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Anon says
Yesterday was the first Easter my toddler was old enough to participate in, and my husband spontaneously did all of it. Told me a couple of weeks ago he’d bought stuff for the basket, realized a couple of days ago we didn’t actually have a basket so got one, bought eggs etc.
1) it was such a joy to just participate rather than plan a holiday for her and made me realize how much of a mental load even delegating is
2) I was surprised by how much I unconsciously take on these responsibilities.
Anon says
Is anyone else tired of hearing about mental load and emotional labor? “Bringing my child joy is such a burdensome chore. Waaa waaaa me me me. Me me me me me!!”
Anon says
Right? The only pursuit worthy of my time is earning prestige and money at my big fancy lawyer job. Buying holiday gifts for my children should be delegated and even thinking about delegating is too much.
REAtty says
I am having such a hard time understanding why you would say this other than to make someone else (possibly a lot of people, considering that this isn’t an uncommon feeling to share on this website) feel bad. I hope your day gets better and bless your heart.
Anon says
Not as tired as I am from people like you.
anonM says
+1
Anon says
+1 – and “okay, Boomer” to Anons at 10:12 AM and 10:19 AM. Y’all sound like my MIL.
govtattymom says
I’m not tired of hearing about it! It is an issue! I love my children intensely but it is exhausting being responsible for creating all of the magic for their holidays. I have a full-time job, a serious chronic illness, and I travel for work (and I know many women are juggling like this). It is burdensome to buy all the gifts, make all the food, and create the traditions that make life so special for kids. I am delighted that my kids are having a magical childhood but it sometimes comes at a high cost. To all the moms out there who are struggling, you are seen and you are valued.
Anonymous says
I really enjoy creating the magic. What bugs me is that I have to do all of these other things that use up my energy and get in the way of what’s most important to me. I’d love to have a cleaning service, for example. Or quit my job.
Cb says
Yep, I’d love to lean into Christmas magic but it coincides with grading season, trying to get writing done before the holidays, etc. And by the end of term, I’m exhausted and it feels like a lot.
My equal partner husband and I had a stupid fight about Christmas jumpers this year- “it seems like every kid is wearing a Christmas jumper…why doesn’t T have one?” “You don’t have to have b— to go to the store and buy one!”
Anon says
I wouldn’t say I’m tired of hearing about it but I do think a lot of it is more optional than people realize. Like I sympathize with the person whose husband can’t remember to give the kids medicine because medicine is not optional. But creating elaborate Easter baskets is not something you have to do.
Anon says
+1 that you can create magical holidays without being over the top.
We do Easter baskets, dying eggs, egg hunts, and a large, extended-family meal but it’s not necessarily super extra time consuming to do that. We have a few fun family traditions when it comes to dying eggs and the egg hunt, but they don’t take much more effort or time than normal egg dying or hunting.
For the Easter baskets, I ordered everything online for Target delivery. I re-use the same baskets every year so just needed to order the fake grass and candy. I also threw in a coloring book and crayons and stickers. That took 5 minutes to order and I did it while on the train to work one day. The baskets took maybe 10 minutes to assemble (3 baskets) and I did that Friday after the kids went to bed.
We dyed eggs on Friday night (in lieu of family movie night, our Friday tradition). I just made sure we bought an extra carton of eggs (and ordered the dye and vinegar with my Target order). After dinner (pizza on Fridays), my husband took he kids with him to walk the dog while I boiled the eggs and set up the dye.
On Sunday AM my husband and I woke up early, I hid the baskets in the living room while he hid the eggs in the yard.
We went to my parents’ for Easter late lunch / early dinner. I was in charge of dessert, I made a pie (using frozen pre-made pie crust and frozen berries) on Saturday afternoon. There was another egg hunt there (which is “extra fun” because my parents use plastic eggs and hide candy or coins in the eggs and there were cousins to hunt with).
Kids did wear cute “Easter” outfits but really they’re clothes they’ll wear normally too (pretty much my son’s brightest button down and khakis, my daughter’s brightest “party dress” and a fun bow).
We skipped church (we only go about once a month, but usually skip big holidays or events) because that felt too chaotic and we wanted to make sure we could get nap time / quiet time in before we went to my parents’.
My house decorations were pretty much limited to extra flowers (a few hyacinths from the grocery store, which I then brought to my parents’ to give to some relatives), an Easter wreath, table runner, a few bunny figurines as a centerpiece and garden flag (all of which are reused from year to year). Decorating takes 5 minutes.
For about an hour of my / my husbands time and Friday night egg dying with the kids, we had a lovely and “special” Easter.
Different strokes says
Oh man, I TOTALLY opted out of egg dying. How old are your children that that isn’t an extra burden??? We did it a few years ago but I’m waiting a while until I have the energy to take that one on again! That’s actually one of the things I saw on others instas that I was most impressed by!
My way of minimizing easter stress was skipping the aforementioned egg decorating and dying or any craft at all and refusing to do any egg hunts that weren’t on easter itself. I did do easter basket gifts (I always give new goggles and try to make it useful but fun). And DS was the reader in church, so we had to be there and on time. So I opted in on those things! Different picks, same outcome for us as this poster.
Anoon says
LOL to all of this being *shrug nbd, doesn’t need to be big, all i did was these 1,000 things and it wasn’t hard for me at all*
Maybe not how you meant it, but wow smug vibes!
Anon says
This sounds like so much to me. The only thing we did was take our kid to a few community egg hunts and give a chocolate bunny.
Anon says
I don’t get smug vibes at all. I think the tips about ordering baskets in 5 minutes while commuting or re-using things from last year are easy and practical. I tend to feel overwhelmed if I think I must reserve hours and hours for things like this, but actually, you CAN do it in those little gaps of time.
Anon says
Sorry, I did not at all mean to be smug! Compared to many moms around me, we do a “scaled down version” so I was pointing out that an Easter basket shopping and assembly can absolutely take 10-15 minutes.
We avoid the public egg hunts because I don’t have time / energy to go to those. Also, I feel like they’re ripe for meltdowns in a way that a smaller family hunt isn’t.
My mom was the opposite of a Pinterest mom (working mom in the 90s) and I pretty much do the same things she did with us: dye eggs, small family hunt, low-key baskets.
