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Bad idea? says
We’ve been looking for a nanny for our 9 month old and found someone who seems like a great fit. There are two issues that are making me hesitate though. The nanny has a daughter in kindergarten and picks her up from school everyday. Our daughter would go with her and wait in the car in the pickup line for 45 minutes. I feel like this is ok but not sure. Also, her daughter would then spend the remaining hour and a half at our house. Our daughter loves people and the two were already playing together during the interview. I chose the nanny route partly to avoid all the daycare germs, would the kindergartener coming over everyday ruin that? She did say her daughter would stay with grandparents if sick and she would wear a mask in our house until her daughter was better. The baby somehow has avoided any illnesses so far but I know that’s not going to last forever (and shouldn’t). All the news about kids sick with flu/rsv and the hospitals being full is making me nervous though. Would you move forward with this person if you liked everything else about them? Thank you!
Anon says
You’ll get germs from the kindergartener but nowhere near what you get in daycare. It’s just math…one kid vs 10-20. I think it’s fine. Avoiding all illness isn’t realistic or healthy. Kids need to be around germs to build their immune systems.
anon says
My reply is in mod for some reason but yes, this. Germs are necessary
Anonymous says
Would the pick up interfere with nap time? (When is it?)
Anon says
That would be my bigger question than the germs. I’m guessing kindergartner is in a half day program so right now it doesn’t interfere? But how long are you hoping to have this nanny? In Sept. the now kindergartner will be in a full day 1st, and that pick up would have been squarely in the middle of my 1.5 year old’s naps. I know SAHMs must figure this out all the time, but to someone’s point below I wouldn’t be thrilled to be paying a premium for this. (Also, 45 minutes is a long time. What are her plans for entertaining your little one as they get older while waiting? If you don’t want it to involve handing them a screen, I would have that conversation now to be sure, because I bet that would be a lot of people’s default for something like this).
Anonymous says
My SAHM made me ride the bus for this reason.
Anon says
Yeah I suspect SAHMs use screens in this situation once the baby is a bit older (no judgment, I would too!) But I wouldn’t be thrilled about a nanny using that much screentime.
Spirograph says
An hour with a kindergartener every day would not be a deal-breaker for me. Agree that germs are necessary. I’m shocked you’ve made it 9 months without even a cold!
Anon says
Doesn’t seem that surprising to me for a first kid. My daughter started daycare at 16 months and never had an illness until then. Of course with a second or third kid it’s different because siblings bring home germs.
Bad idea? says
Op here – me too! She’s around people and kids on the weekends a lot so I’ve been waiting for it to happen
Anon says
I’d have a plan if the 5 yo has the sniffles but is well enough to go to school. Could she wear a mask and watch a movie for that last bit to distance from the baby? Go to a playground so the 5 yo can stay distanced from the baby?
Not a deal breaker, but worth discussing.
Anonymous says
Your kid is going to get germs at some point. Even if your nanny didn’t have a kid, it’s unreasonable to expect that your nanny would never be in contact with other, possibly germy, people outside of work.
Anonymous says
Depending on the other options, I would pass. Playing with the K kiddo is a non-issue. The pickup line though…I absolutely dreaded days when I had to bring my younger kids in the car and do school pickup. So boring, no toilets, trapped in the car.
In the other hand, if your kid was a younger sibling this would be life. So it’s not all bad, just something that’s annoying and I wouldn’t pay a premium to have your kid spend an hour in the car everyday.
Anon says
I agree with this. The germs are a manageable and reasonable risk, but I wouldn’t want my kid strapped into her car seat for 45 minutes a day if she didn’t have to be. If she falls asleep in the car and it’s not nap time, that may mess with nighttime sleep. If she doesn’t fall asleep in the car, is she really going to remain happy strapped into her car seat for 45 minutes? Her need to move around will change as she gets older, so while it might seem reasonable now, that may change, especially if this situation continues for years. Your child’s schedule will change too, so what might not be nap or lunch/snack, might be in the future. I work part time so get to spend a lot of time with nannies and I know a great one is hard to find, but, absent special circumstance, I’d keep looking.
