anon says
not sure exactly how old your kids are, but if brainstorming/making costumes is fun for them, then let them as a creative activity, but maybe set some expectations about how things might look different this year, so maybe one costume will be for a zoom with friends, and another will be for a walk around the neighborhood
Anonymous says
Trick or treating is not happening.
Anon says
My town is already discussing still trick or treating. They are coming up with ideas where the kids stay in one spot and the adults go house to house tossing candy to them like a parade. I’m not sure how this is safer than traditional trick or treat. I think if it goes “regular” trick or treat, homeowners will sit outside in chairs and will put the candy in the kid’s bucket.
Even if my town “cancels” trick or treat, a large contingent on FB has said they will still be doing it.
And this, in part, is why COVID is never leaving.
Anonymous says
This. Going to try and organize a costume parade for a few of the families on our street who usually trick or treat together and maybe have each family give a few treats via leaving treats in each others mailboxes or something. Quiet street and many of the kids are in the same classes at school so pretty low risk.
anon says
I can’t even think about it. :( I’m trying to be honest that we don’t know exactly what the holiday will be like this year but they’re welcome to dress up no matter what.
Anonymous says
We are going nuts with the homemade costumes this year. So much fun to be had with planning, sourcing, and construction. Creating cosplay-quality Halloween costumes is sort of a hobby for me, so YMMV.
I don’t think there will be trick-or-treating, and if there is we won’t be participating.
Spirograph says
Ugh, my neighborhood association has already been talking about how we need to modify Halloween this year, have age group time slots for trick-or-treating for social distancing, or pre-make bags of candy that no one touches for 2 days, blah blah, blah. Normally there’s a block party and spooky movie projected on the side of someone’s house, and a few people turn their garage into a haunted house — I get that those probably shouldn’t happen. But trick-or-treating?! To me, kids trick-or-treating door to door, outside, in masks, is very low risk, so I’m pretty annoyed that people are trying to “ruin” Halloween at all. Turn off your porch light if you’re not comfortable answering the door to germs, but don’t shut it down for everyone. Fomite transmission, latest I’ve heard, is not a significant thing.
I’m planning a daytime bike + costume parade for the neighborhood kids, and trick or treating remains to be seen. DH loooooves Halloween, and our immediate neighbors are not worried about this, so worst case scenario it will just be the friends my kids have been hanging out with for the last few months anyway, and we’ll only trick or treat on our little corner.
Anon says
Eh it seems fairly risky to me. It’s not that the virus is on the candy, I think a bigger risk is coming face to face while you get the candy. At least in normal times, trick or treaters always came within 6 feet of me. Plus it’s just a numbers thing. Each individual house may be a low risk contact, but you hit 50 or 100 houses and then just by sheer volume it’s no longer low risk.
I think people are trying to come up with safer alternatives because they’re assuming almost no one will participate in traditional trick or treating and they don’t want the kids to be sad. They’re not trying to “ruin” Halloween. Assume good intentions!
Anonymous says
Trick-or-treating doesn’t just involve the risk of fomite transmission, which I already worry about every year as the kids insist on digging through the bowl of candy with their germy hands. The kids crowd very close to each other and to the person giving out the treats at the door.
Anon says
in non covid times this sounds so fun! where do you live? but trick or treating is likely not low risk as kids often congregate over the candy bowl, so many people touching the door knob/bowl, kids seeing their friend and getting excited, kids taking their masks off to eat their candy in the middle of all of this, adults taking their masks off, etc.
Anonymous says
Trick-or-treating in our neighborhood is very risky. We usually get at least 300 kids from multiple schools and neighborhoods within a 2-hour window. That makes for a lot of close contact at front doors. If you’re in a quiet neighborhood where the only trick-or-treaters are the kids from the block with whom your kids are interacting anyway, it might be different.
Anonymous says
This is insane.
