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Sales of note for 8.30.24
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- Ann Taylor – 30% off full-price purchase; $99 jackets, dresses & shoes; extra 50% off sale
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- Zappos – 28,000+ women’s sale items! (check out these reader-favorite workwear brands on sale, and some of our favorite kids’ shoe brands on sale)
Kid/Family Sales
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Anon says
For those of you who’ve taken your kids skiing- where have you taken them and what is the ski school experience like?
The reason I ask is we are currently in Park City and the ski school is much more ski intensive than the ones i went to as a kid. When I was a kid learning to ski we ate lunch, took breaks etc in a preschool like classroom, etc. whereas here they ate lunch in a cafeteria like setting , took the shortest break possible and went back out well the other kids did- we got a call to pick our kids up, which i was kind of annoyed about as ski school isn’t cheap and i feel like they should find a way to entertain the kids rather than give me a call. Before we ever attempt another ski trip I’d like to know a bit more about other ski schools
Anon says
Interesting. I learned in the Catskills (so, small east coast mountains) but our “ski school” was a couple hours in the morning and then we met back up with our parents. There was no lunch or going inside. I’ve been looking at other small mountains in New England and it seems similar – the lessons are for a finite period of time, and then you ski with your family. That sounds good to me, though, because I can’t imagine my kids having the attention or endurance to be on their own all day. Maybe ages of kids matters. I learned well enough in a morning to do the greens in the afternoon; I think we also did a lesson the next morning and I tried a blue that afternoon
Anon says
I haven’t taken my kids skiing yet, but as a kid in New England it sounds pretty similar to what you described in Park City. Ski school was 9-3 and we spent most of that time actually skiing (on really cold days we’d take morning/afternoon breaks in lodge for hot cocoa/snacks). We’d come back to the ski school base for lunch, but that was basically set up like an elementary school cafeteria with long tables and kids either brought lunch from home or got hot lunch, but there weren’t any toys or anything. I can definitely see how there wasn’t a backup plan if a kid didn’t want to ski in the afternoon, because the adult for each group would need to take all the other kids out.
Anon says
In my experience, it depends on the age of the kids, but also, just to add another perspective — I’d frankly be annoyed at my kids spending time in an indoor preschool environment if I am paying $$$ to send them to ski school — bc I am sending them to actually to learn to ski. We are avid skiers who live in the south, and we travel several times a year to ski on the east coast and usually once a year out west (including Park City). Two of the places we’ve skied in the last few years have offered a daycare option and a ski school option. It sounds like you are looking for the daycare option? The daycare was mostly indoor and more like a preschool with a little classroom and toys and snacks + lunch and naptime, but offered a ski lesson during the day at some point. One of the resorts let the kids do a half day lesson, then come inside and do the daycare option for the afternoon (this resort let kids go to the indoor camp up to age 8, but kids age out of the daycare option at our east coast spot at age 5). The full day ski school or ski camp usually starts between ages 4 and 6 (depending on the resort in my experience), and I do send them to these full day camps expecting them to ski all day, usually with a hot chocolate break mid-morning, lunch, then maybe one more break in the afternoon, depending on time of pick up.
Anon says
I agree with this. It’s okay for a ski school to focus on skiing, and it’s up to the parents to entertain kids without the stamina to ski the whole time.
Anon says
And if your kids need a break, but you still want to ski, when we were in Park City a few years ago, one of the families we traveled with sent their 2 and 4 year olds to the child care center with rave reviews. Their kiddos weren’t even used to a daycare setting (they had a part time SAHD and grandparent care), and the kids LOVED the program and asked to go back the rest of the week. It’s worth an ask if one of the daycare workers would do a midday pick up — one resort we skied at offered this option, but you had to specifically request it and schedule it ahead of time. It worked great for our then 3 year old.
Anon says
+1 I don’t ski myself but I’m a travel advisor who books ski vacations for others. I would also be annoyed at paying ski school prices for a daycare/kids club. Kids club is normally way cheaper than ski school and if you’re paying for ski school they should be actually leaning how to ski, not doing arts and crafts.
Anon says
+1. It would be a nice perk if resorts offered a transition to daycare option for kids who didn’t want to ski anymore, but I would expect that to be a separate program or cost extra. If I’m paying for Ski school, I want them on skis.
FVNC says
Not to pile on but…my kids complained last year that they didn’t spend ENOUGH time skiing. I haven’t been super impressed with the various Vail / Epic ski schools we’ve experienced, so I’m actually happy to hear this about Park City (considering for 2025). This year we won’t have a big ski trip, and when we went to a smaller mountain over winter break, I just skied with them. Kids are 6 and 10 and have been skiing for a couple years, so not total beginners, for context.