We dye eggs because I remember loving it so much as a kid. This is a worthwhile family tradition to use while other parts (church, public egg hunts, visiting the Easter bunny) aren’t. Luckily this year it was warm enough to do outside which made cleanup a breeze. We usually do a Friday night family activity (movie night) so we swapped movie night with this; regardless of what we were doing we were going to be home and spending time together on Friday night anyways. We don’t decorate the eggs, just make the cups of dye and plop an egg in. Whereas my neighbor had intricate decorations on her family’s eggs.
Anonymous says
This is the key–choosing just a few things that are important to you and skipping the ones that are too much hassle or just aren’t important to you. Dyeing eggs with my daughter is fun and low-key. Dyeing eggs with my rowdy nieces and nephews, on the other hand, would be an absolute nightmare. Public egg hunts are a no-go for us; too much drama. My SILs love them because they can just let their feral children run and scream.
More Sleep Would Be Nice says
I don’t celebrate Easter as a holiday – we invite cousins over for a egg hunt but it’s truly more of an excuse to get together; really I’d rather do Holi but it’s too messy with that many folks, and I don’t want color dripping in my house. I make a few heavy apps (like…warming up frozen samosas), DH stocks up on beer, and everyone else brings a little something.
This post sounds like how I handle Diwali for my family – re-used decorations (mostly bought on line or collected through the years), 1-2 crafts, and a nice dinner where everyone contributes something.
Liza says
Right, feel free to skip giving your kids Easter baskets. I’m sure they won’t be talking about that in 15 years to their therapist, partner, whatever, “My parents couldn’t even bother to get me an Easter basket! It was once a year for 10 years, and I knew all my friends got them. I thought there was something wrong with me because the Easter bunny didn’t love me!”
And if your argument hinges on the word “elaborate” as if planning/preparing a simple or half-assed Easter basket is significantly less work than an elaborate one: no, it’s not.
Anon says
I’m sympathetic on an individual level, but on a larger scale, it’s become a LOT. We’re starting to TTC now but might’ve begun sooner if I hadn’t gotten really freaked out by the level of utter misery all the parents in my life and online were reporting. It’s only recently that I’ve seen the pendulum switch back a little bit. What can I say, I’m impressionable and the impression I was getting was really awful.
Anonymous says
A lot of it is really awful, though, simply because our society is not set up to support families. Child care, sick kids, etc. are expensive logistical nightmares. The fact that nowadays most families need two working parents to pay the bills makes it even more difficult. It’s not the way it was when our parents were young and could just blithely decide, oh, yeah, let’s have some kids and one of us will quit working to take care of them!
Anonymous says
Yeah. I love, LOVE being a mom and love my son to the moon and back, but there is a lot about parenting in America that’s just hard. It’s not set up for working moms. Dads that do 30% or more of the work get a million gold stars, while moms just get sh*t on for not doing more.
anon says
A lot of what people complain about here isn’t about those basic parenting issues, though…there are so many complaints here about the terrible emotional labor involved in kid activities/school volunteering/holidays/etc. And a lot of that stuff is optional. You can just not do a lot of it, and your kid won’t actually be scarred.
Anonymous says
I do opt out of all of the school nonsense and a lot of the holiday stuff and being a working mom is still 100 times more complicated than my own mother’s life as a SAHM who did all the school and holiday things. And then my kids complain because they don’t have an Elf on the Shelf and I don’t eat lunch with them at school once a week.
Anon says
This is not the point, but it’s wild to me that people go have lunch with their kids every week. Even for the SAHMs I know, it’s something they do maybe once a semester. It ceases to be special if you do it all the time! Plus kids over the age of maybe second grade don’t really want their parents there that much.
Cb says
I agree with the above, but also, it feels weird to say what’s great about parenting, especially online? Like I found certain things really easy, and have an easy kid, but I wouldn’t chime in on a conversation to contribute that?
Our lives are bananas – my husband does a TON of solo parenting, I do a TON of travel, but we’re all pretty happy?
Anon says
+1 I think you have to keep in mind that online people are mostly discussing problems/issues so people don’t normally say “oh this was so easy for me.” I wouldn’t say I have an “easy” kid, but certain things have been easy (she slept through the night at 5 weeks old and never had any kind of regression) and I don’t weigh in on sleep discussions for a couple reasons: it would sound smug and I also don’t think I have any meaningful advice to offer, it was just luck.
AwayEmily says
Yes to this. I love parenting so much we decided to have a third kid even though it doesn’t make sense on paper, it’s made my husband and my relationship stronger, and my kids just make me really, really happy, even on hard days. But most of my posts on here are asking for help/advice with problems, because it feels super weird to just randomly post “here are all the ways my life and kids are GREAT!”
Anon says
I would love to hear more happy stories. I get quite tired of someone sharing something happy and then someone else snapping “just wait until your kid ___” or “you just got lucky.” It’s okay to be happy and to not always dread the worst. I say this as someone who has really had to work to overcome my natural pessimism and I know how hard it can be during challenging times, but it’s also helped me so much during challenging times. When someone shares something happy that makes me think “she just got lucky,” I respond with “that’s awesome/that sounds so fun/that’s such a win” even if I don’t 100% feel it. Even saying the words changes the mindset.
More Sleep Would Be Nice says
The Cut had an article about the joys of parenting. I often feel like parents (especially mums since they still take on a lot of the mental load) jump to the complaining because – I mean, where else can it go? U.S. society isn’t set up for families, and certainly not for mothers and children.
I also agree that a lot of parents baseline is what would be extra (for me). I was our to dinner for a BFF’s birthday and one of her other friends was going on and on about how holiday cards are so much work – she needs to make the set(?), get the matching outfits, take the picture herself, edit the picture/design the card herself, get it printed, and then hand-address every card. When I mentioned how we handle it (95% outsourced, we pay for the vendor to address, DH or my photographer BFF snap a photo on our porch and DH uses one of the vendor’s templates) she was like “Oh no, I NEED to do it myself.” Again, good for you girl, but maybe you’re taking on a bunch of stuff that doesn’t really bring you a lot of satisfaction.
Anon says
I think even having awareness that something isn’t necessary can make you feel better, even if you still choose to do it. I spend a ton of time making photobooks and it’s really annoying how much time it takes but I don’t feel resentful about it because I know it was 100% my choice and not something that has to be done.