Spirograph says
What’s insane? Our neighborhood is pretty big and single-family homes. Aside from the block party streets (our house is not on one of them), the flow of trick-or-treaters is a steady drip, but there is rarely more than one group at the door at once. Later in the evening we do usually get some older kids coming in from other neighborhoods, but mostly it’s the actual residents (school is all virtual this year anyway). I guess I have more confidence than most that the kids are able to social distance after 6+ months of practice. If there is normal trick-or-treating this year, I will remind my kids and enforce that we take turns with other groups going to the door, and wait at the end of the driveway until the other group leaves. They’re good at masks, they’re good at staying away from other families when we’re out in public spaces, and I just don’t anticipate Halloween — even with all the excitement — being the one night when they’ll forget how to do covid life.
Again, 100% understand if people aren’t comfortable, but that’s a reason for them to opt out, not to cancel the whole thing for everyone.
Anonymous says
Schools are barely open! No one wants your germy kids at their door! Nor should you be r coursing it! Most absurd thing ive ever heard.
Anon says
Kids are good at masks but I don’t know many kids (or adults for that matter) who are good at keeping a distance. 6’ is much longer than it looks. If your children and the neighbors are simultaneously holding a candy bowl they’re much closer than 6’ – arms are just not that long. That’s why people are talking about all the modifications like leaving candy bowls out, which gives kids their candy in a much safer way. I think everyone wants kids to dress up and get candy but there are safer ways!
Also I’d point out that any household that’s likely to participate in unmodified trick or treating is probably pretty cavalier about Covid, so I definitely wouldn’t expect the adults to be wearing masks or following social distancing precautions when they answer the door, even if your family is. Unfortunately with this virus your mask protects others and you rely to protect you and I just don’t have that trust in my neighbors – especially the ones that would voluntarily opt in to a risky event like this.
Anon2 says
I’m still planning on costumes (my boys have been talking about their idea for a while) and at the very least I will hide candy in our yard for them to hunt. Maybe with a walk around the neighborhood as a little “parade.”
I also think Trick or Treat is fairly low risk – if you leave a bowl out on your step and refill it periodically, no one has to go within six feet of anyone else. Do you have friends in your neighborhood, and maybe your kid can at least stop by their houses?
Anonymous says
Now here is some creative problem-solving. What can we do that is fun and safe (candy hunt, parade), rather than trying to insist that everything must happen exactly as it did last year.
Anonymous says
I’d be surprised if we don’t have trick-or-treat in our neighborhood, unless our city bans it. Our neighborhood isn’t technically within city limits (more rural Midwest area), but we tend to follow the city’s lead on that kind of stuff. But with being a smaller, less densely populated town, this kind of stuff is just lower risk. Fewer kids with homes that are spread out more. Neighbor kids are already playing together in small groups regularly. The one Halloween event we have definitely lost is a trick-or-treat at my husband’s office that we look forward to every year. The event is wildly popular and packed. As such, it has already been cancelled.
CCLA says
Anyone care to share what their daycare is doing for sick policies these days? I saw some of the threads from a few weeks ago and wondering if there’s any more info now. The parents are all working together at our center with management to come up with an updated policy. Right now it requires 48 hours symptom free plus negative covid test, but we’re thinking it could be more nuanced…or maybe this is reasonable…I realize there is no one definitely right way but hoping to crowdsource from what’s working elsewhere.
Clementine says
Our daycare flat out acknowledged: sometimes kids get sick. That’s not going to change with COVID.
They’re following state guidance and now it’s 72 hours fever free required. If there is exposure to a known or suspected COVID case, you’re obligated to tell them and a test can be requested; however, if my kid has diarrhea (for example), I just need to keep her out for 48-72 hours.
Boston Legal Eagle says
Same here, 72 hours fever free. Just a runny nose or congestion won’t keep them out without other symptoms or exposure to known Covid case. There are other restrictions if you travel somewhere where you need to quarantine after, or are waiting on Covid test results. We haven’t had to deal with a positive case in the classroom yet, so TBD what they’ll do in terms of quarantining for that.
Anon says
Runny nose and sneezing don’t exclude you from daycare. Cough and fever do, and you have to be symptom free for 48 hours before returning. Negative Covid tests are only required if there’s a known exposure to Covid or recent travel.
I’m fine with this policy. I have MDs in the family who are all confident that Covid is most infectious before symptoms appear and in the first day or two after symptoms begin, so I think excluding people for a long time period after symptoms have resolved has a marginal benefit at best and comes at a relatively high logistical cost.