OP says
I’m not looking for the daycare option, i want my kids to learn to ski- but just like when i send me kids to day camp, i expect them to keep my kids for the duration of the time i paid for. It’s less about me needing to ski, bc I’m not a huge skier, but I was a very reluctant skiier as a kid and needed positive encouragement to keep going. Letting a kid quit is not the message i want to send, so I’d rather the teachers go at their pace – or switch them to a group that does than calling me.
Anonymous says
Eh it’s ski school not college. They’re not going spend an hour coaxing your kids into it. Sign them up for half days next time.
Anon says
OP, I get that – but I think you need to talk to the program in advance and set the expectation. If they can’t meet it, then you’ll know the drill and can plan for it.
FVNC says
OP, I sympathize – lessons are expensive! – but if you want this level of customization you need to do private or semi-private lessons. Asking instructors, many of whom are young college kids with little training these days, to provide this level of customization in a group lesson setting is not realistic.
NYCer says
I agree with this. OP – maybe try a half day private lesson next time.
Anon says
If they are in a group lesson, it’s a safety issue if one child can’t or won’t keep up with the group, and I agree with them calling you to pick up a child who can’t keep with the group. When we were at Park City, I observed an instructor having to hang way back with one child to motivate them to keep going, while the rest of the group was sitting on the mountain ahead. I actually ended up hanging out with the group of kids bc they were young — maybe 5? — and I recall thinking it was dangerous for several small kids to be hanging out on the side of the mountain solo while skiers went whizzing by. If you want this type of individual instruction, you can hire an instructor to take your kids out solo, which can be a GREAT option. We did that one year when ski school booked up, and that worked great — the instructor let my 5 nap in the gondola.
OP says
I get that, but they do have extra instructors on hand and then they should rejigger the groups at lunchtime or whenever. I took a lesson yesterday and there was someone in my group who was way behind everyone else and she switched groups after an hour in. They also took the liberal first timer kids on the chairlift within the first hour rather than starting with the magic carpet which surprised me
Anonymous says
I mean you can make up whatever you think they should do but we are all telling you your expectations are out of line with reality.
FVNC says
OP, everything you’re describing is an indication of a really good ski school! Groups cannot be “rejiggered”; maybe there are extra instructors in case another instructor is injured or sick. They are not going to pull in an “extra” instructor to create a private lesson when you’ve paid for a group; they’re just not. Also…magic carpets are relatively new (by relatively, I mean in the last 20-30 years); I learned to ski by…going up a ski lift because magic carpets didn’t exist when I was learning. Kids learn SO much more on an actual hill than bunny hill/learning slope. Listen, I push through the hassle and expense because I LOVE skiing and I want me kids to be able to join me. My husband doesn’t ski. It sounds like maybe this isn’t something y’all are that into, as a family, and that’s fine!
Anon says
OP – I’m really sorry you are frustrated with how it worked out, but I agree with everything FVNC said. This is the sign of a good school that is keeping the safety of your kids in mind — and honestly, if your kiddos are flat out refusing to go, keeping them in lessons probably isn’t serving the longer term goal either. Maybe a smaller mountain would be a better way for your kids to learn to love skiing?
Boston Legal Eagle says
I agree on smaller mountains. We’ve got two within an hour of us here, and they do 5 or so week lessons on the weekends for kids starting age 4. The age of the kid and temperament of the kid matters, and the shorter lessons are probably ideal for the age 4-5 crew (which I think your kids are?) An all day ski school is just a lot for that age.
Anonymous says
Disagree with those saying it’s ordinary to start on the lifts. Standard start for kids under 8 is magic carpet. Unless taking Gondola to another part of mountain to access magic carpet or t-bar in that area.
Anon says
Honestly sounds like a great ski school. My 4 year old had full ski school days at Snowmass and I was very pleased with how much ski time she had! They do have an option where 3 year olds can still nap. My 7 and 8 year olds were coming off the mountain completely beat and got in a crazy amount of skiing too. Which for me was the goal.
Anon says
Honestly, there’s NOTHING better than an entire day on skis where you end up so tired you’re practically falling asleep over your French fries that night. That’s living a full life right there.
anon says
May be late, we did Sugarbush in VT. My kid was 5, had been on skis before but very limited. It was like 9-3 and they were outside i would say all of the time except for snack and lunch. I skied down near them to spy hahah. They had a little magic carpet for the kids to ride up the tiniest incline and ski down. She LOVED it and wanted to go back the next day but alas I had not reserved two days and it was full. It was very expensive. It seemed really well run and organized.
Anonymous says
I would be very angry if I paid ski school prices for them to spend any time in a day care environment, and I would also be displeased if I found out that the whole group had been waiting around most of the day for a kid who refused to follow instructions and participate. If your kids did not like ski school and you really want them to ski, I would hire a private instructor.
Anonymous says
If you don’t really like skiing and your kids don’t seem to enjoy it either, why pay Park City prices to try to convince them? I love skiing and so does my daughter, but I sure wouldn’t pay to do it if neither one of us enjoyed it.
