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I have wide feet so I find a lot of cute shoes uncomfortable. (Here’s looking at you, pointy-toed flats.) But knit boots like this tall pair from Eileen Fisher stretch to accommodate my feet.
Made from a stretchy knit sourced from recycled plastic bottles, these boots offer a flexible fit where you need it — it feels like wearing socks out and about. The chunky 2.5-inch heel gives plenty of lift while remaining walkable.
Winterize your favorite dresses and skirts by adding these boots to your cold weather wardrobe.
Eileen Fisher’s Ophelia Knit Tall Boot is $290 at Nordstrom and comes in sizes 5.5–11.
Sales of note for 12.5.23…
(See all of the latest workwear sales at Corporette!)
- Nordstrom – Holiday sale up to 50% off; 5x the points on beauty for a limited time
- Ann Taylor – 40% off your purchase & extra 15% off sweaters
- Banana Republic – Up to 40% off select styles; up to 40% off sale styles
- Banana Republic Factory – 50% off everything & extra 20% off purchase
- Eloquii – Extra 60% off all sale
- J.Crew – 40% off your purchase with code
- Lands’ End – Up to 70% off everything; free shipping (readers love the cashmere)
- Loft – 50% off your purchase with code (ends 12/5)
- Summersalt – Up to 60% off select styles & free scarf with orders $125+ (this reader-favorite sweater blazer is down to $75)
- Talbots – 40% off your regular-price purchase; extra 50% off all markdowns
- Zappos – 34,000+ women’s sale items! Check out these reader-favorite workwear brands on sale, and some of our favorite kid shoe brands on sale.
Kid/Family Sales
- Crate&kids – Free shipping sitewide; up to 50% off toy + gift event; free monogramming for a limited time only (order by 12/15)
- J.Crew Crewcuts – 40% off your purchase with code
- Pottery Barn Kids – Up to 50% off toys, furniture & gifts
- Graco – Holiday savings up to 35% off; sign up for texts for 20% off full-price item
- Walmart – Up to 25% off top baby gifts; big savings on Delta, Graco, VTech, Fisher-Price & more
Mathy says
After 3 years of WFH (and two babies in there, and all the body changes that came with it), I have completely lost my style. I am turning 40 in a matter of days and I have no idea of what clothes to buy and, on top of that, where to even go to buy clothes. I needed a dress for family pictures this Saturday and where I used to shop – Banana, JCrew, Talbots, Gap – all seem like they don’t fit what I need. I just batch ordered 15 dresses from Amazon in hopes that I can find literally something, but I need help.
Where do I start? Where do I go? I tend to dress more on the conservative side, I am apparently a “deep autumn” based on my middle-of-the-night instagram stalking, and I am a size 14-16 (with larger tops needed thanks to all the sagging that comes with several years of nursing). I need tops, non-denim pants, shoes, business casual for the occasional in person event at work. I need everything outside of athleisure and am basically starting over.
More Sleep Would Be Nice says
Hi there – I just turned 40 a few months ago. As someone who loves fashion (but isn’t a big shopper), I have to say – be gentle with yourself because it is hard out there right now to shop. These mall stores that were solid several years ago have severely dropped in quality while keeping the same non-sale prices (exception I think is BR – they seem to have some gems, and I’ve never shopped at Talbots, so I can’t comment). When I’ve shopped on Amazon for clothes, I’ve mostly struck out pretty hard, so if nothing works from your batch order, don’t feel bad.
Have you thought about working with a stylist? It doesn’t have to be anything crazy, even going to a local Nordstrom’s is where you can get some immediate help. I know 3 people who have done this for various life transitions (new job, back to work in-office after 2 kids, etc.) and had a great experience.
More Sleep Would Be Nice says
Oh, and a new ride-or-die for me are the BR Hayden Pants. I buy them used on Poshmark. These may help fill the need for work pants.
Spirograph says
+1 to working with a stylist. I like fashion but hate to shop, and I have been meaning to do a Nordstrom personal shopper appt. I did it a couple times pre-pandemic, and although I bought more than I intended to, they were great pieces that I’ve gotten a ton of wear out of in the last several years.
GCA says
I could’ve written this too – 40 next year, never had a sense of style to begin with, body reshaped post-babies. I mostly WFH with the occasional in-person event.
The surprise hit for me in terms of budget x fit x quality is JCrew Factory – my work trousers are from there. For Zoom calls I can get away with a rotating selection of their sweater blazers over some sort of simple top. And seconding the BR rec, BR does that ‘deep autumn’ warm toned clothing quite well.
Anon says
+1 to J Crew Factory. I mostly live in athleisure these days, since I WFH full time and don’t need business clothes even on the rare occasions I see colleagues (I’m in higher ed) but J. Crew Factory is my go-to for family photos and occasional nicer outfits for date nights or vacations.
Anonymous says
Check out Evereve.
New Here says
VERY similar position to you – WFH since March 2020, had baby at end of 2019, turning 40 next July. Similar size too, though more 16 than 14.
Do you have an Anthro near you? I wore the Somerset Maxi for our fall pics a couple of weeks ago. I did the black floral print. I love that dress and wear it a lot for social and work (business casual).
