You can display this striking scarf organizer rather than hiding it in your closet.
I’ve had a few Umbra products and am always struck by their modern, sophisticated design. This scarf organizer is made from smooth metal that won’t snag your delicate scarves. Simply weave them through the openings so you can quickly choose the perfect one for your outfit. Hang it on a closet rod with the metal hook or on a wall.
Umbra’s Triangle Pendant Scarf Organizer is $17.99 at The Container Store. It also comes in a square shape
This post contains affiliate links and CorporetteMoms may earn commissions for purchases made through links in this post. For more details see here. Thank you so much for your support!
We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.
Sales of Note…
(See all of the latest workwear sales at Corporette!)
- Nordstrom – The Half-Yearly Sale has started! See our thoughts here.
- Ann Taylor – $50 off $150; $100 off $250+; extra 30% off all sale styles
- Banana Republic Factory – Up to 50% off everything + extra 25% off purchase
- Eloquii – 60% off all tops
- J.Crew – Up to 50% off “dressed up” styles (lots of cute dresses!); extra 50% off select sale
- J.Crew Factory – Up to 60% off everything; 60% off 100s of summer faves; extra 60% off clearance
- Loft – 40% off tops; 30% off full-price styles
- Lands’ End – 30% off full-price styles
- Talbots – 25-40% off select styles
- Zappos – 28,000+ sale items (for women)! Check out these reader-favorite workwear brands on sale, and some of our favorite kid shoe brands on sale.
Kid/Family Sales
- J.Crew – Up to 50% off kids’ camp styles; extra 50% off select sale
- Lands’ End – 30% off full-price styles
- Hanna Andersson – Up to 50% off summer pajamas; up to 50% off all baby styles (semi-annual baby event!)
- Carter’s – Summer deals from $5; up to 60% off swim
- Old Navy – 30% off your order; kid/toddler/baby tees $4
- Target – Kids’ swim from $8; summer accessories from $10
Anon says
Ugh — about a month ago, we were at my parent’s house, and my daughter lost her most special blanket while there. My parents live on a 30 acre farm with a creek and lots of hiding places in the forest. We are sure it was lost at the house and have turned the inside of the home (which isn’t very large) upside down, so we are at this point pretty confident that she had it outside, put it down to run off with the other kids, forgot it, and it was left outside somewhere (this is consistent with past behavior).
I feel a tremendous sense of loss and guilt that I’m struggling to manage — she still asks for it and cries regularly that she misses it. She also is our third child, and I have carefully tucked away her big brothers’ lovies in keepsake boxes with the outfits they came home from the hospital wearing. We give everything away as soon as they outgrow it bc we don’t have room to store stuff, so these boxes are really all they will have in terms of mementos from their childhood. We have also carried all three lovies across continents and on numerous camping trips, and then lost this one in a familiar place totally randomly. I also hate that hers both feels gone forever, but also there is still a chance we find it.
At this point, we have exhausted the likely places it would have been left outside – so it has either been carried off by an animal (unlikely) or washed down the stream after a big rain (possible) or just put down where it absolutely blends into the leaves/dead grass (the dang blanket is as small as a washcloth and the exact color of dead grass or leaves), which is most likely. My parent’s house is my special place, but I feel like if I just look “one more time” at the creek or in the woods, I’ll find it – so I’m constantly walking the property looking for it. In some ways, I wish we had the finality of never going back because I feel tremendous hope whenever we go out there and then sadness when we – again – crisscross the property and it remains missing. I also feel guilt b/c the night she lost it was a total random rush trip out there – my husband didn’t want to go because we had to rush back to our house that evening. Typically I’d check to make sure she had this blanket when she came in from outside, but we were in such a rush, I didn’t think to check. I guess I’m not sure what I’m looking for here, but just ugh, I feel like I let her down. I’ve got some sadness from other stuff going on in my life that I’m sure I’m channeling into this, but any tips to help me manage this? We are headed out there for the long weekend, and I’d like to enjoy my family – not be hyperfocused on finding this little guy.
Anonymous says
Honestly I think you should explore therapy. This feels like anxiety from you. Your daughter will be totally fine. She is obviously loved and cherished. If you’re not feeling like you are handling this well, and wishing you never had to return to your beloved family home is not handling it well!, use this as a jumping off point for a conversation with a therapist.
Anon says
Totally fair!! I’m definitely worried about something else more amorphous right now, but this is a very tangible thing to worry about. And to clarify – I wish we had LOST it elsewhere and I had the finality of it being gone (i.e., if I lost it at an Airbnb, it’s not like we’d be back every weekend with the opportunity to look for it), not that I don’t want to go back to my happy place. I just hate that my daughter asks to look for it, and I still feel like it’s possible to find it, in a place that we visit weekly.
Anon says
I don’t think you need to see a therapist every time you have an emotional reaction to something. It’s okay to feel your feelings! And show your kids it is okay to have feelings. I would feel badly too and would likely keep looking for it.
But maybe you can think of other things to put in the memory box. If you do find it, it will likely be randomly and a happy accident.
I once spent a long time digging through sand where my son lost a metal star and it wasn’t as special as this, so no shade on caring.
AIMS says
Give yourself some grace. You didn’t ruin her childhood. It sucks. We lost a favorite stuffy on a trip and I still feel awful. I get it! But I also try to put it in perspective. We had a huge move when I was a kid and most of my ‘momentous” have been lost in transition and it’s honestly fine.
I would also re-examine what will be special about this or anything else for your daughter. I had a very favorite toy that my grandmother threw out (literally) because she thought it was old and raggedy. I still remember the toy and asking my dad to find it in his house when I was a teenager and feeling nostalgic, and him telling me it must have been thrown away in one of her cleaning sprints. But then – and this is the part I love and cherish now – he went and tried to buy me an approximation of something similar and it was such a fail but I LOVE that replacement toy so much b/c it was truly the thought that counts and the idea of my dad looking for something to fix this and getting me this particular object when I was 15 or 16 is just very sweet to me. I say this very gently but the first outfits and all that are maybe more for you than your kids. What they will remember is the love that is associated with certain objects and you haven’t lost that or the ability to leave her something that will give her that feeling.
I would focus on dealing with her feelings about the loss now and try to come up with something that will make her comforted. And you never know when things turn up once you stop looking.
Anon says
I love all of that – thank you, this helps a lot :) And you are right, I just need to pivot away from looking to it being gone, and maybe that will give both of us some space to move on.
Anonymous says
How old is your daughter? Make a special trip, buy a new lovie (not a replacement, just a new friend), and put that one in a keepsake box for her. If she’s having trouble, write/tell/imagine together a story about all the different creatures that could have found the blanket and brought it to their home. Maybe it’s a bunny blanket! Maybe some bears are using it as a pillow. How lucky they are to have found it!
My 3rd has gotten stitches twice and she’s not even 5. Sometimes that’s life with two older sibling.
And as the adult I would just let this go.
Anonymous says
Oh, and maybe one day you’ll find it! That would be a fun day, even if you and kiddo are both adults.
This isn’t the same, but when one of my kids was 3 she let go of a balloon and just LOST IT. Inconsolable. No other balloon would do. The only thing that helped was telling stories about the adventures it was having. She’s 7 and still talks about it.
An.On. says
I’ve been reading Julie Donaldson’s Paper Dolls to my daughter, and it references the loss of childhood mementos. It’s probably best for readers around 2-4 years old. And fwiw I lost a beloved blanket of mine when I was a kid and I think it was more traumatic for my mother than me. She’ll still tell stories of digging through trash cans frantically looking for it (we were at a public food court) but I honestly don’t even remember it anymore.
Anonymous says
Gently, I am not sure this is about the lovey…which you alluded to. Therefore I think therapy could really help you process whatever is actually going on. Your job as a parent is not to shield your children from anything bad ever happening to them, but to give them empathy and tools to cope with hard things. Your guilt and ruminating over this could be doing more harm to your child than the actual loss of the lovey. Maybe try BetterHelp?
anon says
This seems like a lot of angst for a blanket, honestly. I get the sentimental value, but also, stuff happens.
Anon says
Agreed.
Anon says
+1
My parents had kept everyone’s favorite stuffed animal in the attic. When they moved when we were adults we all had them trash / donate the stuffed animal. No one felt the need to keep it later on.
Anonymous says
My very special Dolly was lost several times during my childhood, most notably at Mount Vernon I believe. I missed it, and I still remember it at age 46, but I was fine. Truly, this is not a big deal. Accept that it is gone and that your daughter can cope without it because of all the other coping tools you have given her. Do not keep looking for it! It isn’t helping anyone. Honestly, your fixation on it is more likely to be upsetting to your daughter at this point than if you can just have the confidence that she can cope without it. If you are this upset about it, how can she move on?
It is also not your responsibility to prevent her from losing things and dealing with the unpleasant consequences of that, nor is it your responsibility or even a good idea for you to prevent anything bad ever happening to her. How can she learn resilience if you are solving all her problems?