Anonymous says
I think it depends on the mountain, the skill level, and the number of kids in the group. We just got back from Sunshine Village in the Canadian Rockies and the ski school for my green & blue-runners was like you described. 10:30-3:30 with an hour for cafeteria-style lunch. They were on the slopes the rest of the time.
We did ski school at Snowshoe in WV and it was more like what you were expecting. For the little kids it was explicitly advertised as daycare + try out ski/snowboard and it was mostly preschool with an hour out on the tiny slope. For the slightly older first timers/limited experience classes they went out on the bunny hill but if the kids were cold and/or not into it, they could go back to the classroom area for hot chocolate, toys and coloring sheets (my daughter definitely did that).
We’ve also taken the kids to Jay Peak in VT and it was kinda in between but closer to Snowshoe. Snowshoe and Jay Peak are both very family-friendly resorts with lots of kid activities outside of skiing/snowboarding, whereas Sunshine Village was more slope-centric. I haven’t been to Park City, it based on what I know, I’m not surprised it’s more like Sunshine.
More Sleep Would Be Nice says
Ok – I need some help and ideally need to nip this in the bud.
DS #2 is 3. He’s had pretty good sleep habits overall…until the past few days. Over the holidays we hosted, and someone else slept in DS’s room, we did a quick overnight trip where DS ended up sleeping on me all night, and then my kids stayed at my parents, where this kid slept in the same room/bed as my Mom.
Two nights ago, DS was sobbing in his bed but ultimately went to sleep. Last night he kept popping out of bed, sobbing, asking for me, and it devolved into DH and I alternatively yelling – GO TO BED/STAY IN YOUR BED RIGHT NOW (not good, I know), which of course did not work, and then concluded in me staying in the room until he was asleep, which was great until he popped up sobbing at 11 PM because no one was there and then slept in our bed. (I don’t think this an issue of him napping at school and not being sleepy – he’s clearly tired and willing to sleep on me, be patted, etc.)
I solo parent a lot due to DH’s work travel and can’t afford co-sleeping being a long-term solution – what do I do? I had a “chat” with kid this AM reiterating that we stay in bed after bedtime, etc.
My thought is to just wait outside kid’s room tonight and CALMLY take him back to bed every time he gets out, and continue this for however long until he realizes he can’t keep getting out of bed. Fortunately he’s not keen on opening the door (yet)…
Anon says
Your thought is what has gotten us through this type of a rough patch in the past. Calmly and quickly redirect them back to bed. Minimal talking/interacting. Perfunctory is probably my best word for it. I do leave the room even if they are crying. I’ll wait 5-10 minutes before going back in if they haven’t stopped crying, but my interactions are still very to the point. This is probably just due to his routine changing. Our bedtime/sleep troubles also tend to coincide with a mental/physical growth spurt.
OP says
Good point. They also started potty training him at school yesterday (which really feels like they are up for cleaning up a lot of accidents…)
I planned to start over one of the upcoming long holiday weekends, so I’m all for the help at school – that mixed in with the return-from-holidays could also be part of it.
Anonymous says
Yeah I think calmly taking back to bed every time is best with a minimum of snuggles and fuss
Leatty says
My 3 year old is going through a similar phase. He sleeps in his sister’s bed (despite having his own room), but still wants mom during the night. After way too many sleepless nights with a barnacle child in my bed, I told him he is no longer allowed in my bed, but he is welcome to sleep on the floor beside my bed. We leave out a pillow and blanket for him, and he does this almost every night. I had hoped that the discomfort would convince him to stay in bed, but that hasn’t happened yet. Even so, this has been a good medium ground.
Anony says
This will sound ridiculous, but the Bluey Sleepytime book is magic when my 3-year old has weird sleep phases. Like we try all these things and then we read that stupid book at bedtime and he sleeps.
Anon says
If you ever had stomach upset while pregnant, possibly related to something you ate, would you definitely mention it to your provider if it seemed to go away within a few hours? I don’t want to panic over every little upset stomach, but of course I’ve also been warned about the risks of listeria…
Anon says
No. I only relayed things that were recurring, persistent, or severe.
anon says
My stomach was upset the entire 9 months I was pregnant.
Anonymous says
Same. At one point the OB said “the only thing that will cure it is delivery, but that will cure it instantly.” She was right.
Anon says
No, GI issues of every kind are common, and I had diarrhea a lot in early-mid first trimester
Anon says
OK, thanks everyone. I feel a bit better!
Anon says
Ugh we’re on vacation and my husband has Covid. I think this is the fifth consecutive family vacation where at least one person has fallen sick. I don’t feel like we’re sick that much, it just seems to always hit vacations.