Waffles says
I don’t really enjoy shopping for clothing and shoes because I’m really picky, so it’s difficult. Shopping for jewelry and handbags, however, is a different story. It tends to work out in the end, because I’ll get the best basic clothing and shoes that I can find, then add personality with jewelry and bags.
Right now, sculptural jewelry pieces, pearls, and ear cuffs are on trend, and when they are gold-plated rather than solid gold, they can be affordable enough to allow for some experimentation. For some interesting pieces, the brands Completedworks, Monica Vinader, and Alighieri come to mind.
I think any bag that is practical and makes you feel happy while carrying it goes a long way to boost style as well. Hope you enjoy the process — looking forward to Black Friday!
OOO says
I’m in a very similar situation. Check out LOFT. I bought a dress for family pics there recently. It’s almost sold out otherwise I would add link here.
TheElms says
Looks like we are all in good company! 1 baby shortly before the pandemic started, 1 baby in during the pandemic, about to be 41. Back in the office 4-5 days a week, in a workplace with a now extremely confusing dress code. I need everything from suits to dressy casual for work. It is HARD. I echo the JCrew Factory recommendation and I still find some tops at Loft. Pants are the real struggle because nothing seems to fit and the couple things I’ve taken to see if they could be altered the seamstress was skeptical it would look good or it was going to be $80+.
Style says
What has worked for me (same boat as you): J Crew Factory, Nordstrom, Evereve, Talbots (mostly dresses & tops). Anthro (selectively – some of those tops and dresses are very low cut)
Anonymous says
Check out Alison Bornstein’s new book “Wear It Well.” I follow her on social and love her approach to dressing and her closet method! Super helpful for figuring out your sense of style and how to turn it into outfits. She also does styling consultations but they’re hard to get and I think pricey (I’ve never done one).
The key is to figure out the brands that work for you. For me that’s been a mix of utilitarian (Alex Mill, APC, Everlane) and French girl style (Sezane, Smallable, etc). I try to ignore trends and buy what I know I’ll wear for years.
It’s hard, but I think the main thing I would say is that it’s worth it. I’ve been figuring this out step by step for the last couple years and I’m finally at a point where I actually like my clothes.
Anonymous says
I liked the book The Curated Closet for the same purpose. I also found the color seasons and Kibbe body type concepts useful in validating why I always like or dislike certain styles, colors, and cuts. The trick is to figure out what works for you and seek that out. I do like to stay on the more current side of classic as long as the style is flattering to me. For example, I have bought a couple of chunky waist-length sweaters because those are current and look good on me, but I don’t have any tops or sweaters that are actually cropped. On the other hand, about 50% of my wardrobe is black and 0% of it is brightly colored, despite all of this season’s influencer posts about how bright colors such as red are trending. I look best in black, and when I buy clothes in other colors I never want to wear them.
Anon says
My almost three year old gets quite a lot of screen time. I solo parent a lot and have a ~1 year old so I need the TV to nurse, cook, put the baby to sleep, and regain my sanity. I’m guessing we average 5-7 hrs a week. He has a meltdown whenever we turn it off. But he also has meltdowns for everything. We try to sometimes replace it with the Yoto.
I wish we were zero screen time but honestly I need it.
That said, my son is still very creative, loves engaging in pretend play, builds with magnatiles, plays with his nugget, etc. We read out loud to him at least 30 min a day.
Anonymous says
Just did this one for family pics and felt really good in it! (I’m a size 12, ordered a large but I’m a definite pear, so YMMV)
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07HVS4KL4?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share
Anon says
For those of you who limit kids’ screen time, is it worth it? Do you find that your kids are generally creative, imaginative, etc., and if you used to allow screen time, is there a difference from before? Are their moods and behaviors better? Basically want to find out if the effort is generally worth it when my goal is for my kid to have the most fun possible in childhood (rather than be “college ready.”) I think that goal might be better met with no or very limited screens. Thoughts?
Anon says
I mean, I think most people have *some* limit on screentime (I’ve never heard anyone say “my kids have unlimited screens”), but what that limit is varies widely.
We do lower than average (I think) screentime but are not close to zero. My view is that screens in moderation can definitely be part of a healthy and fun childhood. I have very fond childhood memories of playing the classic 90s computer games, both alone and with friends. It’s only a problem if the child is focusing on screens at the exclusion of other kinds of fun. I don’t think no screentime is objectively better on principle, and one thing to keep in mind is that TV and computer/video games can be a big source of connection with other kids. My kid started bonding with other kids over shared love for TV characters as young as age 3 and that only happens more as they get older and develop interest in social screen-based activities like video games. I didn’t really watch TV growing up (it wasn’t banned, but we didn’t have TV in any public area of our house) and I definitely feel like it made it harder for me to relate to peers because I was missing so many basic pop culture references. So for me it was a very conscious choice to introduce it, at least in limited amounts.
Anon says
Oh and on the creativity point, my kid is extremely imaginative and into pretend play. I don’t think TV suppresses creativity and imaginary play. If anything, I think it encourages it because they can play in character. My daughter and her preschool BFF played Bluey & Bingo every day for more than a year.