Anon says
I’m officially declaring it gone for you. It’s been a month, outdoors, in an area with wildlife. Blanket is lost and gone forever. I’m sorry.
No more looking. It’s not going to magically appear. Time to buy a replacement/new lovey. Depending on your daughter’s age would it be helpful for you two to create a story about what happened to it? Maybe the bunnies took it to use as a blanket in their burrow or a bird took it for their nest etc.
anonM says
+1. And you did not let your daughter down.
Anon says
“I feel a tremendous sense of loss and guilt…”
This line stood out to me as being about more than the blanket. Those emotions are too intense for this disappointing and sad thing that happened. I second the calls to explore some therapy. You’re a good mom who cares about her kids – you have that great foundation. But I think YOU will be happier and better able to manage these setbacks with a little assistance from a professional.
I also think it’s really important to work on guilt, specifically. My best friend is really struggling with intense feelings of guilt about every aspect of her parenting and it’s exhausting for her (and for her family and friends, unfortunately). She’s been in regular therapy, but it seems really hard to combat. I think it’s worth trying though.
Anon says
+1
ElisaR says
Hi OP, I just want to say I understand your pain! I did the same thing 2 weekends ago and I feel awful about it. In my case it’s my 5 year old son’s and he’s kind of a bruiser, but so sweet with this lovey. I want him to have this gentle self soothing item for as long as he can. I know that it’s my fault we left at it a hotel (staff says it’s gone) and I feel awful. Hang in there. I think ultimately we feel worse about it than they do.
Anon says
Thanks all for your kind words and commiseration. It is a loss, but one to process and move on. The real issue is that one of my sons is medically complex, and will start an experimental treatment later this year. While absolutely critical to his longterm health and survival, it will come with some devastating lifelong and short term side effects. I’m sure I’m channeling a lot of anticipatory grief into a very tangible event that I intellectually know doesn’t have actual effects. In other words, it’s been a safe place to process some grief that needs to go somewhere, but I’m ready to move one.
Anonymous says
I just want to say that if we lost my son’s most special lovey I would have felt exactly as you did. He loves it so much, sleeps with it every night, cuddles with it when he is sick or upset, it’s been all over the world with us, etc… I would be really tough to lose for all of us. Hugs. Hoping you can find some closure and move on.
Anon says
That really and truly means a lot :) Thank you.
Cerulean says
This is very insightful. I’m so sorry for everything you and your family are going through <3
Anonymous says
+1
anonM says
Yes, so sorry you and you family have so much on your plate. You’re very self aware that that is impacting your response on other issues. Hope this weekend will give you some joy and you can enjoy what sounds like some beautiful land.
momofthree says
I hope this anonymous online community was helpful in trying to relieve you of some of your guilt.
I too have done extreme things when it comes to my kids lovies- one time we left his bear (also my husband’s stuffy) in a bag next to the car & drove off. I frantically headed back on my own after we got home & got stuck in a presidential motorcade trying to find it :) It’s a heroic story for me but I’m not even sure the kid remembers at this point.
I too lost my blankie when I was young and my parents did what they could to find it. I still remember the blanket & the fact that I lost it, but I don’t blame my parents for not trying hard enough to find it. There’s also a family story about me losing my teddy on an island when I was a baby & they couldn’t find it. I was distraught, then they went and bought 4 of them, one of which became the teddy that I actually remember. Maybe you can offer a new different blankie to your daughter? create a story around picking it out together or it being special for a different reason? There’s also something lovely about the blanket becoming part of the fabric/landscape of a place you both hold so dear. Probably not the right time to bring up to her, but could be helpful framing for you.
Anonymous says
Big hugs to you.
Baby name Martha says
Is Martha really such a bad name? We are set on naming baby girl (due in 5 weeks) Martha but the comment by a poster called Martha the other week about being bullied and HATING it as her name now make me second guess. We are currently in Germany where it is not common but also not unheard of as a baby name (I know of three kids under five with that name) but will be moving back to the US at the end of the year so interested in y’alls opinion…
anon says
I don’t think it’s a pretty name, at all. It’s old fashioned but not in a quirky, cool way. I know that’s harsh, but if you’re wanting honest feedback, there you have it.
anon says
Yeah, I agree. I don’t like it.
Anobymous says
I almost commented on that post but I figured, it’s her name, I shouldn’t police how she feels about it. But I think it’s a lovely name. You don’t hear it often but it’s also not a name like Zeppelin (the literal name of a little girl I know). I also knew a spicy Martha growing up so that influences my feelings about it. I hated my name growing up, but when I went to college I knew 22 Sarahs, so I kind of grew into my unusual name. It’s also not unusual anymore but I’m not sure how I feel about that. Kind of like my name got co-opted by the generation after me. Oh well. Haters gon hate. Name your baby whatever you like!
Anon says
It’s totally a lovely name. Also don’t listen to anyone on the internet about names. Just go with what you want to call your kid everyday. Who cares what others think?
Anonymous says
I truly love it
octagon says
It’s a bit old-fashioned but there are two Marthas in my son’s grade (2nd). One goes by Mimi.
Mary Moo Cow says
I like it! I’m not a Martha, tho. I also gave my kids names that were popular in America in the 30’s and aren’t often heard today (but seem to inspire fondness because people think of their grandmother when they hear them.) Martha is a name like that to me: relatively easy for my kids to learn to spell and pronounce, likely to be the only one in the class, a name they can grow into. For my oldest, the more “dated” name, we chose to have her go by first and middle name as a double name because it felt more playful or young for a kid. So maybe that’s an option, too? Or perhaps a fun nickname will come along if she really doesn’t like it (like Kit Kittredge didn’t like her given Margaret Mildred.) I could be biased as a longtime fan of the George and Martha books, though.
An.On. says
Would Marta be a reasonable compromise? It’ll sound the same in German, but it doesn’t sound quite as “old” to me as an American. Unfortunately, I don’t know anyone under the age of 60 named Martha. It’s not come back into style the way some others have.
Cb says
Yeah, I love the name Marta.
Anon says
Yes, Marta > Martha!
Anon says
Fwiw, Marta is a pretty common name in Spanish, and given the large Hispanic population in the US many people will likely assume your child is from a Spanish-speaking family and not make any connection to German.
I actually prefer Martha to Marta but acknowledge that’s probably for personal reasons (an ex-Bf’s mother was a Marta, lol).
anon says
I can’t hear that name without thinking of Marta Karolyi, which is … not good.
Anon says
I agree, that’s the immediate association for me too.
Anon says
It does make me think of the soccer player Marta and she would be awesome to be associated with. However, I more strongly associate it with the Sound of Music, so I think the German / Austrian association is still very strong.
I actually love names like Marta that are common in many different languages and cultures!
There are a lot of Spanish names I love that I can’t use (we’re the most basic WASP family ever), but Marta would be appropriate I think.
Anon says
Yeah I think Marta crosses cultures for sure.
And you cannot stop people’s assuming. I have a name that crosses cultures and people assume all the time. It is what it is. My parents actually selected my name from an English woman but people often assume I am Latina or Middle Eastern.
Anonymous says
I like the name Martha and I really don’t like the name Marta.
Anonymous says
I work with several Millennial and Gen Z coworkers from Eastern Europe who are Martas. So in my head I actually associate it with them – wearing trendy glasses and bold lipstick and talking about user experience design.
All this to say I think name associations are different for every person and if you like Martha, go for it.
Anonymous says
People will spell Marta wrong constantly, if that’s a concern.
Emma says
It does sound a bit old fashioned to me but there is a 6 yo Martha in my social circle so it may be coming back into fashion.
Anon says
I think it’s fine. It’s not my favorite, and not one of the names we ever considered for girls, but I don’t think it’s bad by any means. I haven’t met any Marthas, but if I met one I wouldn’t think “aww what a cute name” but I also wouldn’t think “ugh why did these parents do this to their kid?” which I have thought about plenty of other names (mainly overly twee names or butchered spellings of normal names). It’s just…fine.
Anon says
I personally don’t care for the name but I don’t think a child would be bullied for it. I’m 30 and had a Martha in my high school class and it seemed fine.
I do think Marta would be a fresher take. It’s also an older name but feels more modern and sleek to me. It could also be a nice homage to your time in Germany.
Anon says
I went to school with a Martha and it was a dorky name then, but now it seems like it should be cool again. When I read that I was kind of surprised that it wasn’t a more popular baby name.
AwayEmily says
I adore it and have a good friend with a 8yo Martha. I asked my friend and there has never been an issue with bullying and she gets lots of compliments on her name.
Anon says
I have two separate friends named Martha, both are ~32-33. I also know of one five year old named Martha. It’s uncommon but I think it’s pretty! Personally I like it worlds better than some other old fashioned names like Hazel and Olive that seem to be having a moment.
Anonymous says
There’s a Dr. Who companion called Martha, she’s cool and smart so I associate that name with good things! Also it was the 500th most popular girls’ name in the US In 2005, so there are like 800 18-year-old Marthas running around somewhere. If you like it, I don’t think it’s awful.