Anon says
+1 I posted above about our easy Easter magic, but we are a lot like you. I try to streamline and keep things as easy as possible. We take our Christmas card photo at Thanksgiving dinner (everyone is dressed up though our outfits don’t coordinate and we ask a family member to take our photo with someone’s iPhone), then go on to one of the plethora of card websites, pick a pre-designed card, upload the photo, add a greeting and order the cards. We also pay more for the cards to be addressed by the vendor (I think our list started with the wedding invite list and we’ve edited it over time). It takes about 20 minutes.
We make Christmas cookies with the kids every year using the Pillsbury roll out sugar cookie dough. The kids still get the fun of using cookie cutters and decorating the cookies, but I’m not battling with making dough.
anon says
Honestly, I hardly ever post here because I generally find parenting pretty pleasant. And also because I come from a fairly traditional family and what most people here call “emotional labor” is, in my life, an accepted part of being a mom and not something I object to. My husband carries to load when I’m traveling for work but I always expected that I’d be the one to plan most holiday celebrations, buy birthday presents for our kids’ friends, remember teacher gifts, etc. It was just part of the deal for me, in the same way that taking care of a million house things that I’m not even aware of is for him. If there’s stuff that’s making me miserable, I just don’t do it. Full stop. There’s a reason our kids don’t do travel sports, for example.
I have a theory that marital happiness and parental happiness is less about the division of labor and more about expectations and understanding. My husband and I do not have an egalitarian marriage (at least not from the perspective of people on this board) but we have a marriage and parenting arrangement that is consistent with our expectations going in.
Anonymous says
I also prefer to do all the “mom” stuff myself and get annoyed when my husband meddles. What makes my life more difficult is that I also came into the marriage with the expectation that I would have a choice whether to work outside the home, and that if I chose to keep working we’d be able to afford certain supports. That expectation was not fulfilled.
More Sleep Would Be Nice says
100% This. DH and I are not “equal” but we’ve found a way to be equitable in a way that works for us. And cheers to – if I don’t want to do it, I do not.
I enjoy school/holiday festivities, planning, etc. He often has 0 idea about stuff until it pops up on the calendar, just like I have 0 idea how our front yard looks maintained. I also have immigrant parents from Asia – so there are religious/festive holidays that are important for me to pass on to kids/family that I’m more aware of than he is; just like he has his own expectations/thoughts around Christmas, so often takes a lead there.
Also FWIW – he takes care of the whole (heavily outsourced) holiday card.
Anon says
I also prefer to do “mom” things and things that can be done from a computer, and my solution is to make my husband do a disproportionate share of the day to day chores. So we’re not sharing every task equally but we’re spending a roughly equal amount of time on household labor.
I will say though that there are lots of things I do that I don’t put in the emotional labor bucket because I choose to do them and my husband would opt out of them. So I make him give me “credit” for things like buying the kids clothes and doing our taxes, because those things have to get done, but not things like planning vacations and making photobooks because he would not do those things if it were up to him.
Anon says
I think expectations matter in marriage, but also a healthy degree of acceptance. Not every “it’s not fair” grumble that pops into your brain needs to be aired with your spouse or taken super seriously by you either. You know what? Life is probably hard for your spouse too. Having humility actually helps your mental health, not just focusing on grievances.
Boston Legal Eagle says
Not tired and we need to keep talking about. It is work that is often undervalued because people expect women to just do it and enjoy every minute of it, but at the end of the day, it’s still work. Both parents should be involved, to experience the effort involved and to celebrate the joys (combined with tears, let’s be honest).
Anonymous says
Nope not at all.
Anon2 says
I can agree with both OP and this comment. It must be a a pleasant surprise to be able to enjoy the fun holiday aspect without the work, and no reason Dads can’t take the lead!
But yah, having a family requires lots of planning and logistics and WORK. It’s not being done “at” you. It just is; you can embrace it as part of loving and serving your family, or you can keep score (not directing this at you, OP, just in general). In a family everyone should aim to give 100%, because the work somehow totals up to be more than 50-50%. And this is life! It’s not something distracting you from the main event – it is part and parcel of being a human in relationships.
And yes, a good portion is optional/keeping up with the Joneses sort of stuff (see: worrying about Valentines for your toddler…) that we feel heaped upon us, but we could simplify if it really bothers us.
Anon says
Exactly. Just because something is an effort and a struggle doesn’t mean it should be avoided or that something is automatically wrong or unfair, or someone else isn’t helping you enough. We live in a culture that loves a pity party and blame. I’ve been there too but it’s so tiresome.
Anon says
+1 – this can also apply to all the posts about making/keeping friends as an adult.
Anonymous says
Love that! I totally know what you mean.
Anon says
Most years it’s totally fun to plan the holiday. When you have done so for a few years, you do get to a point where kids have big expectations and there is no room to coast for a year. For instance, this past Thanksgiving my FIL had a heart attack on Thanksgiving day. We got through cooking and hosting a bunch of people we barely knew (family invited them) that day, but it was far from celebratory for us.
Then FIL had a rollercoaster month of health issues before passing shortly before X-mas. But Santa still had to come. Cookies still had to be made. Tree still had to go up. Parties attended. And through all of these my DH was in and out of town and emotionally despondent. Christmas felt like a gigantic burden. But you cannot skip Christmas with a 9 and 6 yo. They knew we were sad, and they were sad for FIL too, but the holiday had to go on. Some holidays really are hard.
Anon says
I promise you that you could have skipped Christmas cookie baking and parties the year their grandfather died. They would have been disappointed, but you had a very good reason and it’s not going to traumatize them for life. 6 and 9 is plenty old enough to understand that there was a death in the family and mom and dad don’t have the energy for much beyond a tree and presents this year. I think this is actually a perfect example of moms putting undue pressure on themselves.
Anon says
+1 Preventing our kids from (appropriate) disappointment and sadness does them no favors. Presents are kind of critical but we’ve skipped all the rest from time to time, substituted with things that felt more comfortable for that year (even if that’s just reading holidays stories at home and having a glass of store bought eggnog) and the kids still had great holidays. We weren’t in our own home last year and didn’t even decorate a tree.
Relationships matter – the rest is less critical than we tell ourselves
Anon says
Yeah I actually think there’s a real benefit to letting kids be disappointed in circumstances like this. No one is suggesting giving the kids a lump of coal in their stocking but it’s not realistic for parents to plan The Most Magical Christmas Ever a month after a grandparent dies and it’s good for kids to experience that kind of mild letdown and understand that the world doesn’t revolve around them and grown-ups have feelings too.