Anon says
+1
Pick up is a dealbreaker. I’m not paying a nanny to have my kid tag along with her while she picks up her kid.
Anon says
I think that will end up being more like an hour of car time between getting there, waiting, and getting to the house. Presumably your kid is stuck in the car seat the whole time because you may move (eg can’t get out to be played with or fed). That’s a long time for a busy nine month old to be sitting around so I wouldn’t love that. Is there any way the nanny could park near by and then pick up her kid on foot, so baby can be in a stroller and fed and played with?
Boston Legal Eagle says
Yeah, that’s a long time in the car, and will be worse when baby is a toddler and wants to be doing stuff. And 45 minutes of slowww stop and go car line seems like torture for everyone. Agree with the last suggestion if you otherwise like her.
DLC says
Can the nanny park and walk to pick up her child rather than sit in the carpool line? At my kids’ school this is by far the mor efficient option. And the baby will get some fresh air.
Anonymous says
Exposure to a few germs from the K kid is actually not the worst idea. Then you won’t be hit with a million illnesses when you start K or preschool. Nanny can continue to come when kid is sick but you can’t send a sick baby to daycare.
For the pick up – I second the comments about the nanny parking at school or nearby and taking baby for a walk then picking up K on foot.
Anon says
what happens on teacher work days, school breaks and summer vacation? my nanny sometimes brings her daughter, which my girls love, but her daughter is 9+ years older than my kids, so doesn’t require so much attention.
Anonymous says
Anyone have friends they really like, but those friends have kids that your kids do not? We have a great neighbor, but her daughter is just not that nice to my kids- teases them, tell them she hates the things they like, tries to control all playtime, etc. Her mom tries to correct her in the moment but I think generally lets the daughter be in charge all the time at home. I’m trying to limit the times the kids see each other but still preserve my friendship, but I was kind of upset this weekend after hearing some of the stuff the daughter said to my kids- I’m mad at myself too for not paying more attention so I could have stepped in. My husband thinks it doesn’t rise to the level of saying anything, and I think he’s right for now, but if they want to hang out again, would you keep making vague excuses, or be frank?
Cb says
Oof we are having a similar dynamic now with my son’s frenemy. They love each other in school where the teacher keeps her in line but she’s wild on the playground / play dates. We like the parents, have loads in common, but I’m not sure how we get her to stop chasing which my son hates? We’ve been coaching him not to run to hopefully avoid the thrill of the chase but it’s tricky.
Anon says
This is hard, but I come at this from the perspective of having older kids. I have had many friends where the adults get along very well, but the kids go through periods where they just aren’t clicking. I very much subscribe to the theory of “no bad kids,” but I will limit my kids’ exposure to other children, based on where the kids are. For a neighbor that I liked, this might look like, hey, let’s get a glass of wine outside after the kids are in bed. Playing the long game, usually there is something else going on with the kid that they eventually grow out of (or the kids grow apart naturally). I would rather keep the relationship with my neighbor preserved by spending time together away from kids than to have to police the kids’ interactions. That leads to bad blood for everyone, in my experience. Everyone gets defensive in that scenario – parent of the aggressor eventually feels like they are being targeted, and the person with the kid getting picked on starts demonizing the aggressor.
I have a best friend, and our oldest kids each went through a rocky stage at the same time, which manifested in cruelty toward my kid. The best solution was to avoid spending time together with kids. I could sympathize with my friend as a parent and feel empathy for her kid while still holding the boundary that I wouldn’t expose my daughter to her daughter until they were out of the rough stage. It honestly just meant being a little more intentional about spending adult time with her until we were all through it. Happy to say that the kids are now friends, I’m still close with the mom, and I don’t think we would have been able to do that if I had kept the kids together.
TL/DR, when I’m starting to think of a little kid as “bad kid,” it’s time to spend less time with that kid and lean into the relationship with the parent (if you like them).
AwayEmily says
This is a great response and attitude.
anonM says
I agree, and will be keeping this in mind as my kids get older too. One thing I like about this site is it lets you kind of write out how you’re feeling and look back at it. Anon at 9:32’s approach has the benefit of avoiding leading with judgment about how your mom friend is momming. I know I would be very defensive and upset if a friend tried to challenge how they felt I was letting my kid”be in charge all the time at home.” Kids do things inconsistent with what we try to teach them all the time, but some more than others. Some adult time might lead to talking to you about their parenting challenges, in a way that won’t happen in front of the LOs.