NYCer says
I think it is a completely fine name. It wasn’t on my list of girls names, but my daughters’ names probably weren’t on OP’s list, and that is ok. Old fashioned names are popular in my circle, so I cannot imagine someone in today’s world getting bullied for having that name.
I like Martha more than Marta FWIW.
Anon says
It’s beautiful and classic. There’s a professional mountain biker racer named Martha who is a totally badass (age about 20?) I don’t know of anyone else with the name, but that would be good enough for me :)
EDAnon says
I think it’s classic and nice too. Plus easy to spell. My son would call her Marfa which is adorable to me.
Lyssa says
One thing that struck me is that when that poster was growing up, it was an old lady name. (My late grandmother was a Martha, so I consistently hear it in my grandfather’s “old married couple constantly bickering” voice (don’t feel bad for grandma Martha, believe me, she gave it back 10-fold! They were a riot.))
But now, most of those old ladies are gone. So it’s more a classic old-fashioned name than an old lady name, and I think that’s different.
Mad Martha says
I am that poster. Sorry to give you second thoughts – that’s the challenge with discussions of names of any kind.
I won’t list all the reasons it was traumatic as a kid. I’ll just ask for trust on that. I promise I’m a well-adjusted person today contributing positively to society! But, I agree with this take. I think “old” names are far more acceptable today and your child would probably fare better than me.
TheElms says
No, its not a bad name. If you like it you should stick with it. You’ll never make everyone happy and all names have connotations. To me, it does sound old fashioned in a way that I think other names from that era don’t. Mabel or maybe Dorothy were probably a similar sort of name before they got popular-ish again. Others that seem similar to me are Vera and Cordelia.
Mattie would be a cute nickname for Martha or Mae would work too. Mara might also be a nice alternative to Martha that is similarly uncommon but doesn’t feel as old fashioned.
DLC says
I think Martha is a lovely name and if it’s the name you love don’t let other people sway you. I think we maybe underestimate how a child can own a name, despite the baggage that might come with it. (There are exceptions, of course… like I would avoid Adolf) My child has a very specific name, yes he was named after a very specific artist and people who hear his name immediately ask if that’s whom he was named after. But you know what? To his friends at school, he is the first of that name that they encounter… he gets to define that name to them. His friends don’t have the cultural context or baggage that grown ups have.
Also- it doesn’t matter what we think of Martha, her contemporaries will have a different take on the name because trends come and go. What a certain demographic (and specifically the very narrow demographic on this board) thinks of this name is unlikely an indicator on how a name will resonate in 10/15/20 years from now.
Kids will find a reason to bully other kids. It’s never truly about the name.
Anon says
I think it’s sweet but I’d also think about nicknames. We have an Edith, which I think has similar vibes, but we call her Edie. Is there a nickname you like as well so you can pivot if you feel like doing so?
FWIW, Edie sometimes introduces herself as Edith. She likes having a formal and informal version of her name, which I think is funny. She’s 8.
Lise says
I like Martha! The only one I know personally is a sort-of-socialite (but a cool funny one, not the stuffy kind) in her early 50s. I know more Martas, because I’m Eastern European, and really like it too.
Anonymous says
To me Martha is like Edna: a name that we do not need to revisit. Also I cannot separate the name from Martha Stewart. I’d be very supportive of an alternative like Marta (or Marissa, or Marisol, or Madeline, or Marion…there are so many great M names!)
ElisaR says
Martha is a sweet name.
I love it says
I think it’s so cute! Go for it and ignore the haters.
Anon says
Don’t care for Martha but Marta or the nicknames Mimi or Mattie are cute.
Anonymous says
There is a brewery on Martha’s Vineyard called Bad Martha’s. She’s a mermaid. Ever since we went there my oldest has been lamenting that her name is not Martha.
Anon says
Haha! There’s a Sweet Martha’s cookie place that’s pretty famous in Minnesota.
Mad Martha says
Ha. I get Bad Martha merch a lot. No more pint glasses, please, family…I also happen to live in the northeast.
Anonymous says
OP, if you’re on the fence about Martha and don’t like Marta, how about Mara? Maryn?
Anonymous says
I think it’s a nice name.
FWIW, most of the people in my life who hated their names growing up are ones who have very common popular names like Heather or Jessica and even they have adjusted.
Anon says
Counterpoint: all the 80s Jessicas and Emilys and Jennifers I know never really cared about being Emily M or whatever. I have an unusual name and absolutely hated it. It’s similar to a much more common name and I was constantly called that name or a combination of the two names and it was just awful. We gave our kid a super popular name and so far having to use her last initial occasionally seems like no big deal.
anon says
We are considering a move to another city/state for a job opportunity. We have a kid in daycare and one in 2nd. I don’t think it’d be a big deal for the younger one but the 2nd grader is very emotional/dramatic and I’m worried about how she’d take it. She loves her school, neighbors, and friends. Any advice on how others who have made this move have helped their kids through it? A potential complication is that we aren’t sure that we’d be able to move in time for the new school year. Would it be a huge mistake to move her half way through the year?
GCA says
We haven’t moved just yet ( we are moving over the summer with a rising 3rd and rising K-er), but something to consider is that it won’t get any easier as they get older…
Cb says
Yeah, that knocks about in the back of my head as well. At some point, our current set-up won’t be sustainable, and would it be better to move now? But it’s not to where we want to live longterm, and what if we wanted to move back, etc…
Anon2 says
We just did this. My school age kids are in 2nd/K. We sold our house last June, moved in with my parents and they started the school year in that new town, then we found and bought our new house in a different town and they switched schools in January.
Was it ideal? No. Was it fine overall? Absolutely. It hasn’t been the easiest year but the kids absolutely took it in stride and we are finally feeling settled. Kids that age make friends (even “best friends”) very quickly, and my kids did great socially and academically at both new schools. (Getting involved in a sport both seasons also helped because they felt part of a team and broadened their social circle.)
If this is a good move for your family, do it without hesitation. Things that seem so big in the moment end up being a blip or a funny “war story” to tell a year later.
Mary Moo Cow says
Every kid will be different, so it’s hard to say how your kid will react. She might be super emotional about it and bear a grudge for the rest of her life or she might adapt quickly and beautifully. I moved halfway through the school year in first grade and it was sad and hard for a few weeks, and it slowly got better. I was a very shy kid, leaving the town I was born in. When we moved over the summer after that, it was harder because I had an empty summer with no friends to face. We also have a family in our neighborhood now who moved with 6 weeks left of school to go, and kids have made school friends and are signed up for summer activities, etc., so there’s another story in favor of moving during school.
We moved to a new neighborhood on day 2 of this school year, and my youngest talked about missing the old house for weeks. She still brings it up occasionally, but when she’s not thinking about it, she seems to genuinely love this new house and new neighborhood — so sometimes you can’t go by just what they tell you.
You know your kid best and how much to prepare her. We kept it matter of fact and low key and sent them for an overnight when we had to do the major purging and staging and second day unpacking. We also read some books about moving (like Evelyn Del Ray is Moving Away) and answered all their questions but didn’t harp on it. If it is a good move for your family, go for it and good luck!
Anon says
If you’re going to move, do it: during the summer and as young as possible. The older you get, the harder it will be. Moving mid-year would be really challenging too – could one parent move over the summer with one kid and the other stay behind to wrap things up if needed?
Would you plan on moving again or will this be the final move? Is this move bringing you closer to family or friends? Tbh, I’m pretty against moving kids if it’s “only” for a job, so I empathize with your daughter. Is this job opportunity a nice to have move or essential for your family?
Anonymous says
I’m the opposite end. Parents gotta live moving is not abuse.
anon says
I also wouldn’t be willing to split up my family for 6 months unless there were extenuating circumstances, but I realize that’s not a popular view.
Anon says
It’s not abuse but it’s something I’d avoid if I could.
I also took a big step back in my career to live near my parents. We all have different priorities but giving my kids a strong sense of “home” with nearby family was important to me.
Anon says
It’s not abuse, but that doesn’t mean it’s great for kids. I understand that sometimes moves have to happen for work or family reasons, but it’s not something I’d do lightly, especially once kids are school age.
My husband is an academic. If he’d been denied tenure, we would have moved, regardless of the ages of our kids. I wouldn’t have told him “welp, you’ve gotta find a new career because we can’t move the kids.” But we’re not making moves for fun. It happens that his mid-career publication record is a lot stronger than his early career publication record and he could likely be at a fancier university in a more desirable location making more money if we’d been willing to move post-tenure, but we weren’t interested in moving when his current job is more than satisfactory and we’re settled in our current place. I realize every industry is different and this isn’t going to be a perfect analogy for everyone. But that’s how we think about it.