Anon says
You can nitpick what activities are important to my particular kids–be it cookies or something else–but the answer is that some years are harder than others. It may be work obligations or illness or family issues or a move or a death or whatever, but the broader point is that there is still pressure to make the holiday happen. You don’t want to drop the ball for your kids.
GCA says
we’ve been juggling work & a sick kid at home today (and all of Easter weekend – so much for any festivities at all) so coming to this discussion late, but thinking about this post and the PTO discussion below:
– it IS a joy to just participate rather than plan. (Also why people throw $ at Disney planners.)
– the societal pressure to take on these ‘fun’ holiday responsibilities and emotional labor is absolutely gendered. Good for you (10:12) if you can a) ignore it, b) have a more equitable balance of spousal labor, or are c) self-aware and lucky enough to be able to consciously pick and choose how you’ll make the magic happen without any Pinterest guilt — BUT that in itself is a privilege you ought to acknowledge. (Team b & c over here.)
Is that something we have to ‘fix’? Yes and no. Some people are genuinely choosing to go over the top to make a holiday magical for their family. Awesome! *Everyone* should have that choice. But are men socialized on a large scale to feel that kind of internal pressure too? Nope, and that’s the part we need to keep talking about until the invisible, unvalued labor becomes visible and valued.
Anon says
how old are your kids and how often do you get through a day with zero meltdowns?
Boston Legal Eagle says
4.5 and almost 7. 0 meltdowns? I don’t think we’ve had such a day yet. Older kid has certainly mellowed a lot, so they are less frequent and physical, but still there. Younger kid is in the very emotional, screaming phase of preschool-hood (though still better than age 3!)
Cb says
5.5, and probably 4/7 days are meltdown free – Friday always involves tears. But the meltdowns are quite short lived, 2 minutes at most. But I think siblings wind each other up more than an only, so there’s less to meltdown about.
OP says
yes, I should’ve added that in my post. i feel like at least half the stuff is sibling related. sometimes i am so jealous of people with one. (i wasn’t sure if i wanted 1 or 2 and have twins, which is fun, but also quite challenging at times)
Cb says
Definitely! As I finished writing that, I heard my son have a meltdown because the neighbour kid tackled him and hurt him.
Anon says
Just a nod to the above that we need to state the good — Mine are the opposite – my kids reach equilibrium much quicker when they are together. My 8 year old (our middle) is happiest when he is surrounded by his older and younger siblings. When he’s solo, he is much needier and whines a great deal more. This is probably true of all of my kids — except my oldest, who has always been very even-keeled, unless she is hungry.
TheElms says
4 and 1 – has not happened yet. I think no meltdowns in a day before age 5 is probably rare, right? I was hoping around 5 we might get the occasional day with no meltdowns and by 6 it would be more than 50% of days and then gone by 7/8 except in rare instances.
Anon says
Mine is newly 5 and capital M meltdowns are pretty rare now – maybe every couple of weeks or even less. She gets weepy/emotional at some point every day though, and until recently had big meltdowns basically daily. She’s at the spirited end of the spectrum though.
FVNC says
This is about where we are, too. We have a newly 6 yr old who old heavy-whines/verges on tears probably daily — usually short-lived — and has capital M meltdowns maybe once every two weeks. Our 9 yr old almost never has meltdowns; when they do happen, they happen for a good reason.
Anon says
This might not be possible with more than one kid! We’ve certainly had days with just *minor* meltdowns that we handle and move on and that I consider a small blip. But chances are someone is unhappy about something at some point. My kids are 7, 5, and 2 and quite spirited.
I regard as a win any day when I manage to keep my cool. We can only control ourselves and our reactions, so I try to focus on my own behavior.
Anonymous says
All kids have their own challenges, sigh. 8 and 4.5 and it hasn’t happened yet. The 8 year old has more meltdowns. The 4.5 year old is very chill but has just started having the occasional tantrum!!
AwayEmily says
Yeah as per CB’s point I think this is going to vary a lot based on whether you have one or multiple kids. On their own, both my 5yo and my 7yo can easily get through a day without a meltdown (which does happen sometimes if parents divide and conquer). But together (as they mostly are)…oof. I’d say maybe once every ten days?
Anonymous says
Caveat that I only have one kid (almost 4) and probably 6/7 days a week are meltdown free. My kid is also perhaps unique that he seems really good at self regulating. For example, at daycare, he sometimes chooses to eat lunch by himself “because I was done talking to people for a little bit.” (This is 100% from his Montessori structured preschool/daycare and has nothing to do with anything DH and I have taught him directly.). He had a meltdown on Saturday late afternoon for about ten minutes after he accidentally spilled a container of bubbles for the third time in a row.
Cb says
Yeah, I think some kids learn the self regulation early. When my son starts to get agitated, he will ask to crawl in our bed and read some stories, which I always say yes to. And we still do rest time, which I think is crucial to all our good behaviour at the weekends.
Isabella says
Just one kid, 13 months old, walking but not talking. I would say maybe two or three sit-on-the-floor and cry type meltdowns a week–plus significant crying in the wee hours of every morning, plus screaming bloody murder when I change a diaper (only me, he doesn’t mind DH or daycare teachers doing it). Probably more tantrums are coming, because he’s an intense little guy.
Anonymous says
almost 5, almost 7 and almost 10. If it isn’t one, then it’s another, but as they’ve gotten older it’s less meltdown and more moodiness/grumpiness/attitude.
Anonymois says
My twins are two and we almost never go a day without a meltdown. The meltdowns are getting shorter though, so 2 minutes instead of 15-30. My oldest stopped totally melting down around age 4. That’s probably unrealistic to expect of twins (having someone your age around constantly can be triggering), but I’m hoping to give them some strategies by age 5 so they can have a smooth transition to kindergarten.
Anon says
Almost 3, and zero % of days. Fewer than five meltdowns I count as a win.
No wins this weekend, as it was time to say goodbye to the pacifier.
Anonymous says
Lol, 2.5, and never. This morning the meltdowns were: 1) she wanted to wear her beloved rain boots even though there’s it’ll be 70 and sunny today and the ground is dry, and 2) the rain boots were already on her feet, so she couldn’t put them on again.