Anonymous says
Did he get a booster? There is a simple solution to this not happening again
Anon says
Uhh the boosters don’t prevent infection, just severe illness. He did get all the vaccines, including the most recent one available (although it was a while ago now that he got it, I think early September?) and he’s thankfully not seriously ill but he’s still running a fever and feeling bad.
Anonymous says
lol wut? The boosters don’t stop you from getting Covid. Did you time travel from 2021?
Anonymous says
Lolololol you high? I had Covid in June got a booster in November and currently have Covid again
Anon says
Yeah I (OP) had it for the first time in July and got the booster in December but I fully expect to get it again now :( I don’t think it’s avoidable because there’s no way to isolate him here.
Anon says
I know like 25 people who have Covid right now and they all got the most recent shot.
Anon says
+1. I know like six people who got COVID again within DAYS of getting the booster.
Anon says
I think almost any vaccination kind of distracts the immune system for a minute before the protection kicks in (these I think take 1-2 weeks to really start protecting). Nobody warned me to take extra precautions in those first several days though!
Anon says
Lol. I have a friend who has had COVID twice already since their last booster. If only there were such a simple solution.
Anonymous says
I had a booster in November (and all the previous ones and the first vaccine as soon as eligible) and am home with Covid currently sooooo…..
Anonymous says
Nope. I am fully vaccinated and boosted and I still caught a horrible case … on vacation.
FVNC says
Commiseration. We were joking over our winter break trip that it’s only a matter of when, not if, a trip to urgent care will be required. Hope your husband feels better soon and the rest of you stay healthy.
anon says
Ugh, that truly stinks. Nothing worse than a vacation ruined by illness.
Anonymous says
I am pretty sure that travel guarantees illness of some kind.
Kids and ADHD Testing says
This may be a pretty gauche question, but as a parent with potential ADHD concerns, if you go through the rigamarole of private testing…do kids ever not qualify? Or is it the type of things where the boundaries are so broad and nebulous, that if you push enough your kid will get diagnosed with something? (ADHD or otherwise).
Perhaps it’s a skewed sample since there’s *a reason* you are pursuing testing, but I know there’s also a lot of overlap with immaturity and because of growing awareness people are looking into mental health concerns earlier and earlier. So, mostly curious if anyone has gone through testing and told their kid is just fine.
Anon says
I’ve never heard of anyone going though testing and not being diagnosed, which is part of why I’m skeptical of the testing process (although there are undoubtedly kids who benefit from medication, therapies and other accommodations).
Anon says
+1. Same. I think there are probably lots of kids who could benefit from therapies because it’s focused attention, but I don’t think they all have disorders. But it seems they’re all getting diagnosed with them younger and younger.
Anon says
I honestly think IEP for every child would make a lot of sense and do a lot of good.
Anon says
I have. My bff had her kid tested and kid didn’t qualify
Anon says
This is a broader answer to your specific question, but after going through some developmental stuff/screening (not ADHD – more like “late bloomer” vibes where I’ve realized they just hit milestones 3-6 months later in some places) for one of my kids AND being a big believer in neurodivergence being identified/medication/therapy AND wondering often if I have ADHD…I do feel like we err on the side of over diagnosing kids these days without just giving TIME.
I know on-balance this isn’t a bad thing – but I do think it puts a lot of pressure on families and kids.
Anonymous says
This feels like a weirdly judgy question! But yes of course. Not all kids tested for ADHD have it.
Anon says
I do you actually know people who’ve been through testing and told they don’t have it? Because I don’t.
Anonymous says
Yes I do. But thanks for confirming you just want to be judgy.
Anon says
Do you know this for a fact? I admit it is kind of judgey, but in my limited experience of family and friends every kid tested is diagnosed, and based on the online criteria I bet my kids would be too, although teachers assure they are “normal” and we are seeing lots of improvement with time. It’s a lot of money and effort to go through if it’s not “accurate” and more of a “pay for play” kind of experience. I am phrasing this very badly and I apologize, but I am interested in people’s lived experiences
Anonymous says
Yes I know multiple people personally whose kids have been tested and have not been diagnosed with any condition.
Anon says
I thought it sounded like she was concerned about whether it was worthwhile to have her kid tested privately rather than being judgey. Like if you’re not sure if they have it, are they going to hand out a diagnosis simply because you’re paying them $$$$ or is it a true evaluation?
FVNC says
This is how I read the question, too.
anon says
For whatever it’s worth, my niece did not get diagnosed. Is it possible that as a girl, her symptoms are more easily overlooked? Yes. But as a mom of a kid with ADHD (seriously, off the charts) who is pretty attuned to the signals, I had my doubts when my sister got niece tested.
But this is weirdly judgmental question. If parents are going through the whole battery of tests and evaluations, not just the baseline one at the pediatrician’s office, assume that the kid is having a hard time with something.