Anon says
Yes, I think so. My kids are 8, 6, and 2. We don’t do screens on weekdays, and they play really well and creatively those days – hot wheels, Lego, dress up and make believe, reading, biking in the yard, etc. This is obviously my subjective opinion, but they seem a lot more into toys than their peers.
We allow TV on weekend mornings and video games on weekend evenings, and they do become much more focused on getting to screen time during those days…but at the same time, since they know we have most of the day screen-free, they still do play well and we spend a lot of time hanging out as a family (they help with yard work, we play games, etc).
We were never a screen-heavy family, but there have been times of screen time creep when everyone’s a little moodier and “bored”, and when we pull back I always notice a difference.
Overall, my kids seems to have very good attention spans (even with suspected ADHD for at least one) and still act like kids…while peers are talking about Fortnite and TikTok (literally, in first grade.) I count that as a win.
Anon says
I’ll add that I’m a SAHM right now and we have late bedtimes, so the kids have a solid 4+ hours after school everyday, and the toddler is home all the time. So filling those hours with focused play time is significant
Cb says
I think really set times help so they aren’t asking all the time as does content – we do Netflix on the tv, no Youtube (exception made for the Australian lego speedbuild when my mom is visiting)
My son and his pal were arguing over their choice for afternoon TV (pal was here from 9-5 so we needed a bit of a break) and his pal said “but you got to choose morning telly!” “Morning telly isn’t a thing in this house!”
CCLA says
Agree with this and the screen creep. My kids (5 and 7) are super creative and play well without TV, like hours on end of pretend play or legos or dolls or some combo, or now reading for the older one, but when we have crazy busy weeks and they get a little more TV time, I can tell a difference when we pull back. We allow an hour a day max (2 hours on weekends), never in the morning, and have many days where the amount is zero. They know that max time does not mean guaranteed time. Limits go out the window when they’re sick or when we’re traveling.
I also see a big difference in TV time vs iPad time. When my kids watch TV they’re almost always choosing to draw while watching, dancing to the title songs, and often talking together about what’s happening. By contrast when watching on the iPad, or the few times we tried using even the math or reading games on the iPad, I was astounded by how tuned out to the world my kinder kid was last year and we decided to opt out of tablets for now unless we’re traveling.
Anon says
Completely agree on the tablets. The kids kindle fire is my most regretted purchase and it is frequently packed away (sometimes we pull it out because we only have one TV and with three kids sometimes it’s helpful to have a different show option).
There is research bearing this out, too; the closer range of viewing and ability to click around themselves really lights up those addictive brain centers, and is much more likely to have the “zombie” effect. Even when my kids play Switch we have them do it on the big tv, together (and then adults can monitor it, too).
anon says
We have had the same experience with tablets, so decided the screen time we allow (short spurts while we’re preparing lunch/dinner, and about 20-30 minutes post-nap) would only be on the TV. We have a tablet and a phone loaded with games and downloads that our son (who is 3) can have only while we’re traveling or if we are at a grown-up restaurant (and then only until the food arrives).
Anon says
I don’t think anecdote is really going to help here. There are countless studies on the impact of excessive screen time for little kids. I personally think small amounts of screen time are fine, but it’s really important that it doesn’t become the default and that kids also engage in active and imaginative play. That being said, I think most parents don’t use screens because they think they’re educational, they use them because sometimes they need a break, cook a meal, tend to another child, etc. So a little screen time in moderation is fine if necessary to maintain sanity and otherwise be a better parent.
Anonymous says
I have a moody 10 year old who doesn’t get a lot of screen time but she doesn’t engage in imaginative play, either. Honestly, she just broods, makes bracelets, and occasionally reads in between sports practices, school, and bed. Or watching sports on TV. It’s a big struggle right now.
My other kids play nicely together. My 10 year old is too “old” for their play, but doesn’t want solo time, and I have to work/make dinner/get the little kids ready. We’re at a standoff and it’s been like this for 2 months. I suggest chores she can do to keep from getting bored if she doesn’t like any other options (which include walking to the library and/or corner store, both of which are about a 12 minute walk away).
DLC says
Same here with my ten year old. I feel like mine is just killing time until she can have her screen back. She does read a lot, but that’s about it. When she has an activity with a goal (ie she made her own halloween costume) she’s fine but she very rarely is that motivated. I find that the only thing that takes her mind off screens are activities that get her out of the house- basketball practice, drama rehearsal, etc. But she is also at an age where anything I suggest is a dumb idea, so there’s that….
Anonymous says
They should hang out. Honestly, mine is super social so she just wants to sit on her (whatever device) and chat, like I did on the phone as a kid. And I get that!
Cb says
We are probably mid-range. Family movie night on Friday, 60-90 minutes on Saturday or Sunday (often just the 1). Maybe 20 minutes of ipad on a weekend AM while we drink our tea and wake up. No video games and I’d like to hang off as long as we can (6, lots of friends are getting Switches for Christmas). I didn’t grow up playing them, and my husband has a phone game habit which annoys me, so I’ll admit some moralising here.