Anon says
5.5 and maybe 1-2 days a week if there are no activities planned and she has slept well and I’m working “normal” hours and not crazy hours (super attached to me). Otherwise, all bets are off. On the flip side, because meltdowns are so frequent, they lose their power? It’s an average Tuesday, not a day-wrecking nightmare. At this age too, it’s mostly a lot of crying, yelling, stomping and rolling around on the floor, or, if we’re lucky, locking herself in her room to throw a fit. We give her 10-15 minutes to cool down and then try whatever it is that set her off again.
GCA says
4.5 — maybe one meltdown a day or every other day, especially when bickering with older sib, or tired/ hangry (before dinner, or after dinner when we’re trying to get them through the cleanup and bedtime routine). Mostly consist of “I don’t LIKE ___ any more!” (insert name of whoever is bothering her – brother, or nagging parent)
Almost-8 — Meltdowns are pretty rare. One meltdown a week, maybe? Again, usually when tired. But we’re getting flashes of that tween eye-rolling ‘ugh, MOM’ stage.
Anonymous says
The kids’ or mine?
HSAL says
Just survived a week at Disney during spring break with a 7 year old and two 4 year olds. Ask Me Anything. :)
HSAL says
Whoa don’t know how that triple post happened, sorry!
Anon says
FLA or CA? Would you recommend? We’re considering CA during next year’s SB.
HSAL says
FL, sorry. I’m in the Midwest so CA isn’t on my radar. We won’t go during spring break again, mainly for travel reasons. You should check out the crowd calendars for CA during spring break. It wasn’t unbearable but I think it’ll always be more pleasant with fewer people.
Anonymous says
What was the final bill?
HSAL says
We had a family suite at Art of Animation – between that and five days of park tickets it was $6900. Other big but optional expenses were three character meals ($900) and five days of Genie+ (almost $900, vomit). Food is ridiculously expensive and it’s super tacky that room fridges don’t keep food at a safe temperature.
Anon says
“room fridges don’t keep food at a safe temperature”
Is this unique to Disney? I know most hotels only have a small fridge that isn’t super cold but I’ve had no issues storing leftovers in them for a day or two.
HSAL says
Not sure if it’s unique or not, but this was the longest stay I’d had in a place with a mini fridge, and it was labeled as being kept at 41 degrees. We kept fruit and drinks in there, but I’m particular about keeping most food at an appropriate temperature. It’s annoying to not being able to keep a half gallon of milk at a food safe temp. My husband was unbothered so YMMV.
Anonymous says
Omg girl. 40 degrees is fine 41 certainly is
Anon says
Oh ok, yeah I would have no issues keeping food at 41 degrees for a couple days. You can also buy shelf-stable milk FYI. Most organic milk is ultra-pasteurized and safe to keep at room temperature, although most people prefer to drink it cold.
HSAL says
Yeah, I don’t doubt that it would be fine 99% of the time, but I mainly think it’s tacky that Disney intentionally keeps it above food-safe temps to discourage people from keeping food in their rooms. We brought some food because we drove, but definitely bring drinks if you can – a 20 oz bottle of soda is $4.69.
Anonymous says
If you keep milk at 41 degrees it will be sour within a day. They absolutely know what they are doing. However, I have almost never had a hotel minifridge anywhere that actually kept anything cold.
Anon says
I think you’re reading too much into this. I’m not a Disney fan and haven’t been to Disney but hotel mini-fridges are never very cold. If they wanted to discourage you from keeping food in the room, they wouldn’t provide a fridge (I’ve been to resorts that don’t have them).
Anon says
I used to stay at a Westin that had repurposed mini bar fridges – couldn’t store something like milk in them. I think they were called beverage chillers or something. So annoying.
Anon says
did you use a planner? where did you stay? was it just ‘survival’ or actually fun? please share all
Anon says
adding onto this, what was your itinerary – how many days in each park, etc. things you’d recommend vs. skip.
HSAL says
We did use a planner – gave her some vague parameters and she gave us options and pricing. She also has a client Facebook group with tips, and she sends out lots of reminders and information. Highly recommend if you’re starting from scratch.
Art of Animation suites were great, good location and fantastic pool. We did Magic Kingdom Monday and Friday, Epcot Tuesday, Animal Kingdom Wednesday, Hollywood Studios Thursday. I wish we had skipped AK and done a rest day at the hotel/Disney Springs instead. We did the safari, which was nice, and a couple of little things but it wasn’t that impressive for the cost (we weren’t interested in Avatar stuff).
Epcot was fine but so spread out. Frozen and Ratatouille were great, and Turtle Talk with Crush was a delight, but I wouldn’t do a full day there with younger kids.
I would have liked more time at Hollywood Studios – my husband went back on his own to do the Star Wars stuff because my kids can’t hang at night. That could probably be two days to do everything.
Magic Kingdom was great, and two days felt right there. The fireworks were absolutely stunning – they do these amazing projections on the castle and Main Street buildings and they’re just incredible.
We had a good time! I definitely enjoyed it and it wasn’t just survival. One note for people with three young kids – there are a few rides that require an adult to ride with kids under 7, so we each had a twin and our oldest had to ride by herself on those. We’ll go back when the twins are 7 or 8 so it’s more balanced with who rides alone.
Lily says
Hi can you point me to the name of the planner you used?
HSAL says
I had a very long post that went to m0d, hopefully it’ll show up!
Anonymous says
We’re going to -Land next week! I’m nervous but excited. With an almost-4 year old who currently alternates between having awesome fun days and terrible melty days, so we’ll see what happens on the trip.
What rides do you recommend for the 4-year-old level?
Boston Legal Eagle says
Anything in Fantasyland should be a good bet. Get there early to avoid the long lines, as most are not on Genie+. My 4 year old didn’t want to do most rides, but he was ok with the ones here.
HSAL says
Just survived a week at Disney during spring break with a 7 year old and two 4 year olds. Ask Me Anything. :)
HSAL says
I just survived a week at Disney during spring break with a 7 year old and two 4 year olds. Ask Me Anything. :)
Anon says
Is there a type of therapy (might not be the right word) to teach a young child how to play/interact with peers appropriately? My 4.75 yo has struggled with various behaviors this year, including not being good at sharing and being too enthusiastic with his hugging and patting his friends (squeezing/hitting too hard). I’ve been really frustrated that his teachers’ approach is to segregate him with quiet tasks (including looking through a toy catalog) rather than teach him appropriate behavior. I thought the point of preschool was to learn to interact with others! I’m working on it at home, but he doesn’t listen to me the way he does to a 3rd party, so I’m wondering if there is some type of therapy or class that works on this. Thanks!