Boston Legal Eagle says
+1 Totally agree. Kid friendship dynamics can get tricky, but if you can spend time with the mom outside of the kids for now, that’s probably best. You can actually talk that way!
Anon says
Thank you AwayEmily!! I always respect your comments a great deal, so that means a lot.
And agreed, anonM, even looking at some of the comments about other kids here, I would get (and have gotten) pretty defensive if another adult is labeling my kids as wild or projecting how parenting at home is leading to certain behaviors. In my case, the kid who was taking some stuff out on my kid had undiagnosed learning issues that was leading to tremendous frustration at school. I have a kid with sensory issues, and it took years to figure out what was going on. I heard a lot of small, directed remarks about how “wild” he was from his friends’ parents along the way. I heard all of them, and each one hurt.
I think it’s a defense mechanism, as we are all trying to fumble our way through parenting. You see another kid’s unwanted behavior and want to distance your own kid from it by othering that kid. Or blame a parenting style or family that is different than yours to feel secure that your kid would “never” behave that way. We all do it, but I think it’s really, really important to remember behind any unwanted behavior is usually just a good kid and usually a good parent trying to figure it all out. Again, older kids give you a lot more grace that eventually it will be you/your kid with a finger pointed at them/you, and we all do better to set boundaries and give grace.
Anon says
Yeah, I’m different than many people here in that we don’t really have “family friends.” Our kid has friends and DH and I have friends. There’s no overlap. (TBH I wish we had family friends, but it just hasn’t worked out that way) . But to me the obvious solution is for you to see the mom without involving the kids.
Anonymous says
OP here- thanks this is a great response. But did your friend notice that you were keeping your kid away from hers?
Mary Moo Cow says
I would hang out with the mom alone. The other mom may notice the play dynamic and be grateful for the break or opportunity to hang out just with you. You can phrase it as enjoying the mom friendship and looking to give you daughter some one on one time with DH and you some quality time with mom.
Anon says
there was a good Dr Becky podcast episode on this precise topic
Anonymous says
Depends. Are the girls the same age and in school together? That might be trickier.
We have neighborhood friends whose kids are similar but not same-age. They get along fine enough but are not independently friends. They play when we parents hang out, will watch a movie together and ride bikes, but not play dates or anything. Kids are 4-10.
Anonymous says
Don’t make your kid socialize with the mean kid. Just do brunch with the mom on your own.
Lots of people are lazy about parenting – witness all the objections here when anyone dare to suggest disciplining a kid for being mean to their siblings.
EP-er says
So my son is in HS and there is another boy his age in the neighborhood. They haven’t gotten along since elementary school…The other boy tries (succeeds?) in being a cool kid, sometimes at the expense of other kids. So they don’t hang out. But the mom is nice! And so the two of us go for walks and socialize without the kids — and I am just really careful not to say too much personal about my kid. But it is so nice to have someone to talk to about some of the challenges and things going on at school… Anyway, I always tell my kids they don’t have to be friends, but they have to be friendly. In your situation, I would stop the play dates for a while and try to socialize with just the mom in other ways.
NLD in NYC says
Who here has a regular family meeting with their spouse/partner? If so, how do you make the magic happen? Do you have a set agenda that you go through? I would like to get into the habit. While we don’t have to deal with the multiple kids activities/who’s picking up who/etc. just yet, I want to get into the habit of sitting down to talk about the upcoming week and seasons. DH isn’t unwilling per se, but I know it feels like “Another thing to do.” TIA.
Anonymous says
We get takeout on Friday or Saturday nights after kiddo is asleep and talk over dinner.
Spirograph says
We have “finances night – wine required” on our shared google calendar (with reminders turned on) once a month, but it gets overcome by events or rescheduled at least half the time. We don’t have a sit-down about the coming week so much as we’ll have an ad-hoc chat when I go to update the fridge calendar for the next week and/or when whoever starts making the meal plan/grocery list, because we plan dinners based on who’s home and how much time they have to cook. If there’s something specific we need to talk about, like confirming vacation plans or summer camp, we schedule those – either lunch date, or after the kids go to bed – (infrequently) as needed.