Anne-on says
Thank you, this. I truly don’t understand all the handwringing and judging about labels and more kids being diagnosed. Why is it a bad thing if more families have access to therapies and neurodiverse inclusive education strategies? Most educators will agree that neurodivergent friendly teaching strategies are better for ALL kids – things like clear syllabuses, notes being available online/note taking apps so kids can focus on discussion/questions, visual timers, the ability to use fidgets/stim, the ability to use headphones if necessary, doing away timed tests as they only increase anxiety etc. More on that here: https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/20/opinion/culture/timed-tests-biased-kids.html?unlocked_article_code=1.LE0.s7dR.wJ3plVa9w0uA&smid=url-share
As my kid gets older most of the things we focus on are the same things that adults/college students focus on – study skills, time management, identifying your most productive times of day, ways to help with energy dips, if timers/pomodoro are better or if you benefit from focused deep concentration time. If your issue is with medication that’s entirely separate and trust me they are NOT handing out meds like candy as the media would love you to believe. It requires a monthly psych visit to get medication and refills are HIGHLY controlled.
Maybe focus on your own biases because I sure hope you’re not passing this judgement onto your kid or family – trust me, neurodivergent people get enough judgement already.
Anon says
In my view, pathologizing normal variations in behavior and over-diagnosing leads to psychological “injury,” for lack of a better word. It’s not a neutral act. Kids are so often encouraged to think of themselves as their “disorder” – their parents so often make every plan and every decision through that lens.
Anon says
Agreed.
Anon says
The book “Normal Sucks” may be of interest to this conversation. Basically the school system is designed around the myth of the average so there’s no way to win.
Anne-on says
That is pretty far off from current therapeutic practice in my current lived experience. Is it true of ‘autism moms’ and parents who live out their kids diagnosis online for views/sympathy? Sure, but I have not met a single person like that IRL nor could I imagine our therapist/neuropsych encouraging that.
Anon says
I agree that the “autism moms” are outside the norm, but what I’m referring to is more of the everyday lens that is so common – the phrases like “we’re not doing Disney because DS is autistic and can’t handle lines” or “that party won’t work for us because it’s sensory overload for DD.” Heck, on the main page the other day, someone posted about how her family didn’t think her sibling could go to college at all because she has ADHD! There are so many limits, so many assumptions,
Anon says
Agree with 12:05. I don’t think it’s normal for a mom to make their child’s diagnosis *their* identity, but I see a lot of people framing their child’s lives through what ADHD or ASD allows.
anon says
Seriously, the reports that these meds are so easy to get make me insane. No. Even needing to get a refill ahead of time (like for a family vacation) is a whole messy thing that takes time and effort, and people signing off on the temporary change. They’re controlled substances. They also are what allows my kid to function at home and school, and actually reach his academic potential.
I can’t with these discussions anymore.
Anonymous says
And then the shortages too. Getting my meds the last year has been such a hassle and always in ways that are extra hard if you’re adhd and unmedicated. “Oh, just check in every couple of days or we’ll forget your prescription exists if we ever do get any in stock”
FVNC says
We haven’t had a child go through ADHD testing (so not sure if this is helpful), but did go through a LOT of ASD and ASD-related testing with one child and had wildly different experiences depending on the provider doing the testing. The first developmental ped we saw was, I’m convinced, a quack; after a 45 min office visit she diagnosed our child with ASD, relying on tests previously administered by grad students for a research study specifically *not* for diagnostic purposes. So in the case of that practice, I suspect anyone who walked in got some sort of diagnosis. Soon afterward we were able to have our child do a full, two-day round of testing at an academic hospital’s ASD center. Our child was not diagnosed with ASD, but she was given an ASD-related diagnosis in part to help with insurance covering her speech therapy. I do not think the center would have given us the diagnosis without it being warranted and without us understanding exactly why it was being given.
Anon says
I’ve posted this before, but this not-great-eval experience is how I felt about the EI eval we had that flagged my then-19-month-old for a “cognitive delay” – we did the therapy offered for a few months and then asked to stop when we weren’t really seeing 1) any challenges for kiddo in this real; and 2) that therapy was providing anything they weren’t getting at daycare.
Kid just needed…time. Also some of the questions they asked seemed like they’d have a WIDE range at that age – e.g. “Can your child recognize a character on TV, like Cocomelon?” Um…no? But by 2 we were firmly in the Elmo camp.
Kid is 3 now, has a mild speech delay (I had to push EI for ST when kid turned 2), and after a year of mostly virtual (?) EI ST, we are in private ST. This is 100% my own crap, but I just hate that we had to go through the EI rigmarole when it was not a fit for our needs, and potentially took a slot for someone who needed it more.