Anon says
This behavior is still very normal at age 4, although I think it’s weird the school’s response is to segregate him. Our daycare teaches social skills very explicitly and I think it’s a huge part of why my kid seems so much better at interacting with peers than I was.
Anon says
Yes this is normal. I just finished the book Rest, Play, Grow re: parenting preschoolers and it repeatedly empathizes that maturity is a process that can’t be rushed, and impulse control/other behaviors that we use as proxies for “being good” don’t take root until ages 5 to 7 for most kids. The issue is the school’s approach, not your kid.
Anonymous says
First, this is both hard and normal. You’re a kind mom for wanting to help him. Do you have any mom friends who can help you model appropriate behavior? I don’t think a 4-5 year old can really say “that’s too hard” or “I’m uncomfortable.” My mom friends who will gently say “hey that’s too hard; can you show me a gentle touch?” Of course you should also offer “do overs” to him – just because he doesn’t take correction well from you doesn’t mean you shouldn’t keep trying. This will all come with time and as he gets more interactions with other kids. Sorry the teachers aren’t being helpful. Could you be curious about their tactics and maybe ask why they take that approach? Maybe he is actually overstimulated (when one of mine plays too rough I know he needs a break) so that may be their thinking. They may also just find it easier, in which case maybe you could offer them an alternative approach.
Anon says
Seems like an odd approach from the teachers. I’d ask them to tell you more about what they are seeing and the goal of separating him.
The hitting and hugging bc sounds like sensory seeking – if you google that you’ll find lots of suggestions for heavy work to help the kid. I’d talk to the pediatrician too.
Anon says
how old are your kids and how often do you make it through a day with zero meltdowns. (wondering if that day will every come)
OP says
apologies for the double post
Boston Legal Eagle says
Speaking of extra, are any of you on your schools’ PTO? What has the experience been like? Ours is looking for volunteers and part of me feels the need to help out (because someone needs to and it’s for the kids, right?) and part of me is thinking, I wonder if dads feel this (internal) pressure? I’m always looking for more friends in the neighborhood, and I wonder what this crew would be like. I don’t think it’s all SAHMs anymore, but I’m not sure if there are others with busy jobs. Is this just more unpaid labor on my part? We do donate $$ every year.
Anon says
so i am involved (but I work part-time) and i actually think it is important to have all types of parents on the PTO to represent different perspectives, but also realize it is unpaid labor and time you might not have.
anon says
Nope. I’ll write checks for fundraisers but this is a boundary I’ve set for myself that I will not cross. Maybe it’s uniquely my district, but it sounds so full of drama and pettiness from the neighbors I’ve talked to who are on it or in the circle of women who are at the centerfold. A lot of invented problems and stuff requiring brain space that I simply don’t have to give.
Anon says
I joined our daycare PTO hoping to make mom friends. It was pretty much a huge waste of time – I basically never spoke in the meetings and didn’t make a connection with anyone. YMMV but I’ve realized I’m much better one-on-one and am never going to be the type of person who shines in a large group. I do volunteer in the K-12 classrooms but that’s because I want to, not because I feel pressured to, and that is much more about helping the kids than making mom friends.
Anonymous says
I am not super involved but try to help out when I can, mostly because I really appreciate the work they do to make our school a community and am well aware exactly how much work that is. Mine is pretty good about letting you give however much time you’re willing (with the caveat that I live in a city where almost all the households are dual income). Also on the dad answer, for my husband anyway the answer is zero, and I guilt tripped him HARD this year to make him chaperone a field trip. I think he took my point though- like the stuff we value about the school shouldn’t only happen because of moms. That said, there are several involved dads on our PTO which is great.
Boston Legal Eagle says
I will say that I (gently) pressure my husband to coach my kid’s soccer team, and youth sports coaching (it’s mostly parent volunteers here) are where a lot of dads show up. I’m not sure how that compares to the work involved in the PTO, but I have absolutely no desire or athletic ability to coach, so I’m looking at the PTO as my wheelhouse.
I absolutely hate drama and also thrive one on one v. group, so it’s still a question.
HSAL says
I’m involved with ours. It’s been a good way to meet other parents, and I like being able to help out. This is only my second year but there’s been no drama. We have a couple involved dads but mainly moms. My neighborhood probably makes up 80% of the active parents. I support volunteering to the extent you’re able, because these are truly things that don’t happen without involved parents, and it really increases a feeling of community at the school.
Cb says
Yeah, my husband attended the first meeting and came home and said “isn’t it funny how all our kids’ friends were there?” Yep, birds of a feather and all that. It’s always t( same group volunteering at school stuff, eco days, swap shops, etc.
AwayEmily says
My kids are in a Title 1 school where there is a lot of inequality so to some extent I feel like as someone with both more time and income than many of the parents at the school, I have a moral obligation to participate (not saying EVERYONE should feel this way, it’s just how I feel). That being said, I am only just now (after my oldest has been there for 2 years) starting to do something about it. I decided I would help with fundraising logistics (partly because I think they do an inefficient job of it, and it’s something I can do from home rather than requiring me to be at a certain place at a certain time) and so set up a 1-on-1 with the treasurer to get their current setup. After that meeting, I committed to writing fundraising emails, increasing email listserv membership, and reaching out to local businesses for in-kind donations.
Anonymous says
My oldest started kindergarten last fall. I attend PTO meetings and have done some very minor volunteering for them (like stuffing envelopes). I mainly wanted to see what was going on in the school, and PTO is ok for that but not great. I honestly don’t feel obligated to join: my area is very SAHM heavy and many of them treat PTO like a full time job. That is fine but I’m not going to devote that amount of time to it and I feel like that would just frustrate the moms who are very invested so I just stay out of it. I definitely feel you on the internal pressure. DH does not get it and that’s ok. I try to remind myself our kids don’t have to do all the activities.
Cb says
My husband is our family tribute. And he’s found it helpful for feeling useful and meeting other parents (there are 3 PTA dads who hang out together, but everyone greets him really cheerfully). I’ll show up and volunteer to hand out the Christmas cards and I’m going to run the uniform bank this summer, but I don’t want to go to meetings.