Anonymous says
The cough thing is going to exclude a lot of kids from day care for longer periods of time. Mine always cough for weeks after a cold.
Anonymous says
I think people are going to balk at having to get a COVID test with every sniffle. Plus, in my area, it takes anywhere from 2 days to 2 weeks to get results back… Could you ask for a doctor’s note instead? Also, has anyone reached out to the local health department? They have been very helpful in reviewing our school’s policies and making sure we have the most up to date guidelines.
Anonymous says
As a parent, I would not want to be required to get a doctor’s note. If my kid has a cold and not COVID, the last thing I want to do is to take him to the doctor’s office to get a note.
Anon says
We still don’t know all the symptoms COVID causes, and the severity certainly varies, so how would a doctor be able to definitively tell a kid doesn’t have it? I’ve seen how some doctors will hand out antibiotics every time a parent asks, so I wouldn’t have much confidence in that policy… I also agree a mandated COVID test for every cough is excessive, but maybe phrasing it as a neg test OR out for 72+ hours (up to a week?) might be palatable
SC says
This is for a private school, but the policy for someone with Covid-19 symptoms (fever, persistent cough, trouble breathing, etc) are to stay home and contact a doctor. A student can return to school with a doctor’s note or a negative Covid-19 test. If the student can’t be evaluated by a doctor, they have to stay home for 10 days. So, basically, doctor’s note or negative test. And I imagine plenty of doctors will require negative tests before they write a note because who wants to be wrong in this situation? (The policy actually says “etc” in the list of symptoms–I’m not sure how they’ll treat symptoms like runny nose or vomiting.)
If the student is exposed to Covid-19 at home, they have to stay home for 14 days and contact their doctor. If a student is exposed at school, the school will consult the regional medical director to determine how many kids need to be quarantined.
If a student tests positive for Covid-19, they have to stay home (obviously) and can return to school 10 days after onset of symptoms, plus symptom improvement, 24 hours fever free without medication, and a doctor’s note.
CCLA says
Thanks all, I’ve appreciated the info! We are working out a suggested policy (most of the parents are physicians and this is at a hospital affiliated daycare, so they are willing to work with us provided whatever we suggest is within required health department guidelines, but it’s still helpful to get a sense of what is happening elsewhere). Thankful that the parents at the school are all engaging in open communication, which I am hopeful will get us through this reasonably smoothly.
Runner says
Anyone know how intermittent fasting works with exercise? I’d like to try it out for a few weeks to get of a few pounds to get down to my pre-pregnancy rate. I run 4-5 times a week and do core workouts about 3 times per week. Can’t imagine running in the morning and then continuing to fast?
Anonymous says
If I work out in the morning and then don’t eat until halfway through the day, I am completely nonfunctional for the entire day, even after I finally have a meal. Starving yourself is not healthy and does not produce weight loss.
Runner says
Yeah I am not sure IF is for me. But I know it’s popular here on the board so would love someone to chime in about how to fit in workouts with it.
Anonymous says
That’s the point–you can’t work out and do IF.
Anon says
Is working out mid-day an option now that we’re all home? I work out in the evenings and don’t feel the need to eat after, but it sounds like your exercise routine is more intense than mine.
Anonymous says
It works for me because I’m not a morning exerciser. I do yoga at lunchtime on Mondays (eating window starts just before so I eat light before and after vs lunch in one sitting) – this is a lighter class so don’t need a full shower before going back to work, then mid morning hot yoga on Saturdays (eat after), short run mid afternoon on Sundays (or evening depending on weather), plus 45 min strength training class after work on Wednesday (DH gets kids).
If I was a morning exerciser I would probably just have an earlier eating window (that’s what is recommended anyway), so like 9am- 6pm. On the rare occasions I work out in the morning around 6-7, I usually just want coffee and water after my workout and wait until 8:30-9ish during my commute to have my smoothie.
Anon says
Eh, it depends how you do it but it definitely doesn’t involve “starving yourself” (I’m usually not even that hungry by the start of my eating window) and it’s been the only thing that ever worked for me to lose weight.
Anon says
*doesnt have to involve starving yourself. I’m sure some people do but I don’t.