Mary Moo Cow says
We have periods where we’re really good about this and periods where it falls off the radar. The best system for us is lunch together on Monday or Tuesday for weekly logistics and a once month finances/budget meeting (either at lunch, Sunday afternoon while the kids are in another room, or after bedtime.) We share a google calendar that we regularly update and then try to mention the event the week and day before in a family meal or quick conversation. I also keep a paper calendar on the fridge and that visual cue prompts me to bring up any interruption to the routine the day before and the day of.
Honestly, because it is another thing to do, we have to make it somewhat fun, like a lunch date or a special cocktail while we pour over excel spreadsheets.
Anon says
I only have one kid and I know that’s easier, but I’m with your DH. This seems like a huge waste of time to me. We divide up tasks based on our preferences and skill sets and each person owns their task, with reasonable involvement from the other person (e.g., I do the taxes and it’s reasonable for me to ask DH to send me his W2). I’m in favor of shared calendars and shared documents for things like grocery lists, but having a regularly scheduled meeting seems unnecessary to me.
Boston Legal Eagle says
Husband and I are going to try this over Thanksgiving week, when we are both off. It’s meant to be more a meeting to discuss our thoughts for next year – where do we want to vacation, what household items do we want to buy, what summer camps and activities are we doing for the kids, etc. So not really anything we’d need to do monthly, but more of a yearly overview. I hope to make it somewhat fun with a nice lunch out and drinks. Otherwise, we just plan as we go and look at the shared calendar.
Cb says
We need to sit down and talk through the coming year, mostly the travel/annual leave strategy.
I’d like to sit down and talk through each weeek but I typically fly Sunday PM which is the natural time to do it, so for now, we just put everything in our google calendar in lieu of talking about it.
octagon says
I think it depends on your DH’s attitude about how things get done. I’ve tried and tried to have at least quarterly look-ahead meetings to talk about planning for trips, special events, etc. He doesn’t like it and says it feels like I’m managing him (which, fine). But then he complains that we haven’t planned ahead enough for certain things (no we cannot plan a disney trip 3 weeks out because you just realized when Spring Break is) and doesn’t seem to see the connection. Some days I think this mundane issue will be the straw that breaks our relationship, and other times I just see it as a price of admission because he’s pretty great otherwise.
Anon says
Can you just plan? I have a DH who similarly would think we can plan Disney 3 weeks in advance, but he’s also fine with me doing essentially all the vacation and summer camp/activity planning.
octagon says
Oh sure – I do like 90% of it already, but he doesn’t like feeling “overscheduled” so I like to try to make sure we are on the same page for major trips. Also I don’t want to commit us to a 5-figure expenditure without making sure that he likes the idea, can take the vacation days, etc. Right now the meetings happen when I force them – sure I can do it, but it would be great if my partner acted like it wasn’t a chore to plan things for the family?
Anon says
Ah gotcha, that does sound frustrating. I love to plan, so I don’t mind doing it, but my husband is laidback and pretty much just goes with whatever I plan. For things like vacations I obviously tell him in advance so he can block his calendar, but it doesn’t require a sit-down meeting. He doesn’t want to know how much I spend, ha.
Anonymous says
DH sit down for a half hour every Wednesday at 9pm to cover the upcoming week logistics. vacations or holiday (Christmas etc) are a separately planned discussion. When we were both in the office pre Covid it was a half hour phone call Thursdays at lunchtime.
He didn’t see it as necessary but it was necessary for my mental health – I was not prepared to continue CEOing the family and being in charge of organizing and remembering everything. Managing 5 peoples lives is just more complicated then when you are only 2.
Elle says
We do this but Sunday night plus meal planning for the week. It’s the only way we can both keep up with everything.
NLD in NYC says
Thanks all for the suggestions so far. Based on the comments, our current stage of life, and DH’s temperament, I thinking a monthly or quarterly meeting could work. We already have a shared calendar that mostly gets looked at. He doesn’t mind planning; he’s taken over planning vacations and is really good at it. It’s the more mundane things (should we do FSA this year? What 3K should we apply to?) that we need to chat about. It just feels like random things come up every other week (such is life, I know) and there’s no system to talk about them.