Anonymous says
+1
It’s not abuse, but it is something I’d go to lengths to avoid. I’d rather have a meh job with family stability. But, if I couldn’t put food on the table anymore or there were truly no jobs for me anymore then we’d re-evaluate. I work in a niche field so there are two places I could work in my metro area: my employer and my former employer. I stick with jobs that are more stagnant than I’d prefer because there are only so many options locally and I won’t move my kids unless it’s necessary.
I’d rather pivot my career than move my family. Especially since we live 15 mins from my parents and my brother and SIL and I’d never want to give that up. If we did have to move, I’d only consider moving near my husbands family or near my other brother. I grew up seeing my grandparents and cousins weekly and with some of my closest friends being my parents’ close and long-time friends’ kids. Having long and deep connections to a place is important to me. I have both my blood family and my chosen family nearby.
My original career was at the State Department so I did give up my chosen career path in favor of a) proximity to family and b) stability and not having to move. I do miss my old career and occasionally wonder “what if” but I’m very happy where I am.
More Sleep Would Be Nice says
I’m in the same boat as Anonymous at 11:45.
We live in a red state where the policies suck, and the state is increasingly policing our diverse city/county. However – I grew up here, my mom and sibling are here, plus extended/chosen family, and my kids regularly hang out with cousins and my BFFs kids. It is also far more diverse by many measures than where we were before, and that is important for me. We – especially DH – had to make some career tradeoffs but it is well worth it.
Sometimes opportunities and things happen that are once-in-a-lifetime, too good to pass up. DH used to work for a fed agency that has a post in Geneva – if we ever had the opp to consider that for a few years, it’d be hard to pass up. My BFF’s sister’s kids spent late elementary-junior high years in the middle east, went to school with kids from all over the world, traveled extensively through Asia during breaks, and then were back stateside for HS.
It’s hard in end-stage capitalism when SO many things are tied to one’s work (health insurance, retirement, etc.) to say what is right or wrong.
Anon says
It depends on the opportunity, imo. Truly unable to find a job locally or a job in the new location pays a life changing amount of money or it’s an opportunity to move closer to family, go for it and the kids will deal.
Moving for an opportunity that’s a better fit or a more exciting job or a moderate raise is selfish.
Anon says
In this market you don’t have much control over when you can buy and sell houses. I wouldn’t tank an otherwise promising situation just because you couldn’t move by August. It’s a good point to consider whether this is potentially a final move or if you’ll be zigzagging around for more jobs in the future. If it’s an area you’ll be settled for a good amount of time, an extra few months either way won’t make much difference. Accompanying our children through difficult times (and in this case, to ultimate safety and security) is exactly how they build resilience.
Anonymous says
Kids can build resilience without having their lives uprooted
Anon says
+1 also I hate that we excuse so many things that harm kids with “kids are resilient.” I’ve heard the same reasoning from both sides of the political spectrum about everything from school closures during Covid to active shooter drills, and I don’t like it.
Anon says
I’m 10:28 and I hate that used as an excuse/reason, too (like, all the flippant comments about “just divorce him”). But if moving is a better opportunity for the whole family, then it’s silly to turn it down because of a 7yo. And it’s not so much an excuse as a silver lining…this is something that will feel very hard in the moment but is a low-stakes way to overcome adversity, find your inner strength and build resilience. It’s good for kids to experience minor hardships and disappointments that ultimately lead them to a better place.
Anon says
Also, moving houses with your whole family for a better situation generally does not “harm” kids. It might make them sad, and it might be hard, but those things do not equal bad/harmful. Maybe a move give their parents more work/life balance, brings them closer to extended family, etc
Anonymous says
Yeah, a move can often benefit kids in ways they can’t see. They only see what they are sad about, not the big picture.
Anonymous says
Counterpoint: My family moved cities at the end of seventh grade and I was really happy about it. We moved from an awful smoggy place with horrible traffic and schools with gangs and asphalt playgrounds to a nicer place where the schools had grass and no fights or trash can fires. Moving is not always bad.
EDAnon says
My husband moved in 4th grade and it was hard but he was much happier at his new school. He moved over the summer.
My nephew moved (to a rural school district from a suburban one) in November and had an awful experience. He loved his school, teacher, and classmates. I think it was a huge mistake. If you do it, I would do it at summer or at winter break. Mid-semester was super hard.
Anonymous says
I moved around the world in second grade and switched schools 2 times that year (1 school when we first arrived in the US, 1 when we moved to our long term housing, and then at the start of 3rd grade a new school opened that we were zoned for which split the kids I was just getting to know). My sister was in K. It wasn’t ideal but we managed. What helped was that once we settled in, we didn’t move again.
Anon says
+1
My husband and I agreed that once the kids started K we would only move once (as a maximum, the plan is not to move at all).
TheElms says
I moved the summer before 7th grade, then during winter break mid way through 8th grade and then again going into 11th grade. The first two were to different countries and then the last one was back to the US. Moving going into 11th grade was hard but the other two moves were pretty much fine. It was hard to make new friends (but that was always hard for me and in some ways the fresh starts were good.) All were related to my dad’s job and for good reasons. We didn’t have to go but the opportunities were significant for him and I was old enough to understand the benefits to us as a family.
Anon says
How far is the move and what sort of network do you have in the new location?
ElisaR says
moving is not abuse but I moved between 2nd and 3rd grade and it remains a major life experience 35 years later….. I did not adjust well.
Anon says
+1 just because it’s not abuse doesn’t mean it’s good for the kids and / or won’t impact them for a while
Anon says
Counterpoint: i moved halfway through 1st grade and again before 8th grade and it was fine
Anonymous says
Yeah I moved several times growing up and it was fine? I’m from a military family though so much more common in our circles.
Anon says
interesting. i also moved the summer after 2nd grade and started a new school in a new state in 3rd grade and it was great! A much better fit for my family and me
EDAnon says
I think your point is important. Is the school a better fit for the kid? If yes, it will likely be easier. If no, I would make everything else as easy as possible on the kid.
Anonymous says
This is my DH. He moved as a kid and did not adjust well at all. His brother had no issues. It really depends on the kid.
Fallen says
I moved in 7th grade to a different country, 8th grade to a different school, and 9th grade to a magnet program at a high school (last one by choice). All super rough and would not recommend.
And I also moved my daughter in 1st grade and then again in 3rd (due to my academic job). 1st grade was no problem. 3rd grade was rough for a week but she has adjusted incredibly well and I get several texts a week with girls wanting to have her at their house, she has a ton of friends, thrived academically, etc. so overall I think 2nd grade is still fine. Occasionally she says she misses her best friend from 1st/2nd grade, whatever that may mean (they clicked incredibly well).
And maybe it’s the kids personality? My daughter is incredibly social and has zero problem making friends anywhere we go, while I was more introverted.
FVNC says
We have moved: summer after daughter’s kindergarten year, summer after daughter’s first grade year, and summer after daughter’s 3rd grade year. Four elementary schools in five years. Also had one in daycare (now kinder). It worked out fine for my kids; they are happy, well-adjusted and have a nice friend group. However, my daughter is the oppos i te of emotional / dramatic — even so, the move between 3rd and 4th grades was by far the hardest because she had to leave her group of friends. If you are going to move, I’ll echo the others and tell you to do it when the kids are as young as possible, and ideally during summer. Good luck with the decision!
(FWIW, we’re done moving now; it will impact my husband’s career, but we could start to see the impact on our kids. Sure they would have been FINE, but it’s so nice for them to feel settled and part of a permanent group.)
momofthree says
In response to your question, would it be possible to wait until the end of the year to move the kids (i.e., have one parent start renting in the new city) or all move out earlier, maybe in a rental where you want to buy so they could start school earlier?
Mid-year isn’t ideal, but as others have said, kids can adapt. I think it’s most important to be clear on the plans once they’ve been decided and not let the kids’ reactions sway the decision (not saying you shouldn’t listen to their feelings and try to make the transition easier, but if you’re moving, then that’s what you’re doing).
My family had a situation where one of my parents got a dream job far away, the parents debated moving to the new city, didn’t find the ideal school set up/ caved to the kids demands to stay, so we stayed where we were & parent commuted/ was rarely around. It was a disaster with lifelong repercussions. I bring this up to say, you & partner are the parents, you make the decision for what’s right for the whole family (kids included) and that decision may not make everyone individually happy- that’s ok.
Anon says
In the age of remote and hybrid work, do people really get transferred for work anymore? I don’t know anyone who has been transferred by their employer in ages (unless they were relocating already and requested it).
Anon says
Probably not as much, but they still lose their jobs and can have trouble finding something locally. Also there are professions like academia and medicine where you basically have to move for the next career level.
Anonymous says
I think a lot of kids who have difficulty with moves would also have difficulty if they stayed put. Case in point: when my family moved during my childhood, it seemed to be a disaster for my younger sister. But she’d had the beginnings of similar issues in her previous school and continued to have problems adjusting to change and getting along in life throughout adolescence and adulthood. She probably would have been just as miserable if we hadn’t moved, especially when she had to transition from elementary to middle school and from middle school to high school. On the other hand I found the move to be a great adventure and an overall plus, despite the fact that my new school wasn’t perfect and the other kids already knew each other.