GCA says
My husband is about 50% more extroverted than I am, and he’s our family tribute for that reason :) I will write letters and checks and go speak at the school committee meeting but run away and hide at home straight afterwards!
Anonymous says
I refuse to participate in the PTA because 1) the only volunteer opportunity that is feasible for working parents is limited to dads and 2) all the fundraising is for smart boards, which are a stupid waste of money.
Cb says
As someone who teaches uni, down with the smart board. Just give me a whiteboard and a working marker.
Anon says
No, because the dynamics are very weird. It’s a small close-knit group of people that has hoards of money (we are in a very affluent district) but very few “outsider” volunteers and so it’s a bigger workload than I want to take on, and once they get their claws into you, it’s very hard to extricate yourself from being pressured for volunteer opportunities (I have heard from several neighbors), which as a people pleaser I try to avoid putting myself in those scenarios. It was actually shocking to me given the demographics (and large number of SAHMs) that they are so active but that people will write a check but not donate any time or take on any roles, especially growing up in a school where the PTO exec board was probably 30 people and general membership meetings filled the gymnasium. Our general membership meetings have maybe 30 people and there are 5 people on the exec board (most of whom are SAHMs, plus one part-time dad).
On the other hand, I lead a girl scout troop that is based at the school so I am giving my “volunteer hours” to our school community via that route, which is both more fulfilling to me and a lighter workload.
Anon says
I’m room parent for DS #2’s (private) kinder class, which has been minimal work – setting up a Whatsapp chat, reminding parents about things, and setting up google sheets for parties. It’s also a group of way chilled out parents – DS #2’s chat for PreK is…way more stressful and active. Go figure.
I went to a PTO meeting for the public school where DS #1 will be attending kinder again next year, and really appreciated the diversity of families and the hard work that is clearly put in to build community and get additional resources to the school. We’re in a massive school district, in a huge city, in a state that criminally underfunds public school. I do plan to be involved but not sure in what capacity. The school has a 501(c)(3) fund (again, criminally underfunded schools, so the schools with active PTOs do this) so worst case we will make a generous anon donation.
busybee says
Any recommendations for strollers that can hold two infant seats and later, two toddler seats? The UppaBaby Vista cannot do two toddler seats, which would make it useless when the twins are past a year or so.
Or is a wagon the way to go, rather than a stroller? Our older one will be exactly 2 years older than the twins (like, possibly all sharing a birthday).
HSAL says
We went from the frame stroller for infant seats to a city mini gt double. I would just recommend the frame stroller and then whatever stroller or wagon you want – the frames have good resale value.
Anon says
Bumbleride indie twin. Bugaboo donkey.
I have the bugaboo donkey3 and have a 27 month old and 4 month old. I like it because it can be parent facing, and it is a side by side. It only takes one or two brands of car seats (pls don’t quote me on that). The fold is not super smooth, but I’m mostly using it for walks to the playground and rarely schlep it in my car (CRV, fits with plenty of room leftover).
Anon says
I had this spread and got the Joovy Qool, and switched over to a Zoe double at about 18 months/3.5. The Qool has a 3rd seat with a buckle and higher weight limits than the Vista (which is not a good stroller for twins IMO).
Anon says
read Lucie’s List. also a twin mom. it depends a lot on how you plan on using your stroller – like are you in a walking area or in and out of the car. we went from the frame stroller to a jogging stroller that we use to walk around bc we lived in a very walkable area at the time with uneven streets and a Zoe for the car/travel. we considered the City Mini GT Double, but wheels weren’t good enough for our sidewalks and almost went with the Bumbleride
Redux says
For those who attend church regularly: How much do you contribute weekly/annually? DH and I have not attended church for like 20 years, but joined a (new to us) church last year that is currently doing its annual campaign. There are very loose guidelines and *how much* is unhelpfully left very vague (it’s a UU for what that’s worth). I can recall hearing as a child that a certain church required 10% tithing and that being a lot (and now that I am an adult, can confirm: still seems like a LOT!) and I remember what my family used to put in our weekly envelopes for our Catholic church as a child (nb: nowhere near 10%). Currently we’re putting $20/week in the collection basket which seems like too little considering we’ve got 2 kids in religious ed classes, but… not sure what is typical. I get that this is not transactional, but the spirit is not moving me to a particularly precise number and I need to write a check, spirit!
Anon says
We have to pay for religious Ed separately, and we put $30-50 in the basket each week (sometimes there are second collections – Catholic). To me that seems too little, but we’re working up (my goal is to reach $100/week). We also contribute to other drives the church/diocese runs throughout the year. Church is a big part of life/value for us, though; if it’s not for you, adjust accordingly (that is not snark, but more to say that donations are very personal.)
Anon UU says
We are UU’s and we give $600/month (HHI about $250k). RE is $50 a year for members I think (it’s more for non-members. We have a lot of people who come for the good RE which is fine but we encourage them to move towards membership). Our collection basket does not go to the church, it always goes to an outside charity.
anon says
If your collection doesn’t go to church, how does your church pay for building/utilities/clergy salaries/etc? Or are you distinguishing the literal collection basket from monthly/annual giving?
Anon UU says
We talk about it in terms of pledging vs the physical basket that gets passed around on Sunday morning. The money in the basket always goes to someone else. The expenses for our congregation come from monthly checks, giving etc.
EDAnon says
We give, I think, $300 a month, pay $60 for religious education, and I volunteer as a teacher. Also, UU. HHI is like $330k. We have given the same amount for years and should increase it since our salaries have gone up.
Anonymous says
We are United Methodists. Tithing is the aspirational ideal, but I get the impression that very few UMC members actually achieve it. There’s no way our family could afford to tithe in this season of life, and even if we could donate 10% of our income I wouldn’t give it all to the church. Last year the finance committee showed the distribution of annual giving in the congregation and the median seemed to be around $2,000 – 3,000 per household per year in a LCOL/MCOL area. Seeing the church’s budget can also be helpful in deciding how much to give. Our church is quite frugal, pays its staff far less than they would earn in comparable secular positions, and to my mind doesn’t invest nearly enough in certain programs, and it still costs over $1M per year to keep the lights on and the place running.