CCLA says
We recently started Sunday night reviews. Takes about 15 minutes, we do it before watching any shows, and we look forward on our calendars ~2 weeks, to make sure we catch things like ensuring we’ve booked care for any school closures, are aware of late meetings the other has or the like. These things should already be in our shared calendar but this allows us time to plan for coverage and get context beyond what’s in the calendar. It’s only been since last month but I’m finding them really helpful and not draining.
I’m the spouse in charge of finances and we sync up in advance of the year end CPA meeting but DH has expressed a desire to be more knowledgeable so while I’ll let him decide what will be most helpful, I’m guessing we may start quarterly meetings or similar to sync up on finances (we share accounts already so it’s not like there are any secrets, he just defers to me to set up recurring transfers, manage tax accounts, etc.).
NLD in NYC says
Sounds helpful, thanks!
Anon4this says
Regular poster, but still not even sure I want to out myself here with this… but we are taking the first steps with our IVF clinic to try for a 3rd. There are still plenty of hoops to get through – PGT, and then the actual transfer(s) etc, but we are excited. It is the point where I’m starting to feel like 2 is manageable, we have a routine down so why not send it all back into chaos again?
Seriously tho, reading about AwayEmily and others who have made it work inspires me. Very few senior women at my company have more than 1 or 2, so I’m slightly terrified but also have thought a lot through the pandemic about how in the end, family really is what you have, a job is just a job and I want to have that big family around the table in 25 years at Thanksgiving.
Anyway, squealing with excitement inside now that we have our appointment booked.
Anonymous says
I have 3. It was rough when they were younger (someone was always sick!) and pre pandemic when she and I both worked butt in seat everyday.
My kids are 5-10 now and we have a great network of other parents that help shuttle everyone where they need to be (and we reciprocate). My kids have several friends that have overlapping siblings, so I can take 2 younger kids and drop my 10 year old. The 10 year olds do their thing in a quiet house, I have a zoo, and then next week we switch. Or we make the two 10 year olds “help” watch the 5 year olds.
I’m not going to say it’s always easy, and I think I blocked out the year I had 3 under 5, but it’s fun now! Everything is more expensive, and you need a big car, and a parents getaway is tricky. We bring a nanny or a grandma along on a family vacation if we want kid free vacation time. We spend eighty gazillion dollars on sports and activities, but also….we are a pretty good cheering section!
Spirograph says
All of this. good luck, OP!
Anonymous says
I will also add that my 3rd is the stereotypical 3rd in the best ways possible. Easygoing, kind to everyone, hilarious and tells me i’m the most beautiful person she knows on the regular (and she’s 5 now!). She also learned to read just shy of her 4th birthday because her older siblings decided they wanted to teach her.
OP says
Part of the reason I want a third is my second seems like he has middle child energy, not youngest child energy. If that makes sense lol. He’s the chaotic neutral.
Spirograph says
lol. My kids are *so* their birth order types. And same, my 2nd child had middle child energy long before she was officially a middle child.
Anonymous says
Yup, makes perfect sense. My middle was born a middle child.
NLD in NYC says
Best of luck! FWIW my best friend, MD with a big job, loves having 3 kids. It’s crazy, but she loves it.
Boston Legal Eagle says
Good luck to you! I too like that idea of a big family when they’re all older, and there’s something very sweet about a big pack of siblings who grow up together and have each other’s backs when they’re adults. The older my kids get, the more I feel done with 2, but obviously things can change!
A different Anonforthis says
Aww, that is exciting and I wish you the best!
I’m currently pregnant with our second IVF baby and wondering if it will be our last or if we’ll decide to go for a third. I have a big job and my husband has a smaller job but with more constraints on time (academic/research with a lot of travel and things that students can’t work on if he’s not physically there). I’ll also turn 43 a month after the second is due, so that is a factor (I’ve had two easy pregnancies so far and we have the embryos – but I’m not sure a third when I’m almost 45 is pushing it!)