Anonymous says
In some ways I think moving mid-year is easier than moving during the summer. A new kid who shows up midyear is always a novelty and gets lots of attention, which makes it easier to make friends.
Anon says
My 5 month old is getting ear tubes in and wondering what I can expect after? I know it’s a minor procedure but he’s going under general anesthesia because he’s little.
Anon says
My son was 15 months and had tubes done and adenoids removed, so a little different. He had some trouble coming out of anesthesia because he had a cold (one of the reasons for the surgery) but we were still released a few hours later and he was basically back to himself by evening. The nurses told me just tubes would have been even easier – “they are like a drive-through procedure.” You will have to put drops in for a couple days to prevent them from clogging while they heal
Anonymous says
I believe all children undergo general anesthesia for ear tubes. It will be fine. What I wasn’t prepared for was the irrational rage they experience when waking up from anesthesia. It lasted only a few minutes with both of mine. They were both back to themselves later that day; maybe a little tired.
Party Animal says
+1 – Late to the party but wanted to agree that coming out of the anesthesia was the worst part. My 1-year-old raged for almost an hour. She was fine the rest of the day.
Anon says
There seems to be at least one (maybe multiple??) families at my kids’ daycare who are not putting their kids in car seats. Apparently parents noticed and complained to the day care, who sent out an email a month ago. At pickup yesterday, my husband parked next to one of the offenders and supposedly my son noticed and was shocked over it. Thinking about it, I’m not sure what I would do if I witnessed that. Maybe knock on their window and offer to buy them one, though I’m pretty sure these people can afford one. What would you do or say, if anything?
Anon says
No, I wouldn’t say anything. If your child is old enough to notice and comment on it, I’m guessing kids are at least 3 or 4? Are you sure they aren’t using a backless booster seat? They’re not very noticeable.
But the bottom line is either it’s a gray area in which case it’s their decision to make and you should absolutely mind your own business (I still roll my eyes about the mom at swim lessons who told me it was dangerous to have my large 3 year old forward facing) or it’s not a gray area in which case they know the rules and are choosing to ignore them. Neither situation benefits from your intervention.
NYCer says
+1 to all of this.
Anon says
I think the kid was 2 and definitely not in any booster, but I guess it’s also not my business.
Anon says
Yeah, I’d put that in the objectively unsafe (and presumably illegal) category, but not sure what you’d gain by talking to them. Especially if the school is already aware.
Anon says
A 2yo in a booster is just as unsafe as not in any car seat – they’d still shoot out of the seatbelt. So that nuance doesn’t matter — judge away
Cb says
I don’t think there’s anything you can do. It’s really stupid and it’s really sad but probably none of your business.
I drop off my my friend’s daughter at an activity, along with my son, and she offers to swing them home afterward but I saw her with her 4 year old with no carseat in the front seat, so absolutely not….
Anon says
+1 I am still shocked by how many adults don’t wear seatbelts (and how many die in accidents probably solely because they don’t wear seatbelts). It’s the simplest thing in the world to click on one. And it’s absolute neglect to not properly buckle your kid ( a booster for a 3yo falls into that category).
Boston Legal Eagle says
A 4 year old in the front seat?! Soo dangerous. And I’m not usually out here policing other parents on car safety (my kids were forward facing by age 2 and sometimes wear bulky coats in their carseats) but that one is extreme.
Cb says
Right??? Like I think her rationale was that they were only going a mile home, but even a fender bender would be dangerous with a (very little) 4-year-old up front. Boggles my mind!
Anon says
I think the brain justifies risks you want to take. I have a friend who was very big on extended rear-facing but went through a drive-through holiday light display with her 1 year old on the lap of the front seat passenger, reasoning that the car was never moving very fast so it was fine. But even a 10 mile per hour collision can be super dangerous if the child isn’t belted, let alone in a carseat! I switched to forward facing and boosters relatively early, but I never would have done something like that.
Mary Moo Cow says
I’ve been in that situation. I did nothing, aside from make a mental note not to let my kid ride with that family (not that it was likely to come up, anyway.) Did I think the child was in danger? Yes. Did I think it was not my circus? Also yes. I think nothing good can come from knocking on their window and offering to buy a car seat.
Cb says
Sometimes people see us walking/cycling and offer us rides “it’s not very far, hop in!” and absolutely not…I say “I’m very uptight and American about carseats!” and they seem to accept that as an explanation.
anon says
How on earth is this any of your business?
Anon says
I agree with staying in her lane her, but it’s child endangerment. Would a mandated reporter have to report this?
Anon says
“Mandated reporter” refers to things you learn in the course of your job. E.g., if you are a therapist you are a mandated reporter for things people tell you in therapy. Not for things you observe in parking lots, lol.
Anon says
This isn’t true. Teachers and other mandated reporters are obligated to report “things they observe in parking lots,” such as a parent endangering a child. Whether this car seat issue rises to that level, I couldn’t say, but a teacher would absolutely be mandated to report a parent hitting a child in a parking lot.
Anon says
I’ve had entire trainings on being a mandated reporter and how to handle the gray area of “not recommended or I personally don’t agree but not illegal”. So, for your example about a parent hitting a kid in a parking lot, we did discuss the line between spanking vs abuse (obviously I’m against spanking, but it is legal where I live).
That being said, a random parent is not a mandated reporter. A teacher at the pre-school is.
Anon says
We don’t disagree. A teacher may be required to report something they see in the parking lot of the school at which they teach, because that’s something they’ve observed in the course of their employment. But I’m assuming OP does not work at this daycare, and in that case she’s not a mandatory reporter of this. The idea that she’s mandated to report this because she might have an unrelated mandatory reporting job (e.g., therapist, social worker, teacher at a different school) is ludicrous.
Anon says
Probably not relevant here but those are the rules in my state. Lawyers have to report all child abuse they come across in their personal lives. It’s actually more complicated at work due to client confidentiality.
Anon says
Just because you’re a mandated reporter at work doesn’t mean you’re “always on the clock”. I’m a mandated reporter at work, I’ve occasionally called in something I see outside of work if it’s egregious (by calling 911 the way any random citizen would report) but I don’t report every bit of potential neglect / potential abuse / bad parenting. I don’t have any context and also I do t know enough (names, addresses, etc) to report.
But like if I’m at the grocery store and I see a parent treating their kid poorly I don’t report that.
Even reporting things through work js not a clear cut as one might think. Plenty of sh!tty parenting is unfortunately perfectly legal.
Anonymous says
In NYS there’s a child abuse reporting hotline, and if you call them and explain the situation they will tell you whether you are required to report or not. If you are not they will let you go without taking your information and you are allowed to report things anonymously. They will also absolutely refuse to take a report if you are reporting something that they do not believe rises to the necessary level. I’m a mandated reporter at work and have always called when I wasn’t sure if something should be reported or not and have followed their guidance (even though I haven’t always agreed with it).
Anon says
Maybe it’s not. At what point does child endangerment become someone’s business? I really don’t know where that line is.
Anonymous says
I’d mind my business.
Anon says
How old are the kids? Babies or small toddlers is obviously quite concerning. But, we all grew up in an era when kids were car seats by Kindergarten.
While we know better now and keep kids in boosters longer, I don’t think it’d neglect to not.
Anon says
It’s illegal in most if not all states to have a kid improperly restrained. That includes moving to a booster too young or out of a car seat too soon. Therefore, yes it’s neglect
Anon says
I don’t think it’s automatically neglect just because you’re breaking a law. Is it neglect to let your kid jaywalk on a deserted street on or to drive a couple miles over the speed limit with your child in the car? Both of those violate laws, but I’m sure the vast majority of people have done them and no reasonable person who describe them as neglect or child endangerment.
Anon says
Obviously a pre-school age kid is too small to not have a booster seat, but going off of current booster guidelines I should have been in a booster until I was 19. In 5’1 now but had a 2” growth spurt in college
Anon says
Adult bones are stronger than child bones, and once a child hits puberty they can come out of a booster, even if they are short. This is a common straw man argument (maybe you didn’t know – but that’s why adults are safe when kids aren’t)
Anon says
Child car accident deaths have also decreased 50% since our childhoods, thanks to car seats, so the “we did it back then and we survived!” argument isn’t a great one
anon says
Actually in many states this is not considered child endangerment. Check your statute.
anon says
Literally no one here is making that argument.
Anon says
Yeah, talk about a straw man.
Anon says
Two people have said they wouldn’t be concerned because when we were kids we were out of seats by kindergarten
Anon says
They said they didn’t think it was neglect that merited intervention, not that it was no big deal.
Anon says
How old are the kids in question? If they were at the older or larger end, I wouldn’t be as concerned. After all, when we were kids there were no car seats or boosters by kindergarten.
Obviously we know better now, and I’m pro-following the car seat / booster seat guidelines, but I don’t think it’s neglect if they aren’t (if the kids are larger).