Spirograph says
also United Methodist. I give $250/month, designating general fund and hunger ministry amounts. and some extra for “special offerings” occasionally. This is nowhere near a 10% tithe but also not our only charitable giving.
anonn says
Also UM, we give 900 a month plus 100 here and there to campaigns like school supply drives and then 1,000 at end of year giving, HHI is around 370. we used to increase the monthly amount whenever we got a raise but didn’t the last two years due to inflation and job uncertainty. We also give additional if we get a bonus.
Anonymous says
I pledge $100 a month and then add to the collection plate depending solely on what cash is in my wallet.
anon says
$1000/month in standard offering, plus contributions to other fundraising efforts during the year (toy drive, toiletry drive, fundraiser for homeless shelter, scholarship fund, etc.). That’s in addition to other charitable giving outside the church, some of which is to religious orgs (but most is not). HHI is $4mm pretax. We donate 10% of our posttax income taking into account church and non-church giving.
Anonymous says
Whenever I see comments like this I wonder where I went wrong in life.
Anonymous says
I assume they’re big law partners and I don’t think I went “wrong” – that lifestyle is awful and I wouldn’t want it for all the money in the world.
Anoon says
I assume family money. King stay the king (and give generously to the king’s church!)
Anon says
what do you and your partner do for a living? both in big law or big finance?
anon says
Big law equity partner plus very senior in-house at an F50. No family money – parents on both sides are upper middle class but nobody’s getting an inheritance, we paid for school with student loans, etc.
Anon for this says
We aim to give 10% tithe of gross + annual missions contribution. It’s what we’ve decided based on our convictions; no one is hounding us to give x amount.
Momofthree says
I was raised Catholic & am now raising Jewish kids. We pay ~1500 in dues to our synagogue and then ~$500 per kid for religious education. We give money to various donation campaigns run through the synagogue with partner organizations (i.e., school supply drives, migrant support, etc.). We also give to a variety of other causes (religious is about 10% of our donations per year). I’d like to work up to 10% of net income going to charity but we’re not there yet.
Anon says
$1500 is low for synagogue dues! Our local Reform temple “suggests” a $5k yearly contribution if your household income is above $120k, which ours (barely) is. That would require us to change our lifestyle pretty substantially, at least while we still have daycare bills. We’re currently paying $1,200/year for unaffiliated religious school tuition and not joining the synagogue but I don’t know how long we can get away with this, as there is definitely pressure to become members.
Anon says
UMC. Tithe of post tax income. When I started giving regularly it was more like $20/week. No family money, not big law. It’s a journey/discipline.
Pledging (even if a small amount) is more helpful bc the church can plan with that.
Liza says
I put $50 a week when I attend.
SF says
I’m 38 and have almost no skincare routine. Is there somewhere I can go where they can get me started? Or would you just jump to something like botox?
dry skin, starting to have some lines. I’ve been blessed with no breakouts, which is how I got to my late 30s without knowing this stuff. In LA so likely have access to everything.
Anonymous says
Start easy. Buy a moisturizer labeled anti aging at the drug store, and then your skin care routine is wash in the morning and put sunscreen on and wash at night and put moisturizer on. Don’t waste money on anything else until you’ve established Some good habits.
Spirograph says
This. I am 39 and finally started doing something other than sunscreen moisturizer and washing my face in the shower last year. if you don’t already use moisturizer with sunscreen during the day, start with that. Otherwise, my routine (such that it is) consists of an oil-based cleanser at night and in the morning, and some thicker night cream moisturizer. I got some kind of drug store anti-aging serum thing that I put on at night before the moisturizer most nights.
If you do any facial waxing, know that you should NOT do that if you’re using retinoid products. you have to stop a week or two before you wax, otherwise you’ll lose some skin!
OOO says
Hi fellow 38 year old! I would get a facial from a really good spa. They will assess your skin and recommend products for you
Anon says
35 here. I got serious about my skincare in my early 30’s after pregnancy/nursing. I would see a derm to get specific recommendations (and maybe a retinol script?) but my doctor told me the three things she almost always recommends are daily SPF, a Vitamin C serum, and retinol. I do SPF daily, Vitamin C serum every AM, and alternate retinol and lactic acid at night (though both of these can take some time for your skin to adjust to, so start slow or mix with moisturizer at first).
I also get Botox and I do think it’s the biggest gamechanger in terms of my skin. Everything I mentioned above will help with dark spots and wrinkles but nothing makes them actually go away like Botox.
Anne-on says
If you really don’t care too much and just want a simple routine, curology is a great service. They’ll bundle the wash and sunblock with your prescription, and they can do a formulation which targets ‘dullness’ and ‘fine lines’ vs. acne. Botox is great, but if you’re not concerned about your forehead lines or your 11’s then I don’t see any reason to spend the money.
Facials are also great but I have yet to have any facialist know more about skincare and products than I do by virtue of doing a deep dive on the skincareaddicts borad on reddit, or by following some old school skincare bloggers on instagram.
Anon says
Curology is an effortless way to get a retinoid prescription.
Anonymous says
I‘m 37. My skincare routine is as follows: try to remember sunscreen on days I’m not wearing makeup ( so 5/7 days). Force myself to wash my face every night. Put on moisturizer at bedtime in the winter…sometimes. If this sounds like you, you may be interested in Botox (or Dysport). I googled a reputable Dermatologist in my neighborhood who does it and now I’m basically on autopilot. Things I like: it’s not expensive, if you don’t like it you can stop without major consequences, and tons of people have done it long-term. I do it maybe twice a year now. I also like OOO’s suggestion to get a facial, but that’s more effort than I’m willing to put in atm.
Soon to be Momanon says
I am due in early July with my first kiddo and am also a senior associate in a mid-size firm. I have what I can only describe as a serious case of senioritis. I love my job and my clients but I am pretty burnt out on work and every little thing is starting to drive me crazy. All I want to do is nest and think about my soon to come kiddo but I know I should keep up a strong showing at work so that I that I can go out on mat leave on a good note with both my colleagues and clients. Does anyone have any “magic bullet” coping mechanisms that I could use to help keep me sane and focused on work until July?
TheElms says
Lists. Make yourself a list of things that have to get done and things that are nice to get done each day. Make sure you do the have to get done things every day. Do those things really well. People will remember your excellent work.
REAtty says
I am having such a hard time understanding why you would say this other than to make someone else (possibly a lot of people, considering that this isn’t an uncommon feeling to share on this website) feel bad. I hope your day gets better and bless your heart.