I don’t know if my kid is more creative than other kids with more screentime but there’s a lack of dependence that I appreciate. Screens are willingly dropped/skipped without drama if we’re back late, the neighbour kids knock on the door, there’s something fun happening. He’ll turn it off when bored. His pals seem more fixated on ensuring they get their allocated time? But I think it’s personality versus parenting, his fixated pals don’t handle disappointment/changes of plans as easily. This weekend, T listened to an audiobook in his room for 2 hours, joined his dad grocery shopping, snuggled up with me to read, and then skipped TV time for an hour of fancy bath (candles, music, bubbles).
Anon says
That’s the kind of thing I’m especially interested in – whether your child can drop the screen without drama for something better in-person. That suggests good regulation to me. Some of my friends have reported that dropping the screen at the designated time is a real pain point with allowing screens at all and I was wondering how universal it is.
Anon says
Not an issue at all for my kid, and we have more screen time than Cb’s family (weekday mornings + weekend family movie nights). Anecdotally, it seems to be the kids who are severely limited who want to binge when they get access to it. Much like sweets.
Anon says
I wonder how many “severely limited” kids there are in this country anymore to even judge this anecdotally. The baseline has changed since we were kids, with access to like 10 TV channels, and the risks are greater. I personally think it’s more personality dependent — abstainers vs moderators (per Gretchen Rubin; people who are naturally all-or-nothing, vs people who can moderate consumption of things and not get addicted)
anon says
YES. I just started to write something and deleted it equating screens to sugar.
My sister and BIL were OBSESSIVE about not showing their son any screens at all. Like “could you please point your phone away from my child?” when we are all casually hanging out at someone’s house and phone screen was theoretically within line of sight to their baby/toddler/little kid (he’s now 6). They asked restaurants to turn off TVs (behind bars, too… don’t get me started…).
Today, at just over 6 years old, he legitimately cannot function around screens. We’ve heard he’s having trouble in K because they’re using tablets. They no longer ask restaurants to turn off TVs (thank god) but when we go out to eat he is a zombie staring at a screen and does not eat or engage with anyone.
Screens are a fact of life (like sugar). As with most things, we need to set our kids up to have healthy relationships with these things because they’re not going away and will have to learn to interact with them when we’re not around to stop them from accessing.
Anon says
I’m not sure if the zombie thing is just kids who are severely limited at home. It seems very common – for example, on most flights I take, all the kids on tablets usually don’t respond to their parents saying something until the third or fourth try. Same with kids on phones in restaurants. My guess is that it’s more about the kids’ personalities than their parents’ restrictions.
Anon says
I know several families that are no screens or virtually no screens (like facetime with family and/or schoolwork for elementary age kids only).
Anon says
Some of that is probably just due to them not hearing what was said. That’s common when you have headphones in, for adults too.
Anon says
I think most kids (and sometimes many adults) become zombies around screens. Went to a 6th bday party recently and the facility had a tv on in the room where they served pizza and cake. None of the kids talked to each other during this time. They all just stared at the tv.
Anon says
to the anon at 11:12 this is totally personality/kid dependent. i have twins who have had access to the same amount of screen time. as babies i did ask people to turn the tv off around them. one cannot keep her eyes off of tv in a restaurant and the other often doesn’t notice it is there.
Cb says
I think it helps to limit choices. If they can flick between all the streaming and youtube, it’s easier to browse, versus “do I really want to watch this episode of Ninjago again, or do I want to go do some art?”
I think attractive alternatives help. My son has an art table in my husband’s office and can get in there/access his supplies by himself. It’s not a big production, he can leave projects out. He’s always got a newish audiobook to listen to as well.
Occasionally we get some moaning about no weekday TV (and I suspect he might get a bit more when I’m travelling, but that’s not my job to police) but it is pretty shortlived b/c the moaning doesn’t work. I should just use the library for these but the £7 feels like a good price for less hassle.
Anon says
I think as far as problems turning off the TV, routine helps a lot. I would not describe us as light on screen, but we have set endpoints that we don’t stray from (except when traveling, when all limits go out the window) and we haven’t run into major issues.
Also on the rare occasion there’s been crying or whining about turning off the TV, the response has been “if you can’t step away from the TV when it’s time, then we won’t be able to use TV at all” and that usually puts a stop to it fast.
Anonymous says
We generally allow 15-60 min around 5/5:30 pm. It doesn’t happen every day, but yes, the kids are upset if they don’t get to watch on a given day. We just reiterate it doesn’t happen every day and there will be another opportunity later in the week and don’t stress about them being upset. I don’t notice screen time affects their creativity or ability to play at all; they spent from 7:30 am to 1:30 pm doing nonstop pretend play on Saturday for example (5 and 8).