I wouldn’t say anything to the parents in the moment but would alert the school. It might be a one-off bad decision the parents make or it might be one action of many in the pattern of neglect or abuse (and the school may be able to piece those actions together with the right information). I also wouldn’t say anything to the parents because if they don’t care about car safety they might be aggressive in other ways (realize this is a jump).
If my kiddo had questions I’d just use the “different families fo things differently but this is what we do” excuse
EP-er says
I take car safety very seriously, for those in my car. I don’t have control over what others do, but I can say boosters are required until the seat belt fits you properly (even if you are 9,) children under 13 must be in the back seat, and every one must have their seat belt buckled properly before the car moves. I can also make sure my kids know these are the expectations when they are in someone else’s car, and if I find out they don’t buckle up, they don’t get to ride with friends.
You can’t control other people, though. They are making the choice to not use a car seat/booster, and may be breaking the law… but that isn’t for you to enforce. Different families make different decisions. My daughter drove home with a friend and none of the kids had their seatbelt on, because the mom didn’t think it mattered in the subdivision. I don’t agree with that, but my daughter wore hers.
Anonymous says
I would never let my daughter ride with either parent from that family again.
Anon says
Yah, I probably wouldn’t let my kid even play at their house unsupervised. That shows a shocking lack of proper judgement. And what if they decided nip out for ice cream or to pick up a sibling while your child was visiting?
Anonymous says
This is problematic because in an accident or sudden stop one of the unbelted kids could have flown into your daughter and injured her even though she was wearing her own seat belt. Incidentally, this is also one of the reasons why you are supposed to restrain pets in the car.
Anonymous says
The school may be required to call CPS, depending on the car seat laws in your state and the size/age of the children.
Emma says
We are planning a long weekend in Boston with my parents, husband and 9 month old. We are staying near the Boston Common/Newbury street. Any advice on baby-friendly places to eat? Welcoming all other recommendations! We’ve been a few times but not with a baby.
Anon says
That’s where we live! We don’t take our baby out to eat much, and when we do we stick to limited service restaurants with her, our favorites are: The Buttery, Greystone, Tatte for breakfast; Flour or Tatte for lunch. Brownstone does a good job with kids. There are also some family-friendly chains like California pizza kitchen, and Cheesecake Factory where we see lots of kids. We have seen babies and kids in the nicest of nice restaurants in Boston, so I don’t think you’ll necessarily be turned away… our daughter is just not at that level!
Emma says
Thanks! Not looking for super fancy, and we’ll probably do restaurant lunch/brunch and takeout or room service for dinner, because my daughter is pretty chill during the day and gets cranky around bedtime. We’ll check these out!
Anon says
I haven’t lived in Boston in years, but generally I think you can get away with a lot more with kids if you’re sitting outside. I mean I wouldn’t take a baby to a Michelin starred restaurant with a multi-course tasting menu even if they had a patio. But normal “nice” places are generally pretty tolerant of families if you sit outside, and the weather should be great for patio dining right now.
Emma says
That’s a good point – we’re just starting to take baby out more since the weather has been getting nicer, and I definitely feel more comfortable on a patio. It’s also easier for one of us to walk away for a few minutes if the baby is randomly fussy.
GCA says
Agree. Honestly, it’s more about what time of day you go to the restaurant — the 5-6pm hour tends to be kid-friendly dinner o’clock. I once rocked up to Barcelona Wine Bar with a 1-year-old for DH’s birthday dinner and it was delightful (kiddo swiped the jam and cheese off our charcuterie board and ate half the patatas bravas). Cafe Landwer (chain, several Boston locations) has also been good. Farther afield, we’ve taken kids to the Time Out Market food call by Fenway. And, not quite food-related (though they have a cafe), Beacon Hill Books & Cafe has an adorable children’s room.
Emma says
Thanks! Yeah baby sleeps by 7, so if we’re doing dinner it’s going to be early. We might leave the baby with my parents one night and get a nice baby-free dinner somewhere. I’ll check these spots out!
Anonymous says
Rate for sure but the lines get LONg so order ahead or send an adult to wait in line while someone walks the baby.
Anonymous says
I don’t have recommendations but we had no problem taking our baby to Boston! We eat earlier, and I did a lot of baby wearing because the stroller was tricky on some of the cobblestone sidewalks. Also some of the buildings aren’t handicap friendly, so again, lack of stroller made things easier.
Anon says
Advice? Commiseration? My marriage with my husband has always been rocky — he’s just not an easy person to run a family with — something I clearly did not weigh enough before signing on for this lifetime project. We did counseling in the past, things got good for a long stretch and then rocky once more. Years later we’re now in counseling again and I find myself wary. How long do I give it? How much can he change? I feel like I owe my two young kids to give it shot but what does giving it a shot look like? How long? How much effort? He swears changing is the most important thing to him etc., but don’t they all? Our counselor is fantastic but I’m skeptical on this huge change thing.
Anon says
What do you mean by “rocky”? If it’s just that you don’t feel very connected and you’ve fallen into the trap of being roommates and co-parents more than spouses, I’d be inclined to stick it out – for now anyway. Things will likely get better when your two young kids are older, and if they don’t you can cross the bridge then. But it’s a very different story if there’s lot of conflict. Kids will pick up on that even if you think they don’t.
OP says
By rocky I mean a lot of low-grade but frequent conflict. Think difficult personality — not cruel, not abusive, just obstreperous. He did manage a bunch of years being much more agreeable so it doesn’t seem impossible that he could again but I’m wary.
anon says
Personality traits are pretty darn difficult to change, OP.
go for it says
Having been there, done that I offer this “is this the model you want your kids to aspire to?”
People change when, and only when, they want to. Period. I think kids want happy parents.
Many years later, my kids are fine people and happy to have had 2 parents whom got/ get along very well in 2 different houses.
In addition, is this the life you want to wake up to every day?
anonamommy says
No advice, but I’m in a similar boat and have been considering what I want my empty nest/retirement years to look like. I also feel like I owe it to my family, but at the same time, I feel like I know what age 60 looks like and I know I don’t want that.
Anonymous says
I have plans to get a travel heavy job when my youngest leaves home. Partly because it’s something I’ve always been interested in that took a backseat to kids. But if I’m being honest it’s also partly because the idea of being home alone with my husband is not particularly appealing. I know it might not be the most mature plan, but that’s where my head is at right now.
anon says
I think it depends on what makes it rocky. IDK, I have seen a dear friend go down this road with her husband. They have always struggled with division of labor, always with lots of empty promises about change, and things hit a tipping point about a year ago. They separated and are now back together, but are they actually happy? Hard to tell. I think they’re the definition of staying together for the kids. Which sounds great, but there was a lot of conflict prior to separation, enough so that the kids noticed. I find it hard it to believe that dynamic just magically disappeared upon reconciliation.
Your questions are all good things to discuss with your own therapist. I don’t think anyone can tell you what the right answer is.
Boston Legal Eagle says
Hard to say without more details – what are you hoping he changes? Is he not as involved with parenting as you want? Does he argue/talk down to you? Do you just have different interests? Some of these things can be worked on, but sometimes kids are better off with parents separated, who are happy on their own (or with new partners).
OP says
He’s a super involved parent — probably does 55% of the parenting/household work if I’m being honest, but there is just so. much. friction. with every little thing. It’s how he responds to me that’s really the biggest problem for me. It’s often objecting, negative, non-responsive, only partially responsive etc.
Boston Legal Eagle says
That sounds like a major issue. Even if he doesn’t talk that way to the kids, they (especially girls) will see this as a model of a relationship and may tolerate this in their own relationships. Which they shouldn’t. Partners in life need to respect each other and this does not sound respectful. He may be coming from a place of depression or anxiety requiring medication, but I don’t think you need to keep tolerating it if he’s not willing to truly work on this.
Anonymous says
+1
I left my ex-husband when he rolled his eyes at an innocuous question one too many times (obviously oversimplifying here). He hasn’t changed, but I’m now with someone who adores me and treats me well and I am glad that this is the model of a healthy relationship that my child is seeing.
FVNC says
That really sounds hard. My kids often go through periods like this, when everything I ask or tell or say to them is met with exactly the list of reactions you recite above. When every single interaction is a minor conflict, it’s very frustrating. And they’re kids! So, I can see this sort of interaction with a spouse being especially difficult and disrespectful of you. I imagine what makes it even harder is that most single interactions are “no big deal,” but the cumulative effect of this sort of situation could really wear you down. I’m sorry you’re in this situation, OP.
Anon says
Huh. A bunch of random musings:
I’m really curious about this “he must change” idea. My personal opinion is that relationship dynamics can change (which requires both people to change together) and situations can change, but that people do not fundamentally change who they are.
It sounds like maybe you’re already checked out and done? But you feel like you owe it to your kids to try? Fight for your marriage with your life or free yourself and focus on creating a good co-parenting relationship for your family, but don’t just check a box to try and relieve some guilt on the way to divorce.