Anonymous says
Why would you wait to eat until half way though the day? The recommended window is like 8am-4pm or something. Many lawyers I know push it later because they tend to eat dinner late, but it’s actually recommended to have an earlier eating window.
And you’re not supposed to starve yourself. You eat the same number of meals/calories but during a more limited timeframe so your body can better regulate itself.
Runner says
Apologies a million typos.
mascot says
It’s doable. I’ve always preferred working out fasted in the morning and wanted to wait a bit afterwards to eat. This applies to running, OTF, lifting, etc. You may need to ease into IF- start your eating window at 10 am for example, then move to 12pm once you adjust. It also helps to be deliberate about what you do eat in your window and make sure you are getting your nutritional needs met and not worrying quite so much about calories.
Pogo says
I did it for awhile pre-baby and I would fast til mid-morning, have a yogurt, and then work out at lunch, normal lunch after (at my desk or in meeting), dinner normal time and nothing after dinner. It’s just a different way of doing calorie restriction, imo. I did not have any issues with working out (typically running) but also didn’t run first thing, I ran after having a yogurt. Hydrating is very important as well for me to feel good while working out, so just because you don’t eat breakfast I would still make sure to have plenty of water. I also still drank black coffee.
It did feel like an easy way to lose 5lbs, I think the reason it works for so many people is there are very few “rules” to follow and you don’t even really need to control portions that much, because you’re eliminating calories by virtue of limiting the hours during which you eat.
I did not do something like, totally fast for 24h one day each week. That’s too much for me personally.
Anonymous says
I run 4-5 miles in the morning, and my window is 10 am – 6pm. It works just fine. I do like to have eaten before I do strength, so I’ll do that a lunchtime, but admittedly don’t do strength often. The running actually helps me make it longer without eating and prevents me from getting hungry earlier. I drink tons of water before and after running.
farrleybear says
I’ve been doing IF for about a year. I run a few mornings a week and also do morning yoga sometimes. I feel fine but have never been a big morning eater anyway.
dee says
Can someone help me make sense of this data? It is not at all what I expected to see (disregard the source and let’s assume the data is reported accurately): https://nypost.com/2020/08/17/remote-only-school-requests-jump-by-40000-in-one-week/
The number of NYC families opting out of classroom learning jumped by 40,000 in the past week — with Hispanic families accounting for the highest number of those choosing the format, according to new Department of Education data.
Latino kids, who comprise 41 percent of the overall DOE population, accounted for 37 percent of those who selected fully remote instruction.
Asians, who are 18 percent of the system, made up 28 percent of the total.
Black students, who comprise 22 percent of the nation’s largest school system, accounted for 20 percent of those who chose full-time distance learning, according to the DOE.
White city kids, who are 16 percent of the DOE population, were 12 percent of the remote-only total.
Anonymous says
I read a different study about this that theorized that minorities have more distrust for the school system and feel as thought they have been failed by the school systems in the past. Therefore, they don’t trust the school systems to handle Covid well. White folks don’t have that same experience and are more likely to trust schools to adequately handle Covid. White folks are also more likely to have kids at buildings with more resources that are therefore more equipped to handle distancing, separation, etc.
dee says
What happened to all this talk, incl on this board, about privileged white folk forming private pods and tutors? I’d think NYC would be the epicenter of white flight from public schools in favor of private covid-safe learning.
Anonymous says
I think the white flight from public schools has already happened in NYC. Those who are left don’t have the resources for pods.
dee says
I guess it is anecdotal, but a ton of my working peers at the office (we are remote, NYC based) make healthy six-figure salaries, live in fancy Manhattan high rises and Brooklyn townhouses, send their kids to public schools and are staying the course. I consider them privileged and see no pod action happening. Maybe they have no money left for private pods, but I haven’t see this white flight from public schools except for the ultra high net worths (and they never attended city public schools to begin with).
Anonymous says
Okay! Why are you so argumentative about this? People thought one thing might happpen, but it didn’t! Maybe because pods are hard in small apartments. Maybe because school is safe.
Anonymous says
not all white families in NYC schools are privileged
dee says
“so argumentative”? really? i apologize if that’s how my tone came across, i am truly curious and wanted to hear some thoughts on why it unfolded the way it has. thank you all for your input, esp social scientist for doing some number crunching.