Anonymous says
I am not sure what ages you’re looking to hear data points from. My child is 4.5, and he is tremendously creative and is constantly engaged in imaginative play. He gets about 30min-one hour of screen time a week (which is generally one episode of Sesame Street and maybe one episode of Daniel Tiger or part of a sporting event on TV). We don’t apply this rule when he’s home sick or when we travel (then it’s sort of unlimited)
I will also say that while DH and I agreed that we didn’t want our kid to have a lot of screen time, we haven’t found it difficult at all to keep screen time limited (the caveat we only have one kid, so that makes it easier). He is at preschool daycare from 8:30-5:15. Before school (he wakes up at 7:15) we have no time for screens… it’s getting up/dressed/breakfast/out the door, and at night it’s eat dinner/bath/books/bed (he is fast asleep by 7:30), so there’s just constant movement to get out the door or into bed. He colors or we read a book while DH makes dinner. On weekends we have activities we do (errands, library, farmers market) and again, the day is just filled with very little opportunity to even have a chance to watch screens. During his rest time on weekends he just wants to build things. I also don’t think we did anything specific to make our kid like this, it’s just his personality that he loves books and drawing and building things, so we don’t even have to have an argument about it.
We’ll see if his imagination and love of imaginative play continues as he gets older, but this is where we are currently.
Anon says
so my kids (5.5 year old twins) watch a brief video in the morning and at night when they brush their teeth and it can be a bit of a struggle to get them to shut it off, but we’re talking like 2-5 minutes. we used to do screentime on fridays, saturdays and sundays, but we’ve been busy lately on weekends and haven’t really had time and it is interesting to see that they rarely ask for it on weekends anymore. i don’t have a huge issue with some tv/movie bc truthfully sometimes i’m tired, but not tired enough to nap and want to veg out and I’d assume my kids feel the same way. i grew up in a house with lots of screentime rules and used to try to sneakily watch tv. i didnt watch like at all in college but in my 20s watched A TON
Spirograph says
I wonder whether my kids will look back on their screen time and think “I could have had more fun if my parents had kept me off of screens.” I think almost everyone limits screen time to some extent, there’s just a wide range of what different people consider acceptable. FWIW, the pediatrician told me at a recent appointment that the recommendation is just to make sure there’s balance. It’s like food. You don’t need to cut out all sugar, you just need to make sure you’re not eating only candy instead of healthier stuff. There can be some of everything.
I only notice a behavior difference in my kids if they have a ton of screen time (like all day on a rainy weekend or something). Or if screens distract from physical needs like food and sleep, my kids are monsters once the screens go off. Also, all screen time is not created equal. I haaaaate my kids watching youtube videos and insipid cartoons, but video games like Minecraft are actually great vehicles for creativity.
CrunchyAnon says
Worth it. First, there’s no harm in trying yourself and seeing if your life improves. In my case, I have 3 kids and we limit screen time to none for youngest (19 months) and a twenty minute show on each weekend day for the older (8 and 5). There are no video games, nor will there ever be. Computer use is exclusive to school. Because screens are not an option, they do not ask for them during the week. We have made it so there is lots of things to do – outside yard is fenced and has fun things to do, so I often shoo the older out there if they are getting on my nerves (less of a thing in the middle of a cold snap). We have had times where they were watching TV more and frankly, I did not like it at all. The middle would exclusively discuss things he’d watched in shows and pretend play based on that. No thanks! I think it’s easier to be strict.
Anon for this says
We don’t limit screen time. DS is 3. He watches a lot of cartoons at home on the IPad (Paw Patrol and the like). He’s bright, social, energetic, kind, creative and imaginative. We haven’t seen any negative effects of unlimited screen time yet, so we let him watch as much as he wants. After a while he will walk away from the IPad and play with his toys, or play with DH or I. It’s hard for us to put limits on screen time since TV was such a big part of our childhoods. Emily Oster looked at the data on screen time and said it’s probably fine. Do what works for your family and don’t feel guilty about it.
Anon says
I’ll chime in late as another family that does not limit screen time per se. I grew up in a family that always had a TV/radio/stereo on in the background. I don’t like a silent home/environment. Music and TV were a big part of my life growing up. So was playing outdoors, imaginative play, and reading. We often have the TV on in the background while our 4.5 year old is playing with her dolls/books/toys. Turning the TV off or giving up the iPad has never been a battle. We do use the iPad as a consequence for not following rules or doing “chores” (if you don’t clean up your toys before bed, you don’t get your iPad the next day for example). But, honestly, I’ve only ever had to actually withhold the iPad one time. She’s just as happy watching Sesame Street on her iPad as she is playing pretend. Screen time is not a hill I’m going to die on when I had unlimited screen time growing up, and I like to think that I turned out fine.
Anon says
We’ll (collectively) never come to an agreement on this, and every family is different, but “unlimited screen time” in the 90s when it was a talk show in the background or the radio on is way different than today when it’s an iPad three inches from your face or Cocomelon. Kids programming now is designed to be addicting in a way it wasn’t before, and kids in general got way more outside time and free play to offset it. I know as an adult I feel the ill effects from being tethered to my phone; I can’t imagine how it will play out with kids in the years to come.
Anon says
The radio?? Lol that was the 1940s. We had color TV in the 1990s.