Anon says
I’m not sure I know the answer for private testing (I think the answer is probably “yes” if by “push enough” we mean lots of second opinions and doctor shopping, but I doubt it if it just means “expressing concerns to provider”). The phenomenon Freakonomics likes to go on about where the youngest age cohort in every class is overdiagnosed with ADHD is driven more by schools and testing via school. I think as we get older the tests become more objective though (since developmental stages aren’t as much of a factor). I know when I was tested in my 20s, the tests were simple, timed tasks, and my results were extremely outlier (I wasn’t a little slower and less accurate, I was many times slower and less accurate than the average). For a kid with the same extreme results, I can imagine wondering if they were just not paying attention!
It’s tricky because I think overdiagnosis and underdiagnosis both happen. ADHD runs very strongly in my family and even more strongly in my BIL’s family, but since the pandemic, concerns for my youngest nephew have been downplayed because they’re saying it’s just the effects of the pandemic. I feel like the odds are pretty low that this kid doesn’t have ADHD given the pattern with his older siblings, parents, aunts, etc., but I guess they want to give it more time to make sure it’s not just a delayed effect of lockdown!
What I always wonder is how they distinguish sleep disorders from ADHD when sleep disorders are known to cause the same results on testing, when children are rarely evaluated by sleep neurologists, and when people who really do have ADHD are prone to sleep disorders? It all seems like a bit of a mess to me currently.
anonamommy says
We’ve done testing to try to better understand the educational supports that our kid needs. There wasn’t an explicit ADHD diagnosis, but some noted challenges in executive functioning and processing speed, so if we wanted to really push for one (we don’t), we probably could have gotten there. But we were able to identify some strategies to bolster classroom focus and loop the teacher into the overall path forward, which was a huge benefit.
Anecdotally I’m aware of some friends who were able to get an ADHD diagnosis from their ped based on parental symptom description and teacher surveys alone (not a full neuropsych assessment), which seems like a very low bar to medicate a child.
Boston Legal Eagle says
Your first paragraph is our reasoning too. OP, I get what you’re saying, but it’s hard to know what to do as parent of a kid who has trouble regulating his emotions, doesn’t listen and easily loses control of his body, some of which appears in the classroom too. And who is clearly having a hard time. We’re trying to get more information about how his brain works and tools to help his unique experience in life. Whether there’s a formal diagnosis doesn’t matter as much, but having some record of an expert identifying strengths and weaknesses, and what could help outside of the traditional classroom experience can only benefit everyone.
Really, truly, what is the harm in getting a kid who needs help some therapy and possibly (non-addictive, short acting) meds? My own therapist said that she wished all kids could get formal evaluations just to see how their brains work. It should just be standard medical protocol, but $$$ gets in the way. The world isn’t one size fits all.
Anon says
Thanks. This all makes a lot of sense and if there’s some issue, it’s valuable to find support. Maybe that’s the crux of my question – I don’t necessarily want or need a broad diagnosis/label, but an individualized assessment with targeted recommendations would be helpful. (And being totally new to this, I don’t know what the process entails or yields!)
However, to your second question, the harm is you don’t save for retirement, go into credit card debt, etc in order to figure this out and pay for therapy. It’s very difficult for most families to come up with $5K + more for ongoing support, as you allude to. So it’s hard decision on whether to pursue if your kid is “borderline”
anonM says
How old is your kiddo? For us, kindergarten was the tipping point. There was simply no way to not take action if we wanted our kid to be successful. He was disrupting his homeroom and every special class and was clearly struggling. Diagnosis was easier than I anticipated (the pediatrician diagnosed at one appointment, using parent/teacher evaluations — I just made sure we saw a ped who makes adhd diagnosis and who used the Vanderbilt scales for evaluations). But, I do not think he is borderline. You also can consider a 504 plan- you don’t need a diagnosis for that and there is no cost. You can get a request in place for the 504 plan while you figure out whether/how to pursue a diagnosis. (We got the diagnosis while we were waiting on the school to set up the 504 meeting/plan).
Anon says
For us, a diagnosis was key for getting the school to agree to a 504 plan instead of just pushing back with “your kid just needs to learn to follow rules”.
Boston Legal Eagle says
I completely get that money is a big hindrance and I wish this were covered by the medical system, just like yearly well visits. And I am grateful to be in a position to spend this kind of money (and time). The alternative is just “waiting and seeing,” and having my kid possibly labeled as the bad kid or struggling and losing his self esteem so it’s worth it to me to get help now.
But yeah, I’ve actually thought about going back to school in my “retirement” life and becoming a social worker helping low income families with this. Because our system sucks.