NYCer says
Many (but certainly not all) “privileged white folk” in NYC send their kids to private schools.
social scientist says
Just for fun, I played around with the numbers. A chi-square test shows that there is a statistically significant difference between the proportion of students in each racial/ethnic category choosing on-line learning and what would be expected based on the district’s total population. So there’s definitely something going on here.
I don’t like the way the Post presents the data, though. It’s more intuitive to compare rates of on-line education across racial/ethnic groups. 27 percent of Latino students, 47 percent of Asian students, 27 percent of Black students, 23 percent of white students, and 30 percent of other students opted for on-line education. Here the differences are clear–Asian students are most likely, and white students least likely, to choose on-line school.
I don’t know enough about the public school student population in NYC to hazard a guess as to why this pattern emerges. If wealthy white students attend private schools at a higher rate than wealthy students of other races, then perhaps most of the white students left are poor kids of essential workers who rely on the schools for child care. Etc. etc. It’s all speculative without additional demographic data.
Anonymous says
What’s hard to understand? Looks like Asian families are opting for virtual school more than other groups. And?
dee says
Yes, thank you for the elucidation. I meant any insights as to why this demographic breakdown unfolded the way it has. See reply thread above. But if you just wanna snark, you got your two cents in.
Anonymous says
Each of time these groups is dealing with different issues. I work at an education non-profit in the city.
First, Asian students are more likely to be going to weekend cram schools and doing independent studying and homework regardless of school. This is mostly true for East Asian students and less true for Indian American students. They are also most likely to be formally studying a foreign language outside of school. Their parents are probably most comfortable with having their students continue their independent studies, cram work and trust their students to work independently from a younger age. (They are also the most likely to complain that school isn’t hard enough.)
Black and Latinx students are more likely to be in older, poorer maintained buildings. (The Bronx school buildings are… not good.) Their parents are also more likely to be essential workers and those parents have had their students in the city’s childcare program (about 100,000 kids Alsace been enrolled and attending this whole time). It’s not clear that the daycare program is being canceled and may be more convenient (it has much better hours and the locations are pretty central. Kids were using DOE tablets to do remote school in the spring. So some parents may be opting for that option as long as it exists.) There’s also a greater risk in these communities and most of the city’s deaths occurred in them. And the zero tolerance policies on mask wearing (your student WILL be fully isolated, sent home and not allowed back if they won’t wear their mask) will disproportionately fall on Black and Latinx students.
Schools in America are very much designed for white parents. White people have access to smaller neighborhood schools, have more responsive principals and better maintained schools. So these parents have probably built their lives around their schools.
As for white people leaving NYC, every person I know with a summer/vacation house has moved. It’s not everyone, but it’s also not no one. But housing right outside the city is through the roof.
fdsa says
They’re reporting this like a racial disparity but I think it’s probably a SEC effect, for which race is a poor proxy in NYC. The working-class parents of a Stuyvesant students would be facing a totally different tradeoff than the big law parents of an elementary school student, even if they are all the same race.
Anone says
Do you spank your kids? I live in the south where it’s very common still and I wonder if the people that spank have better behaved 2 to 5 year Olds? I can’t bring myself to do it because I have absolutely horrible memories of my mom spanking and while my daughter exhibits normal acting out, I can generally manage it without spanking. Just not sure if it would be more effective in preventing tantrums, interrupting etc. At age 3.
layered bob says
I grew up rural/evangelical and am still part of a very conservative church, so about 1/3 of our friends spank. Their children are not better behaved than mine or our friends who do not spank.
When they see our children misbehaving the spanking parents always tell us that we should or that spanking would take care of it, but I see their kids acting up just as much overall – they just subsequently get hit for it and our kids don’t get hit. The spanking families’ children will temporarily stop interrupting/crying/whatever when the spank is threatened and while they are in that frightened/subdued state after, but no long term behavior changes.
I asked my mom once if she thought spanking me “worked” when I was little, and she said frankly, “no, but you deserved it.” So not even my spanking mother thought spanking “worked.”
Anonymous says
Yup. Of the five goals of punishment (deterrence, incapacitation, rehabilitation, retribution, and restitution), spanking serves only retribution.
Anonymous says
Nice church that condones hitting children. Jesus was obvi all about that.