NLD in NYC says
FWIW another friend had her 4th baby (2nd IVF pregnancy, 1st resulted in twins) at 47. You never know…
AwayEmily says
Yay! It seems like yesterday that I was writing to you all to say “omg I’m pregnant with my third and terrified” and now said third is nine months old, newly recovered from RSV, and the best baby in the world. Anyway, I don’t know if I’d say I have a “big” job (academic — so, stressful in some ways but also flexible), but your “job is just a job” comment really resonates with me. I think the combination of the pandemic plus the baby brought that home a lot. I truly love my job and am excited to go to work every day, and it’s still an important part of who I am. But I think I have a much healthier (for me) attitude now than I did three years ago — I say no to more work things, I am able to get over job setbacks more quickly, and overall my career plays a smaller role in my self-worth. It’s a good balance.
Seafinch says
Congratulations on moving forward!! I didn’t find the baby days challenging or chaotic (being Candian with great leave obviously is a huge factor). But my husband was more concerned about the transition to three. Three ended up being a complete breeze, four was the same and we are now expecting #5. (ages 12-3 now). He is evangelical about 2+ now and tells everyone how great it has been, I have a job that can be quite intense and change pretty significantly (one entire field of law to another, i.e. did ligation for five years, moved to national security and intelligence in July), I usually have enough flexibility to make it work well and my bosses are family friendly. My husband also is a very heavy lifter at home (despite being a Commanding Officer) and we often have an Au Pair. I sometimes need to do things like last night when I dropped my oldest at water polo and went into the office (I work on classified systems so can’t WFH easily) and put in 3+ hours to get ahead. Husband did supper with kids and held the fort down. We keep expectations low, only do very minimal activities for under age 10-ish, keep everything within walking distance, including school. We really have a great life, I wouldn’t change it for anything. We drive a ten year old minivan, our house is unrenovated, our holiday options are limited (yours won’t nearly be so; three kids is REALLY doable in a standard hotel room etc) but I had the same dream of a big family and we feel the same about the jobs. I love my job but it doesn’t define me. We are living our dream and I am hopeful you will love it, too.
OP says
Thank you so much for this! Read your other responses below about 4 kids. We also didn’t struggle too much with the baby stage, and I absolutely adored my last maternity leave.
Anon says
someone last week suggested a thread of ridiculous/funny/annoying grandparent gifts and i could use a thread like that on this post-day light savings monday. (yesterday was torture in our house), so please share your stories!
shockingly i dont have anything too egregious to share, other than grandparents purchasing things for my 1 year old twins that are for age 4+. as a kid, i remember my dad getting super super annoyed when my grandmother bought me an easter themed snow globe bc it was purple (my favorite color), even though our family was and still is very very jewish. my grandmother was jewish too, she just liked to buy things at the hallmark store
anon says
A few years ago, when my husband was 33, my MIL bought him a four piece puzzle for Christmas. Four pieces. She thought it was so cute! and was confused as to why we confused. We didn’t have children at the time so it was definitely for him.
Anon says
hahahah omg this is hilarious I’m dying
Anon says
My parents and in-laws haven’t gotten our kid anything too annoying or ridiculous, although my SIL *always* send something that plays loud music and lights up. Can’t wait until she has kids so I can return the “favor”. :)
But I have a similar story to the snowglobe. I’m ethnically half-Jewish, DH is Jewish and we’re raising our kid Jewish. All four of our parents are atheists who have never participated in any organized religion, but my in-laws are pretty rude to me about my background. For years they have given me grief about the fact that I send “Christmas cards” (actually New Years cards) and have a fall wreath on our door (that we put up in September…). Well this year my FIL decided to send my kid a gingerbread house with a little cartoon Santa. WTF!? How is this ok and my fall wreath is too Christian!? DH and I don’t care about our kid having a gingerbread house, it’s just the hypocrisy that bothers me.
Vicky Austin says
Hah, my mom’s brother sent the light up, noise-making stuff year after year. The weird part is that his four kids are evenly bracketed around/among my mom’s three, and yet they thought these were good gifts?? I definitely remember the “batteries breaking” in some of those toys on Christmas morning.