Anonymous says
Are you actually too poor for this or is it hypothetical?
anonM says
anon at 11:33 and BLE, I feel you! DH really wanted to “avoid labels” but then our son was clearlyyyy getting labeled as a bad kid who didn’t listen/was mean. Not the case. DH also has done a lot of work on his approach, as some of that was defensive due to his ADHD. It is heartbreaking when your kiddo starts internalizing and thinking they’re bad/stupid/etc etc. The diagnosis and 504 plan approach also drastically changed his teacher’s attitude. Having resources and social work friends was such a help to us — I feel so bad for kids who don’t have the support they need and deserve for whatever combination of reasons.
anon says
My kids were diagnosed with ADHD based on parent reports, teacher reports (essentially saying that yes some of their behavior is related to age but the frequency with which it happens is extremely outside the norm/what they observe for all other kids the same age), AND neuropsych testing which found that they have substantial deficiences in attention and executive function that don’t at all match their intellectual capabilities. They key is that to have a “real” diagnosis you need to demonstrate the qualifications across multiple settings.
That being said, I also know at least 3 families who did private neuropsych evals for their kids and were told they don’t have ADHD, so it does happen.
Anonymous says
Where I am, it is very difficult to get tested unless you pay cash upfront and then try to get reimbursed. Families who pursued it spent $10k+ for it. None of them are rich, they all did it because other strategies were not working, and they all had to cut back on family vacations and other optional stuff in order to afford it. So I think it’s a very self selecting group of people getting evaluated. If evaluations were more readily accessible, I think you would get more kids would be getting evaluated and not getting a diagnosis.
Anonymous says
I know of a case where ADHD in a quiet, extremely intelligent, well-behaved child was misdiagnosed in a private assessment and properly diagnosed later after treatment and accommodations for the wrong diagnosis failed to make a difference.
If you really want an ADHD diagnosis for some reason and your child is borderline, I am sure you can find someone who will diagnose it if you push hard enough. Or are you asking because you don’t think a child you know really has ADHD and you want to judge the parents?
Anonymouse says
I’m about 6 months post-partum, having been back at work for 3 months after a 3-month mat leave. My RTO has been a struggle – it’s been hard to find my footing and get back into the regular cadence of my job, and the quarter culminated in a somewhat disappointing performance review (after multiple cycles of consistently great ones). I’m feeling a little dejected and overwhelmed, and considering looking for a new job.
I know the general advice is to not make any major decisions during the first year post-partum, but just getting through the day is so difficult. I’m feeling pretty burned out and the review hasn’t helped with my motivation.
I’d love to hear any stories from corporettemoms who’ve been through something similar and have any advice or commiseration.
Anonymous says
Ugh sorry this happened to you. I know so many women with similar stories and I think its straight up discrimination. I went through something similar too, although my story doesn’t really have a happy ending. I did sort of casually look for a new job but didn’t have much success (I’m tied to a small town for family reasons and fully remote jobs in my field are rare and extremely competitive). I’m still here, many years later, working a lot less hard than I did before because I figure I’m not going to be a great employee if they won’t give me the reviews and raises I deserve.
TheElms says
Hi there, try not to get too down on yourself. Returning to work after leave is REALLY hard. I had 5 month leaves and it was still really hard. At 6 months you are barely out of the newborn phase. Lots of kids are still not great sleepers at 6 months and working while sleep deprived is doubly hard.
I managed ok-ish with my first kid but it never felt great and then the pandemic happened when I’d been back 3ish months. I wasn’t back in the office much after the pandemic before I was pregnant with kid number 2 and my return from leave with my second kid was SO HARD and in some ways still is. I nearly handed in my notice weekly because it felt impossible. That said, I didn’t because I didn’t want to make a rash decision and I still liked what I did. Today, my second is almost 2, and it is way easier than it was at 6 months. I went back at 5 months and basically felt like I was terrible at my job AND not doing a great job as a parent until 12 months. It started to get a bit better around 12 months and then I feel like since No.2 was 18 months old or so I’ve started to feel like I’m actually good at my job again. It is still hard, sometimes very hard, because I can’t spend the number of hours on my job as my job really requires or my colleagues do, (so boundary setting and expectation setting is something I have to do every day and that is personally uncomfortable), but I think the work I’m turning out today is at the same level or better than it was before I had kids. I’ve also taken on new challenges at work and am doing a good job with them I think. I’m sure I could do better but its good enough that I feel proud of what I’m doing. That has helped build back my confidence, which really tanked, in my immediate return.
I know its hard to feel like you aren’t meeting expectations whether those expectations are your own or your employers, but if you still like your job / what you do, I think you should stick it out for at least another 3 months and probably 6 months before you decide to make a change. A 6 month old is still a really little baby and things are going to change a lot in the next 6 months.
Boston Legal Eagle says
Not at a firm, but I had a similar experience of feeling much better about my job as my kids got older, and this was with increased titles and responsibilities. I think I’m great at prioritizing now, not giving my job too much while still producing great work, and am a great leader because I am more empathetic to others. So keep at it, OP, offices need more of us out there!
MNF says
I’ve had each of my 2 kids at different firms. It’s very hard to compare — for me, having a kid was a major big change and having a second kid was kind of more of the same. But, it’s been much easier for me to return to work this second time because I like my firm so much better.