Only you know what rocky and good means, but you don’t owe your kids 20+ years of a rocky marriage. You owe them the best relationship you can possibly have with their father,
OP says
“Fight for your marriage with your life or free yourself and focus on creating a good co-parenting relationship for your family, but don’t just check a box to try and relieve some guilt on the way to divorce.” this really resonates with me. I’ll sit with it.
Anonymous says
You’re wasting your time. Get a divorce.
Anonymous says
I always scratch my head at this advice. In most of the situations where it’s offered, it seems likely that the divorce will be high-conflict (the situation here) or that the spouse is unfit to be alone with the kids. In that case divorce will often be a less attractive option than remaining married until the kids are out of the house.
Anon for this says
After a lot of time in individuals and couples therapy, I’ve realized that my husband has a different personality than I do, and that the mix of our personalities will lead to a certain amount of conflict/ dissatisfaction. Both he and I have anxiety and that shows up in our interactions in very different ways (he withdraws/stonewalls/pushes back & I try to use reason or facts to make him agree with me). I often feel like I’m the one that has to change how I feel about something in order to align with him, and that I’m the one caving. In reality, I’m the one struggling with how to deal with disagreement. It’s not reasonable to expect him to fully come to my side & disagreement is normal/ will always happen. Over time I’ve come to better understand why he does that and to have some techniques to help with it.
All this to say, it sounds like your husband handles conversations in a different way then you prefer. I’m not sure that couples will make him change that aspect of his personality. The question then becomes whether you want to continue on, assuming that the situation won’t change. There may be some movement on his end, but there will also need to be movement on yours.
Anonymous says
Gottman refers to contempt as one of the 4 horsemen of divorce. Have you directly discussed the issue with your counsellor? What worked in the past? Is there a reason that the change fell apart? We have gone through period where due to job changes we had to rework the division of labour on different tasks.
I’ve also had to let go of how DH ‘should’ do different tasks. As an example, he’s in charge of lunches so we agree on ground rules – lunches contain a main, two snacks including some type of fruit and protein. He decides what that looks like and the kids deal with him if they have complaints. 8 year olds are remarkably effective self advocates when they don’t want to eat ham sandwiches 4 days in a row. DH makes the lunches and shops for the food required.
Having regular date nights outside of the house (weekly babysitter), also helped us reconnect as a respectful loving couple vs roommates arguing over chores.
Anon says
I’m planning my kiddo’s birthday party for July in Connecticut. Our choices are to have it 10-12 or 11-1 on a weekend. Because it will be outdoors in July, I feel like earlier would be better, but I’m looking for opinions from the hive – 10 or 11 am start time for a 5the bday party?
Anon says
Do you know if many kids have younger siblings who take AM naps? My guess is for 5 year olds there may be several ego fall into that boat. In that case, I’d start at 11. Starting at 10 would interfere with morning naps for many families.
NYCer says
As a counterpoint, I don’t think you need to plan around the siblings’ nap schedules. At least in my experience, by the time kids are turning 5, it is pretty uncommon for younger siblings to come to the party. That was more of a thing at toddler and baby birthday parties.
Anon says
I was surprised, but quite a few people brought siblings to my kid’s recent 5th birthday (at a trampoline park, so we had to pay per kid). Some with advance permission, many without. But I agree with you about not planning around sibling nap schedules. People who are strict about nap schedules can find a way to keep them home, but many don’t care that much. Also at least in my area people normally space kids 2-3 years apart so most 5 year olds don’t have newborn siblings. All of the siblings who attended our party were between the ages of 2 and 7.
Anon says
I wasn’t thinking about siblings coming but more about parents’ availability for do drop off at 10
Anon says
Parents normally have to stay at a 5th birthday. So either one parent will have to stay home with the baby or the party-going parent will take both kids and the baby will nap in a carrier or stroller. It doesn’t seem like a big deal to me.
OP says
OP here. Thanks all. I hadn’t thought about sibling naps, but in our experience, younger siblings don’t come to parties unless there’s a childcare issue or its a backyard, bring everyone situation (which I’d like to do, but isn’t possible this year).
Anonymous says
This is dumb. Infants can nap in a stroller/ car seat, and they’re the only ones affected by this. Also people figure it out. If you do a later time, it should be because people will be coming from their swim lessons, soccer practices, etc.
Anon says
We had my daughter’s 5th from 11-1 recently and it was well-attended. I actually disagree about nap schedules – very few 5 year olds have infant siblings, and toddler naps are mid-day and more likely to conflict with a later start time. But either way I wouldn’t plan the party around sibling nap schedules. Most families have two parents and one can bring the kid to the party while the other stays home. In my area, a lot of preschoolers have Saturday morning activities so we started later to avoid those. Probably less of an issue in the summer though.
NYCer says
I would definitely start at 10 am in the summer.
AwayEmily says
Definitely 10am. That lets attendees have a nice morning at home and then go straight to the party. If it’s at 11am then it’s a weird block of time to kill in the AM before the party starts — too long to bum around at home without going stir-crazy but not quiiite enough time to actually go out and about.
Boston Legal Eagle says
Agree with this – the party can then be the “morning activity” for kids, instead of a more awkward midday thing. Of course, my kids are ready to go by 8:30/9am so we would have a nice lonnng morning at home!
ElisaR says
10am! That’s perfect. And unlikely to interfere with the rest of the weekend day.
Anonymous says
Depends on whether you want to serve lunch. No lunch for 10-12. Lunch required 11-1.
More Sleep Would Be Nice says
Counterpoint: I would serve some breakfasty snacks + lunch for 10-Noon and at least lunch for 11-1. That’s the norm in my circles.
Anonymous says
I would do breakfasty snacks for 10-12 but not lunch also–two meals in two hours is a lot.
Anon says
We’ve had several 10 am preschool parties this year, and I’m pretty sure we had lunch (normally pizza) at all of them. Usually around 11:30 and then the party broke up shortly after that. I am always in favor of having more food. The worst thing that happens is you have some leftovers. But I do think at a 10 am party, the food could be pastries, fruit and coffee/hot chocolate (maybe iced chocolate in July?) and serve it at the beginning rather than the end.
Anonymous says
Either is fine but you’re serving lunch for sure at 11-1.
My kid is turning 5 and her party is 3-4:30 on a Friday. Her PK gets out at 3 so kids are coming straight from that. Half her buddies have a sibling with a 5pm softball, lacrosse or baseball game.
Pregnancy Travel says
Would you travel to a state for vacation while pregnant (20-28 weeks range) that is unfavorable to women’s health and/or tough, really tough, abortion stances? Assume there’s nothing else remarkable about the pregnancy.
Leave the, “I wouldn’t want to contribute to an economy that takes that stance” out of it for the moment. Just from a sheer medical perspective.
It’s not something I’d considered before. We did a babymoon before my first to a foreign country that, upon further review far after the fact, wasn’t all that favorable and honestly probably didn’t have the medical professionals to assist in a true, dire emergency, but this line of thinking neverrr crossed our minds. We were only watching out for Zika tbh. We’re torn on what to do with #2. It would be ideal to travel with our 5 year old to Florida, South Carolina or some other southern, warm state that we’ve otherwise typically frequented for a 4-5 day trip (would be by air).
Further, 100% of my in-laws are in GA and AL and expect a visit while we can prebaby. So I suppose the same question applies to those trips.
Anon says
From a sheer medical perspective, it would be a hard no for me while pregnant. Too many horrifying stories of women dying or nearly dying because they started miscarrying and couldn’t get treatment they needed. And I realize that may be hypocritical because I live in such a state, but I think it’s a bigger issue on vacation because you don’t have a trusted doctor and network and are more likely to delay seeking care until the situation is more urgent.
Anonymous says
Hard no purely from a safety perspective. The in-laws can come to you or to a safe neutral location.
Anon says
Hard, hard no. I would never take the risk for a vacation. It really is as bad as the news stories are saying. Women are turning up with medical emergencies and not receiving treatment and being left for dead. Those states are dead to me while pregnant and probably even when not.
Lily says
No. An in-law’s in-law was traveling OOS for a babymoon and had to have an emergency c-section at 26 weeks. Thankfully she and the baby were ok but they ended up having to stay in that state (thousands of miles away from home) for 3 months because baby was in the NICU and couldn’t be moved. If there hadn’t been such a happy ending, and she needed an abortion, I shudder to think what would have happened if this happened in a forced birth state. Actually, this did happen in what is now a forced-birth state, but it was pre-Dobbs.
Lily says
No. And if your in-laws are pro-forced birth, I would tell them exactly why you are not coming to visit.
Anon says
+1.
anon says
+1 hard no on traveling there and that it would be good to educate if you’re up for it.
Anon says
I would not go for vacation but would go to visit family. But, I’d have a few backup plans in case there are compilations before traveling.
anonM says
+1
Anon says
I don’t think backup plans are enough for worst-case scenarios – if you’re bleeding profusely or have passed out, you’re not going to be able to get on a plane. I’d maybe make an exception if you’re RIGHT on the border with a state that protects women’s rights and there is an excellent hospital within 10 miles of drive time, but otherwise, hell no.