Anon says
She literally listed the radio in her comment, to which I responded
anonM says
Yes. It’s hard to tie exactly, but my kids are very creative and imaginative. I also am fussy about the quality of what they do watch — pbs kids inventors’ show makes me worry much less than cocomelon or youtube. Everyone has chimed in a lot already, so I’ll just add that IMO, a teen this day and age who has the ability to read and enjoy a whole novel will be at a distinct advantage, so that is the long term goal I try to keep in mind when thinking about devices, screen time, etc.
More Sleep Would Be Nice says
+1 – I think “quality” matters a lot. I have 0 guilt about my almost-3-year old watching Sesame Street ABC songs on a loop.
More Sleep Would Be Nice says
Chiming in and a bit off-topic. I think it’s simpler because my kids don’t have unfettered access to any devices at their ages; when they are older it’ll be a different ballgame.
My kids watch ~30-45 (sometimes more, sometimes less) minutes of something every weeknight while I clean up after dinner. I am usually solo in the evenings. DS #2 literally finishes eating and asks for the TV. While I don’t love this, it is what it is. We are looking to hire someone a few nights a week to take on some of the household management/housekeeping tasks so that I can just focus on the kids. I’m hoping if we do, post-dinner we can go for a walk or do something else.
We typically stay busy on weekends, but there’s definitely screen time mixed in to help. Lately, DS #1 and DH have been watching the Star Wars movies during DS #2’s nap time at least one weekend day. They snuggle up on the couch, watch together, and discuss. It’s more screen time (and fighting) than I’d like, but DS #1 ADORES this time and can understand that fighting, weaponry, etc. is just a piece of the Jedi experience, not the main point.
I also will use the phone at a restaurant for DS #2 if I need to.
It’s not ideal, but honestly after surviving a pandemic I just can’t worry about screen time too much. DS #1 was 2 most of 2020 and he probably sat in front of a tablet for 5-6 hours a day until he went back to preschool in September 2020. We had 0 other option unless one of us quit our jobs.
Anon says
Thanks all – super interesting discussion!
SC says
My 8 year old son gets more screen time than many here (1 hr on weekdays, 2 hours on weekends). He’s able to set his own timer, pause it if he takes a break, and stop when the timer goes off. If he stops a few minutes early or immediately when the timer goes off, he earns 10 extra minutes the next day. If he asks for time for “just one more thing,” we don’t fuss over a couple of minutes to finish up, but he doesn’t get the extra time. If he were to get upset or beg for more time, we’d likely take away time the next day, but he’s pretty good about stopping.
His 1 hour on weekdays is after school, activities, and homework are done, and while DH is prepping dinner and I’m tidying up. He’s tired at this time, and when he’s not had screen time, he does not typically engage in imaginative or creative play, or hang out with us. He might work on a puzzle or take a long bath, but he’s tired at this point in the day. On weekends, he typically uses up his 2 hours of screen time right after breakfast, which allows DH to go back to bed and me to spend a couple hours reading and journaling or exercising. By 10:30, he’s done, we’re up, and he spends the rest of the day with creative play or family time.
It’s hard to say how screens have affected the quality of his play. Even as a toddler, he was not very into pretend play, and his play hit a lot of the markers for autism–focus on repetitive motion, lining things up, etc. (We had him evaluated for autism at 5 or 6 years old, and he was not diagnosed with autism, but he is definitely neurodivergent.) Now, at 8, his pretend play definitely incorporates the video games he plays, but those games seem to have unlocked a path for some type of pretend play. (Before, he would spend hours building but never actually play with what he built.) He also struggles to connect with other kids, and exposure to various characters gives him some common ground and some structure for how to play games based on those characters.
GCA says
I don’t think it’s so much about quantity as about quality – there are many different kinds of screen time and how kids interact/ engage with it. Certainly someone has to be creative enough to come up with new worlds and write new scripts and shoot media from new perspectives. I like this take on screen time: https://courtney.substack.com/p/screen-time-is-dumb and would be interested in reading the book!
Anon says
I have older and younger kids, and we have TV “boundaries” – so no time limits, just times of the day when the TV can be on. For the older kids, we don’t permit small screens during the weekdays — the tweens usually like to decompress between sports/activities and dinner and being on an iPad or a computer doesn’t accomplish that for them. So they can watch a TV show or a recorded basketball game, but I’ve found that playing a game on an iPad gives them all kinds of pent up energy, rather than helping them calm down and rest. TV goes off when it’s time to set the table, and there is no TV after dinner (and the kids don’t usually get home until like 4:45 from their after school stuff), so there’s never an argument. We eat, clean up, get ready for bed, then the big kids will usually get their books and read in the living room until it’s bedtime. They can also turn the TV on in the morning after 7AM, but it turns off at breakfast. My 2 younger kids only have access to their iPads for travel. Weekends we are usually more flexible with boundaries (older kids can use an ipad and we put on the TV if we are home during what is typically nap time for the twins), but we are usually at a game or activity, so it ends up being less time.
As far as creativity, in my experience it’s really kid dependent. 1 of my kids has ADHD, and he’s never played well with toys. But he’s highly, highly creative, and will play imaginary games for hours with his older sister. Playing games on an iPad can really rev him up, so we really, really limit his access to games. My two youngest kids are super creative, and love toys of all kinds, and usually have a mix of matchbox cars, magnatiles, dollhouse stuff, and fake food going. If the TV is on in the background, they’ll just keep playing.