Anonymous says
Turn the other cheek, I guess?
layered bob says
church doesn’t condone it and offers parenting classes promoting respectful parenting (how I found out about Janet Lansbury), but lots of members (including me) came out of a “spare the rod spoil the child” cultural background that equated a child’s obedience to their parents with their ability to be obedient to God, so it’s a hard thing for many parents to unlearn. I think many non-religious parents also find themselves wondering about spanking or tempted to, as indicated by this question, even if they ultimately choose not to hit their kids.
Anon says
I don’t think you’ll find anyone here in support of it. I know it’s cultural, but I don’t think it’s more effective.
Anonymous says
Absolutely not. It’s barbaric and ineffective.
Anonymous says
Absolutely not. I was born in 1980 and I only know one kid who was hit by their parents. I don’t spank and none of my friends spank. Plus, all the data shows that spanking is not effective.
Anonymous says
Hard no, absolutely not. Violence begets more violence.
Anonymous says
I was spanked by my parents, but I wouldn’t do it as I want my kid to listen to me, not fear me. But it’s also illegal in Scotland, where I live.
Anon says
No…while it may be cathartic for the parent in some instances, it promotes a culture of fear. I think a lot of people mistake “fear” for “respect.” Parenting is all about building relationships – when you love and are close to your parent, the respect and wish to please will (eventually) come naturally. It is A LOT of work in the young years to establish that foundation of mutual trust – which spanking would certainly undermine – but we hope it pays off down the road. Plus, I don’t want my kids to learn that powerful people have the right to hurt them, for any reason.
Boston Legal Eagle says
No and I don’t think you can prevent developmentally appropriate behavior with spanking. I’m not going to tantrum at my kids to prevent or stop them from tantruming (as much as I want to sometimes!) so in teaching them not to hit I can’t hit them myself. My husband was spanked as a kid and he’s definitely against it too.
Anonymous says
No, but I’ve certainly been tempted (and in those times where I really want to, I’m very understanding of people that do). I have neutral memories of being spanked as a child- like I don’t remember it being awful but also not particularly effective. What stops me is the very strong realization that I will most certainly not be teaching any lesson I want my child to learn, and it’s not at all likely to make the situation better.
My in-laws, in a very conservative church, were incredibly quick to spank their first child- like, when he was one, and probably crying because he was hungry, they would spank. It made all the grandparents uncomfortable and eventually they stopped spanking so much with their subsequent children. Why, I’m not really sure (we are not close to them), but I can tell you the spanking has had a pretty visible and obvious effect on their eldest- he is quick to anger, has a hard time calming down, and reacts very physically to problems.
Anonymous says
Only person who gets spanked in my house is me, consensualy, during gardening
OP says
HAHA love this.
Anon says
+1
Anon says
Tons of research shows that kids who are spanked are more scared of their parents than kids who aren’t spanked. So how much do you like your kid?
(There is literally one time I believe it MIGHT be developmentally appropriate to spank: a child over the age of one and not yet verbal who runs into the street and there are no safe options to keep them physically restrained. But that’s such a tiny window filled with caveats that I would just say, don’t spank.)
Anonymous says
Nope. Even then, does t solve your problem. Doesn’t keep your kid from dying!
Anon says
Scaring your child very, very badly about roads is actually the right move when physical restraint is not an option. I suspect physical restraint would always be an option, but I don’t know your life.
And nothing will keep your kid from dying. The best we can hope for is it happening after we’re gone.
CPA Lady says
No. Also in the south. Prior to having kids, my husband and I discussed it and were kinda on the fence but leaning towards no on it. Both of us were spanked. He has no negative feelings towards it. I was a very defiant child (a real delight) and I always thought my mom was pathetic for spanking me and didn’t want to spank my own kid because it did nothing to deter me. Neither of us felt “abused” or anything like that.
Then we actually had the kid and saw how incredibly frustrating it could be and how angry we could get. At that point we both decided not to. Because I know that if I ever spanked my child it would not be out of “discipline”, it would be out of frustration.
Anonymous says
This. The time you most want to spank your kid is the time you most need to not to.