Anon says
Yes, it would never even cross my mind
anon says
Hard hard no. I was on a work trip at 22 weeks pregnant in CA and developed shortness of breath and some other concerning symptoms and had to spend the day in the ER. I can’t imagine dealing with that situation PLUS the stress of wondering if the hospital is able to give me the best possible care/presenting all of my options because of newly restrictive state laws.
Anonymous says
I’m currently in my 2nd trimester and my mom who lives in TX has insisted on visiting me instead of me visiting because she’s worried if something were to happen that I wouldn’t be able to get care there fast enough/would have to travel out of state to get care. I think the chances of something happening are low but the consequences could be very bad, so I’ve been totally on board with this from a safety perspective.
Anon says
Yup, this – low risk, high-consequence, optional? All signs point to vacationing elsewhere.
Anon says
No, I wouldn’t. My in-laws live in Florida and we haven’t been since Jan 2019 and are unlikely to go, well, ever? Because even if we decide we’re done having children (2 currently), I still don’t like the idea of being in a state that doesn’t believe I should be able to make decisions about my own body and health.
Anonie says
Absolutely not. I’m barely comfortable traveling to anti-choice states now, and there’s basically no chance I’m pregnant or will become so. In-laws can visit you, sorry. If you want to go somewhere warm, California and New Mexico are beautiful.
Anonymous says
I don’t travel after 24 weeks because I wouldn’t want to be stuck somewhere for 3+ months with a baby in the NICU. So womens health choices aside, no I wouldn’t.
Anon says
It seems like an unpopular opinion, but I agree. I even turned down (fairly optional) work travel in that time frame. I know someone who delivered in Hawaii on a babymoon at like 25 weeks and it was really hard on them and set them back financially for a long time. Granted, Hawaii is extreme because you can’t drive there and the plane tickets and cost of living are extremely expensive. But it was eye-opening, and I decided I wasn’t going to travel after about 24 weeks unless I was prepared to live in that place for months. For me, that meant only my hometown where my parents lived at the time.
Anon says
I mean, I live in Texas? So yes. I’m kind of surprised by all these answers.
Anon says
I said this above but I live in a state with an abortion ban and I still wouldn’t travel to one while pregnant (for medical reasons only, it’s not an ethical issue and we travel to red states when I’m not pregnant). At home we live pretty close to the state line with a blue state, have good friends in a blue state city only a little over an hour away, I have an OB I trust and when I was pregnant I was getting regular medical care and could ask OB right away about anything weird. I think vacation is a bit different – you’re more likely to ignore minor symptoms, you don’t have a local trusted doctor to consult, you won’t necessarily realize something is a big deal until it’s too late to get out of state for medical care and (at least in my case) I’d likely be much farther from a blue state. But I admit I was cautious about many things while pregnant. It’s a very short term situation so it didn’t seem worth taking risks, however small, when I could just wait and do whatever it was in 6 months.
Anon says
Huh- with genuine curiosity are you pregnant/planning on getting pregnant? I say this as someone who’s 25 weeks and living in a state who’s ban is currently paused during the legal battle. It’s definitely been a concern of mine.
Anonymous says
I wouldn’t live in Texas if there were any chance I could get pregnant.
Jessica says
I would not travel to a state with restrictions at this stage of your pregnancy. I’d be particularly concerned since you have an older child that would be left without a mother.
I work for in a conservative industry and refused a work trip to a state with restrictions when 25 weeks pregnant this fall. No one negative impact on my career. My 60+ white male Republican boss told me I made the right call.
anon says
Yes, I would. I also live in such a state, and have had a complex miscarriage, and was able under the laws of my state to obtain completely appropriate medical care, and know two other women with similar stories. The stories that (rightly) make the news after those where women don’t receive the care that they need, and I don’t want to minimize those experiences – but if you’re considering risk, it’s important to know that it’s not universally the case that a doctor would refuse to treat you in the unlikely event at the you had an urgent medical event requiring immediate termination to save your life and health during your trip.
anon says
I live in GA and without sharing my whole horrible experience, can say that I had to terminate a pregnancy due to medical emergency, and there was never a question or concern raised by my medical team about whether it was legal. Just fwiw. This was in Atlanta.
Anonymous says
From a medical perspective hard no on these states plus Dominican Republic and various other countries.
I don’t want to be the next Savita Halappanavar.
Anon says
Same. People say “you realize there are other countries that ban abortion, right?” and it’s like “yep, not planning travel to them either.” Why would I?
Anon says
Malta is one that surprised me. I think it’s the only country in the EU where abortion is completely illegal, although some other countries have restrictions.
Anon says
I would. I think I am more of a risk taker than some.
Anonymous says
Absolutely not. Unfortunately, I know two people who had late-pregnancy losses (one while on vacation), and as incredibly devastating as they were, it would have been worse if they had died too, or suffered significant health complications due to not getting adequate care.
Anon says
anyone else’s kids sad that the school year is ending? i have two fairly devastated prek graduates on hand who are sooo sad that the year is ending and that they are leaving prek for kindergarten. they do happen to attend a school that continues through 5th grade and i’d say about 40% of the kids stay, and 60% leave, but it is so bittersweet for everyone and i think makes it harder that some people are staying.
Anon says
I also have a pre-K who is moving onto a different school for K (no option to continue at current school). She WAS doing great. We had kindergarten round-up in March and got to tour the new school. She was super excited, happy that a couple besties are going to the same K, etc. Then last week we had a graduation ceremony at her preschool. It was so lovely and special and we went out for ice cream afterwards with three current classmates who are all going to the same K, so overall just a really perfect day, but when we got home she cried for an hour about how she doesn’t want to leave her school and her teachers and her friends and we’re ruining her life by making her go to kindergarten. It’s been a week and she’s still obsessed with it. The first thing she said when she woke up this morning was “I’m going to run away from home so I don’t have to go to kindergarten.” Don’t really understand that logic…
Anyway, the end of her time in daycare is still almost two months away (although her best friend leaves next week which I’m sure will be hard) so I’m trying to put it out of my mind and hope things will be better by mid-July.
OP says
this makes me feel a bit better that it is not just my kids. to be honest, i’m also pretty sad about the whole thing so need to make sure i don’t cry in front of them
Anon says
I wouldn’t say I’m sad, but I’m definitely feeling quite emotional about the whole thing and am also trying not to be too emotional about it in front of my kid. Kids absorb parents’ emotions, for sure.
Anon says
My pre-Ker hasn’t said he’s sad, but when he was acting out last week, his teacher said that every year, all the kids are out of sorts the last few weeks of school. There’s lots of special days that don’t follow their usual schedule, and they know what’s coming up. It’s a lot for littles.
Anonymous says
Spinoff of the car seat thread. For those who are trained as mandatory reporters, what kind of discretion are you supposed to exercise when deciding what’s reportable? Hypothetical: A kid has a scratch. Day care worker asks how they got it. Kid says mom did it. What factors do you consider when deciding whether it needs to be reported?
Anon says
I think if you’re a mandatory reporter your employer will give you guidance on this and you should follow their guidance and if you’re not sure you should ask your boss.
But I will say my very very dramatic preschooler went through a big lying phase when she was 3 and we were very worried she was going to tell a daycare teacher we hit her or did something else that would be considered ab*se. I think I posted about it here at the time. I asked a friend who’s a ped (but not my child’s ped, so not a mandatory reporter in this situation) about it and my friend said there’s room for discretion and if they didn’t see bruises or any other evidence of abuse it’s unlikely to be reported just based on what a young toddler says. I assume the answer might be different for an older kid who could be more thoroughly questioned.
OP says
Not a mandatory reporter myself, just curious about how it works in practice. That’s why I asked about what guidelines employers give.
Anonymous says
That seems like a really extreme example. Much more likely is that the child continually comes in with a series of unexplained bruises, or isn’t bathed or well fed, or references parents hitting each other, or unusual redness in the genital areas etc. Care providers know what is normal for the kids they care for. Scratched up knees or calves from playing outside – normal. Red finger print sized markings around the neck and shoulders ? That’s not a play accident.
Mandatory reporters receive training. If you see something, say something. Basically, what would you want done if that was your child who was in danger?
I wouldn’t hesitate to call the police anonymously and ask them to a ride by at dismissal time. They aren’t going to charge people but they will definitely issue warnings. Kids have been killed by airbags in fender benders when riding in the front seat.
Cerulean says
A scratch wouldn’t even register as an issue for me (although I work around teens, not small children). The guidance we get is that if an injury is suspicious in any way (placement, severity, the reason for it, etc), we don’t have latitude to decide whether it’s bad enough, we just have to report it.
Anon says
A scratch?! That wouldn’t register and I don’t think is a sign of abuse. I wouldn’t be surprised if I accidentally scratched my kid at some point. A bruise or cut is different.