Anon says
Oh! but wanted to throw in there bc I think it helps to have other “things” around when they are a little older so they don’t gravitate to screens….we have tried to swap out little kid clutter toys for bigger kid fun toys to facilitate fun play in the tougher tween years. So, a neighbor’s trampoline has been a huge and years-long source of entertainment for everyone from 5 to the moody tweens, and we found a foosball table through Facebook marketplace that gets tons of use. I am trying to source a secondhand air hockey table (same sort of low skill game that kids can jump into playing easily, unlike, say, ping pong where kids lose interest if they don’t play a lot). We put a magnet dart board up on the wall. We also have multi-player video games, and I’ll be honest, when a bunch of neighborhood kids come over, the multi-player video games end up being the ice-breaker. Then the kids who aren’t playing will get a game of foosball or darts going, and it’s loud and fun and active in our basement. It’s not the most aesthetically pleasing set up (it’s a Ranch house, so not a huge footprint but definitely room), but it’s working for now.
Clementine says
Every time I read these I feel guilty. When I’m solo parenting, I rely on screens to get some peace so I can do super fun things like clean the house or work.
I also will say that the best part of screen time is that it means they’re not making a mess and not fighting so… yes, I know i shouldn’t rely on it like I do (none for baby, screen time very limited on school days but more than I want to admit on days the kids are home all day – like 1-2 hours).
Radical honesty in case anyone else is in the same boat.
Anon says
That doesn’t sound like that much to me actually. I know many people who do quite a bit on school days.
Anon says
Love this and lean into it. I get emotionally exhausted, and let the kids watch when I need rest, which is most evenings and every single morning. I am a MUCH better parent when I can drink a cup of coffee and sit before parenting or before I serve dinner. My kids are all thriving and exceling at their various *things* and I don’t yell as much when we can all sit for a hot minute and relax. It’s a total win.
More Sleep Would Be Nice says
Oh, I’m right there with you – maybe my post wasn’t clear. Like you (and for different reasons), I solo parent a lot and use it as a tool.
Lise says
We don’t limit by number of minutes per day, necessarily, but we limit it to certain times of day. Generally, my kid gets to watch a show right before dinner and on weekend mornings. If it doesn’t happen on a particular day, maybe because we go out for dinner or get out of the house early on a weekend, we don’t make up for it at another time of day, just kind of go back to the normal routine the next day. Occasionally we’ll do a family movie night and that can be extra, or if he’s sick and we’re stuck at home more than normal. My child loves certain shows and definitely asks to watch at other times sometimes, but can accept a no without too much drama. I do think his free play is really creative, but I don’t have a huge frame of reference since I just have the one!
Anonon says
My kid got zero screen time til age 4. Now at 4.5 they get a movie once a month. And if we travel on an airplane they get an iPad. Besides that they do not have tv, ipad or computer. They do have a yoto to listen to stories during quiet time.
I 100% think its worth it. My kid can independently play for hours and doesn’t need my ideas. I rarely hear I am bored. They can take long car rides and sit through dinners in public. I plan on doing the same thing with my younger kid.
We will probably slowly introduce computer programming things on the ipad done with an adult but the goal is to keep screen time really low.
Anon says
Eh, a lot of what you wrote (independent play for hours, doing fine on long drives and in restaurants) also described my kid at 4, and she had ample screen time beginning around age 2.
I think what you described is mostly personality, not screen time or lack thereof. Not that tons of screen time doesn’t negatively impact kids, but in moderation it’s not going to do any harm and the absence of screen time doesn’t create the ability to play alone. I have many friends with kids who watch less TV and their kids have much less ability to play alone than my kid. I don’t take any credit for it – I think it’s just luck/genetics.
Paging "Campcation" from Friday says
I had a long weekend for Veteran’s Day and am getting caught up on old posts. For the poster looking for cool camp ideas, check out The Henry Ford day camps, outside of Detroit. It is a unique camp experience taking place in the Museum or Greenfield Village, depending on the age. Starts at rising 2nd grade, though, which may or may not work. https://inhub.thehenryford.org/summer-camps
Also highly recommend the camps put on by Cranbrook: https://schools.cranbrook.edu/camps–cranbrook/day-camps/day-camps-at-a-glance
You could check out things in Detroit like the Institute of Art, Historical Museum, Riverwalk/Belle Isle… I have more ideas if this seems like something you are interested in!
Anon says
Thank you! She’ll be a rising first grader next summer but if this goes well it will likely become an annual thing so I’m open to ideas for older kids as well.
Waffles says
I don’t really enjoy shopping for clothing and shoes because I’m really picky, so it’s difficult. Shopping for jewelry and handbags, however, is a different story. It tends to work out in the end, because I’ll get the best basic clothing and shoes that I can find, then add personality with jewelry and bags.
Right now, sculptural jewelry pieces, pearls, and ear cuffs are on trend, and when they are gold-plated rather than solid gold, they can be affordable enough to allow for some experimentation. For some interesting pieces, the brands Completedworks, Monica Vinader, and Alighieri come to mind.