I moved my practice when oldest was 1.5. We were trying when I decided to take the offer and stopped so I could establish myself at the new firm. Our kids have a wider gap then we originally planned, but it’s worked out beautifully. I got a great raise and bonus this past year after a 4 month mat leave and part time return to work. I went from a firm that was “family friendly” (but also dinged you for not being full time on day one back) to one that has actual written policies, ramp up/down, etc. I’m not saying to leave now, but start thinking about it. If you want another, ask about parent policies when you get offers. It was a big part of my calculus.
Anonymous says
The only reason I’ve survived at my job post-kids is because management is a joke and doesn’t do performance evaluations!
My only advice is to make sure that on the top priority goal you do awesome, and let the others slide. If you have that one really big win, the other stuff becomes less important.
Anonymous says
You’re doing amazing! American women expect so much of themselves in the postpartum period! I had a 1 year leave and felt great if I put on yoga pants and went to mommy and baby yoga with a 6month old let alone being able to hold down a busy full time job!
You didn’t get fired and your work PR was okay just not amazing but as a whole person you are amazing. Keep an eye out for new opportunities if that helps you get through the day but don’t stress yourself about a job hunt on top of everything else you are doing.
Anon says
Hugs. I’ve totally been there. The postpartum period is so, so hard. I felt SO much better when my daughter was done breastfeeding (9 months) and sleeping through the night (13 months). I’m currently in the middle of it with my second. My capacity is just currently being taken up by the tiny human who’s life depends on me so I have much less for work.
I’m an A++ overachieving perfectionist so that was/is incredibly hard for me. My performance reviews were fine during my first (haven’t had one this time around yet but I’m betting it’ll be similar). Which was greatly upsetting to me, but, at my company fine is fine! I didn’t a promotion or a raise that year, but I kept my steady job where I have a good reputation. So if you’re in a similar scenario, please give yourself a break! Fine is fine!
My biggest success that first year and my goal this time around too is to not hurt my reputation. I want to coast, not crash. So, I’m very aware of my current capacity. I’m not overbooking myself, I’m not volunteering for big projects, I’m not being flashy. I’m just quietly focusing on my core responsibilities, doing them as well as I can and trying not to make any big mistakes. After my daughter started sleeping through the night and I had more capacity I led a big, visible, 1 year project.
Anon says
I don’t see how that is your business, 12:09, but I’ll answer. We are a single income family with three kids, concern is over 2 kids but, like I said, the issues are mostly at home and not as much at school so it’s not a clear answer. We recently moved, had unexpected expenses, and do not have a spare $5K to plop down at once (never mind for two kids).
If it were a clear need we’d figure it out, but absolutely would have to divert other important saving/spending. (We have a very small emergency fund right now and are prioritizing rebuilding that). Our financial picture should improve dramatically in the next year, but *right now* is tough. This board skews waaay rich, but we are not. (But we also definitely aren’t poor.)
I appreciate all the thoughtful responses. I truly am not trying to judge other families’ choices, more so getting clarity for my own.
Anon says
Major threading fail — carry on (facepalm)
Anon says
You’re doing great OP. This board skews way rich (I consider myself very affluent and have much less than many here) and most Americans don’t have $5k to cough up without a second thought.
Anon says
This is why we searched around to find a place covered by our insurance, since we also couldn’t easily afford the $5k for each kid. We ended up paying under $200 in total, and that was just from specialist co-pays for the initial eval, the followup diagnosis appt, etc. But I fully acknowledge that places that take insurance are hard to find and have long waitlists.
Anne-on says
I think it’s a huge moral failing in this country that healthcare is so expensive and that so many people have to resort to the private sector if they need to be seen with any sort of urgency. I totally understand why you’d put off a formal diagnosis given the cost.
My comment may have gotten lost in the original thread but there is a LOT you can do at home to help with behavior and executive function without seeing therapists or doctors. ADDitude Magazine has lots of good resources, and there are surprisingly good experts/therapists on instagram and TikTok that discuss parenting strategies/tips and tricks.
Finally – the major benefit the diagnosis gave our family was insight, strategies/tools, and clarity. I wasn’t a bad mom and my kid wasn’t a bad kid, his brain just works differently and having that be recognized and given tools to support him was a game changer.
Boston Legal Eagle says
Hugs, OP. I completely hear you, though I would consider myself in the rich and privileged category (and am grateful). It’s really hard to be a parent, particularly in a society where you seemingly have to figure it all out yourself, including researching all the options, calling insurance, etc., and still end up paying a lot. It sucks and I wish we all had more support.
You could try your child’s school to see if they offer an evaluation (should be free?), though I’ve heard this might be reserved for those who are really struggling academically. And if your town has a FB parents/moms group, they probably have some insight into providers who take insurance or are cheaper.