IHeartBacon says
This. In the worst of fights with my husband, I have wanted to take a baseball bat to his face… but I don’t. If I can keep it together enough not to be violent with my husband (who I swear sometimes deserves it!), I certainly can keep it together enough not to be violent with a child.
Anon says
No way. FYI, there are studies out there that it doesn’t lead to better behaved kids, at least in the long term (I wouldn’t do it even if it were effective, but it’s not).
Anonymous says
I didn’t and my parents didn’t, but I grew up near two families who did.
Family 1 spanked only in the most extreme circumstances (kids run into the street, etc) and the adults were always calm and not angry when they did it. It was a Serious Consequence for the kids but not a way for the adults to take out their anger.
Family 2 spanked with abandon, often when the parents were visibly angry and screaming at the kids at the same time.
I’ll give you one guess which set of kids turned out normal and which set had problems with dr*gs and fighting. I don’t spank but I don’t think it’s inherently abusive when done the way family 1 did. Family 2 abused their kids, in my view.
asdf says
I was spanked, but I was in family 1 (I was born in 1978). My husband and I chose not to spank our kids because my husband was raised in family 2. So long as you’re not family 2 I think being consistent about discipline matters much more than the actual form. Similar behavior should carry similar (proportionate) consequences from both parents.
Anonymous says
Way late to this comment. I have 3 kids. I have only smacked one of them. I have done it twice and both times, she was totally and completely out of control. I slapped her on the cheek. It worked as a reset when nothing else would. She was 3 both times.
I am not proud of it. In hindsight, she was (is) the kid that pushes my buttons the most, and she was in absolute peak button-pushing. I was also post partum and sleep deprived with a newborn.
She’s now 5. She has learned to control her emotions, and I am better rested. It has come close, but each time I pull back because I really do know better. FWIW she’s the middle. It has never even been on the table with my other two kids as they respond to literally any other type of behavior management.
Anon says
I think there’s a certain honesty to “if you push this hard, someone else is going to push you back.” My mom slapped my face once, and she was ABSOLUTELY mortified afterwards (I think she went and bought a bunch of parenting books; she probably would have gotten therapy if that had been on the table). But I wasn’t traumatized at all; I had it coming, I learned the lesson, and I’m glad it was my mom, who I trust, and not someone else, which might have just been frightening? So I hope she’s forgiven herself for being human.
Because humans aren’t always rational, and I think sometimes the feedback we need is the same kind of feedback as a kitten, puppy, or horse needs from its cat, dog, or horse mom when learning boundaries, delivered in roughly the same mode (physically).
However, I think none of these considerations are relevant to the culture of “spanking” which is generally full of head games and transgresses boundaries rather than reinforcing them.
Lily says
I’m 5 weeks pregnant with my second, and have my first prenatal appointment scheduled for 9/23 (I’ll be 10 weeks). I just got a call from a nurse in the midwifery practice (which is part of my normal OB-GYN practice) basically asking if I was ok with not having an early ultrasound (heart beat scan only) and just waiting until the 20 week ultrasound. I think I was taken aback, and since I am not high risk and pretty much know exactly when I conceived, I said ok. Now I’m wondering if that was a mistake and if I should insist on a 8 week ultrasound (apparently this is a COVID precaution they are taking to limit the number of patients at radiology). Thoughts?
dee says
I am 13 weeks pregnant and went for my first appointment at around 8-9 weeks so that I can do the heartbeat. And my next appointment is 5 weeks later. I asked for the longest spacing the dr. is okay with to avoid excessive visits.
Anon says
I thought the 8 week was for dating, so if you’re not sure when you conceived I’d insist. It could affect your due date.
Anon says
Dating scans are most accurate between 8 and 11 weeks, so there’s no reason you have to be seen before 10 weeks. If you don’t know your dates at the 10 week appointment, they refer you for a dating ultrasound. At least that’s how my OB does it. I was confident in my dates but got referred for one anyway because they couldn’t detect the heartbeat with a doppler (everything was fine, they just couldn’t pick it up).