I think any bag that is practical and makes you feel happy while carrying it goes a long way to boost style as well. Hope you enjoy the process — looking forward to Black Friday!
Waffles says
Thread fail — will try to repost above.
Anon says
i have my 3rd cold/virus in 3.5 weeks. only one of these times were my kids sick. i don’t understand where i keep catching all of these viruses
Anon says
Kids can get things and be basically asymptomatic and still pass it on.
Anon says
Try masking in public and see if it makes a difference?
Anonymous says
This. I still mask in crowded or low airflow situations and I get sick so much less often than I did in the Before Times.
OP says
i do! i’m one of the few people still in a mask in the grocery store, target etc. i work a hybrid job and mask when in-person. it is so frustrating to constantly be getting sick.
Anonymous says
Oh, that’s frustrating. The kids could very well be the source, as noted above. Getting sufficient sleep is key.
More Sleep Would Be Nice says
Hi! We are test-driving a housekeeper/house-manager after Thanksgiving. She nannies for another family in our neighborhood full-time M-Th and half-days on Friday. I’ll take any tips/suggestions.
She’ll come over ~15 hours a week, likely 5:15-8ish M T Th, and then 12:30-5 on F. So far these are the tasks I’d like help with:
Weeknights:
– Warm-up/plate dinner – ideally this will be done while I’m picking up the kids
– Clean-up after dinner (load dishwasher, wipe surfaces, sweep floor, put things away)
– Chop veggies/prep for next day’s meal – this wouldn’t be everyday
– Feed dog, potentially walk dog (or free me up to do so)
– Take out trash/recycling as needed, help with packages
Fridays (where she’ll have a bigger chunk of time):
– Laundry – wash/dry/put away
– Keep kid’s rooms organized (e.g. switch over clothes, help purge/organize toys)
– Water plants
– Misc. household tasks (e.g. change batteries, light bulbs – whatever comes up that week)
– Errands (e.g. Walgreen’s pick-up, drop off returns/donations – may expand this to grocery pick-up or putting away delivery order)
She’s made clear she isn’t interested in any deep cleaning, which is reasonable since we have a service that comes every few weeks. She’ll also help with the kids and can do the caretaking items as needed, but that won’t be here primary role.
What am I forgetting? What should I also consider?
Anon says
I would want help decluttering the fridge and pantry every week. Those are two places that get really crazy very quickly for me.
CCLA says
We have a nanny/house manager/family assistant who does all those things plus after school childcare (but is full time, so maybe 20 hrs most weeks for household stuff). There are days she is slammed and days that are light. My first thought is that will be a lot to get through on Mon-Thur on the days meal prep or errands are included, unless all or most laundry is saved for Friday. Laundry just takes so much time. By far the bigger value add for laundry for us is the folding and putting away – I still throw a load in once in a while and just set aside until she folds the next day (things like towels and kids clothes where it doesn’t matter if it sits for a day). But if there’s time on Fridays, I’d add changing over bedding to your list. Ours also packs lunch for our kids, ymmv if they don’t bring lunch from home but that’s another daily grind thing that’s nice to have off our plates.
Enjoy! Getting that kind of help was life changing for us.
More Sleep Would Be Nice says
Yes ma’am – all laundry on Friday. Right now DH does it while WFH. Good call on being clear re bedding changes – that’s part of our laundry routine (DH washes and changes sheets weekly).
lulu says
I have this type of help as well – life changing. She comes 2x a week for about 4-5 hrs each day. She does laundry, puts it away, organizes kids rooms, tidies up playroom, organizes and purges toys. She also cleans out my fridge, goes through pantry cabinets and organizes, as well as miscellaneous closets and cabinets. During the holidays and for birthday parties, I have her wrap all my gifts. She has offered to do meal prep as well but I haven’t gotten my act together on that yet.
Spirograph says
If you don’t mind sharing, how much do you all pay for this type of help, either at an hourly rate or weekly? Is it like a nanny where you need to pay a premium to get someone part-time to offset the opportunity cost of keeping your housekeeper/manager from full time employment?
We currently have a housecleaner every two weeks, which is great for the day or two afterward, but then we still need to vacuum and touch up the bathrooms; and keeping clutter at bay, fridge stocked, and all-the-stuff organized is a never-ending battle. I don’t mind washing and folding laundry because I do it while watching TV or talking on the phone a couple times a week, but putting it away becomes a bottleneck.
More Sleep Would Be Nice says
I’m in a MCOL-HCOL city.
She’s asking for $27/hour, which she was fully transparent was higher than her nanny rate ($25/hour). I was surprised, but a local friend signaled this is the norm and worth it since, like a good nanny, they are part of your household.
Lulu says
This is in line with what we pay in hcol suburb.
Lulu says
This consistent with what I pay in hcol suburb.
CCLA says
We pay $35 an hour, on the books with benefits. This is definitely higher than most of our friends with purely Nannie’s pay. VHCOL area and the agency we went through was up front that adding the house manager component would kick up the rate (vs if we were hiring a childcare only nanny). We are full time though.