Anon says
I’m a nervous person, I’d want to see the heartbeat ASAP (as well as confirm how many babies are in there!) I’m currently 7 weeks and am being made to wait until 8 weeks, vs the 6 week u/s I had with my first two, and that feels like a long wait! Are you having the nuchal screening done? That would be an u/s around 12 weeks, at least
Anon says
Don’t hesitate to advocate for yourself and ask to be able to go in. I am pregnant in a hard-hit area in March/April and still went in at 7, 8, and 12 weeks with ultrasounds at 8 and 12 weeks during that time.
Anon says
I gather from this board that it’s unusual, but my OB only did the 20 week scan even in non-Covid times, barring a complication. It was fine. Hearing the heartbeat is what really matters in the beginning. My OB didn’t see you for the first appointment and Doppler until 10 weeks.
However, I think I was the rare mom who never found ultrasounds to be this glowy magical experience. Even abdominal ultrasounds were physically uncomfortable for me and I felt like I was just lying there waiting for them to tell me something was wrong. One of the ultrasound techs said I was more tense than anyone she’s ever seen. I guess someone up there has a sense of humor because now I have to get regular ultrasounds for a health condition. Still hate it. ?
2 weeks to sort childcare says
More School Questions:
Yesterday we got an email from our school (it is a pre-school) that informed us instead of offering before/ after-care for total coverage of 7:30 am – 6 pm, they will only be able to offer school day (8:30/8:45 drop off – 3:45 pm + after school until 5:00 pm). This means 2 hours less childcare per day.
Kiddo is 3 and an only child. The pre-school program is bilingual (something we value), 2 blocks from our home, has outstanding facilities etc. (definitely a step up from the daycare) and is a really really good fit for our son (obviously why we picked it – in addition to proximity to home). My office officially fully reopens mid September. Hubby is home until December. Maybe possible that normal childcare will open in Jan at the school.
Option 1: Give up on preschool program (uncertain that we would get in next year – very hard historically to get into in year 2). Forfeit say $10k in prepaid tuition (balance for the year due Sep 1), go back to normal daycare, with caveat that since we have given up our spot we now only have 4 days coverage and would need to find 1 more day.
Option 2: proceed with school know that 5 pm pick up increases probability of logging in after bedtime. A recently laid off neighbor can likely get her kiddo and ours to school in the AMs (e.g. we do morning drop off to her) – and we would work with them to figure out a morning plan if / when he gets a job. Hope for the best or look for more permanent before / after care for January. (care + school would be more expensive than Option 1 – not impossible for us, but a factor).
I think given the regulations it is slightly less likely that the daycare shuts down for extended periods BUT that is a crapshoot.
what would you do? Certainty now for the whole year with second choice care (assuming we can find coverage for Wednesdays) or hope for the best at school?
Anonymous says
I’d do option 2 and figure out before/after as necessary. That’s essentially what we chose. Our pre-k day was shorted to 8:00-2:15. We’re still wrestling a bit with whether kiddo will do some aftercare or not. We’re working from home and would have to login a bunch at night if we don’t do after care. But we feel that it is a little reckless to have kiddo in two different childcare settings instead of only one cohort for the timebeing. Our school district’s aftercare program is at the local Y.
Anonymous says
I would go with preschool. It would be easier to deal with a late drop-off every day than no care at all one day per week. I would also be hesitant to give up a spot in the program that was so clearly the best fit.
Anon says
to me option 2 is a no brainer. how early in the morning does DH need to start working? If he can drop off at 8:30, is starting by 9 ok in his office? i don’t know where you live, but your office might not reopen as planned, DH’s office might reopen later, office might allow for some virtual working
OP says
I have a standing (in person) meeting at my office at 9 AM everyday (senior team has been back since June) – that obligation is a WHOLE other topic. Three times per week hubby has a “mandatory” call at 8:05. We can both miss these respective meetings sporadically but not consistently – so support from the neighbor is pretty important. I still think the better program is the better choice.
In pre-times, I was at my desk 8:00 – 5:30 (plus commute on either side) and still logged in at night sometimes.
Boston Legal Eagle says
Our daycare is allowing either a 7:30-4:30 or 8-5 schedule, so our hours have been reduced but it’s been fine. We are both working from home still and will be for the foreseeable future/I have no issues with asking for longer WFH to cover childcare. I log in for a bit after bedtime, but I did that before too, so it’s not too different. So I would go with your preferred preschool.
Anon says
#2 for sure.