Boston Legal Eagle says
This is very specific but my FIL got our 4 year old a wolf mask (the kind that goes over your whole head and is hard to breathe in) for his recent birthday. He’s not into wolves and is actually pretty scared of dogs and big animals. We told him he likes creative play so this was in response to that I guess?
Anon says
this made me laugh out loud. i probably would’ve purchased a super hero cape, a crown or something like that. wolf mask probably would not have entered my mind
Boston Legal Eagle says
Nope, not mine either!
Anonymous says
My mother got a free small wooden dresser thing off the curb. It smelled strongly of cat pee. She spent hours painting it and tiling it to make a play kitchen for my kids. It showed up unannounced one Christmas.
1) they already had a play kitchen
2) it still smelled of cat pee
We kept it in the house for as long as we could bare, then moved it to the garage to hold outside toys. She immediately noticed and we told her it had sort of a smell that bothered us but it was perfect outside! That was 4 years ago and it still sits in our garage, collecting dust and smelling of cat pee. I think there might be some old broken chalk inside it but no actual toys because they would smell of cat pee.
octagon says
Not for my kid, but when I was a child, I vividly remember that my sibling and I got a parade set from grandparents who lived far away. Parade. With a big drum you could wear, cymbals, and some sort of horn. We marched around our house for hours. I’m sure my parents still remember their headaches, because I acutely remember just how loud we were.
Anonymous says
My husband’s aunt Gaye bought his niece a Fry Baby deep fryer when she was maybe 8. I guess the “baby” made her think it was okay? Gaye was also legendary for planning to burn all of the Proctor and Gamble items she owned with her friend Fanny due to P&G’s alleged Satanist ties, but then she realized she didn’t really have anything, and poor Fanny was stuck burning all her paper towels and such.
Vicky Austin says
This is clearly a storied piece of family lore, I have tears in my eyes from trying not to laugh out loud at work!
Cb says
A drum for my 1 year old. A West African drum, which was accompanied by the complaint he was holding it wrong. At 1… the ukelele also has to be perfectly in-tune.
And along the snowglobe – an arc from my aggressively atheist MILs.
GCA says
My BIL and his fiancee once brought my kids (who were 4 and 1 at the time) a pair of lovely, hand-carved, direct from her tiny Eastern European village…whistles. Loud ones. They sounded like train whistles. We disappeared them while moving house and no one was any the wiser.
Anon says
My best friend, who has a same age kid, got my kid a train whistle!
Anonymous says
Last year my FIL got my daughter an enormous indoor play tent that very clearly could not fit anywhere in our house. The year before he got her a huge, weirdly heavy tricycle when we suggested a balance bike as a good gift idea. She still loves her balance bike and has never once been able to get the heavy tricycle to move on her own.
AwayEmily says
My father is also notorious for getting giant unnecessary gifts. We got a play tent when we lived in a tiny apartment. Last Christmas he got my (then 5yo) an entire desk set. She already had a desk. Oh, and when she was two he got her a horrifyingly realistic rabbit puppet. We were recording her as she opened the gift so we could send him the video, and it’s incredible because she bursts immediately into tears the second she opens the box.
Anon says
this is not me, but i recall someone once posting about a tetherball set that needed to be permanently installed in the ground with concrete
Pogo says
ok this one made me lol
So Anon says
Oh! I’ve got one: In the past, my mom would ask for recommendations for presents for her grandchildren a solid 3 months before the gift-giving occasion. Then, she would be incensed when my sister and I could not jump to providing Christmas present ideas in the middle of back-to-school season, in the middle of Christmas for my son’s bday, etc. After my daughter was not sufficiently appreciative of my mom’s Christmas gift last year, my mom declared that she will no longer buy presents for anyone. Instead, she has declared that she will donate to a cause in our name. Accordingly, when she briefly saw my kids last week, she handed them a Heifer International pamphlet and told them to pick out an animal because “not all children have easy lives like you.” While I love the idea, the execution has been wildly inappropriate and filled to the brim with judgment, which is totally on point for my mom. But this year, she is giving the gift of going to my sister’s house for Christmas.
Aunt Jamesina says
My MIL is a chronic over-gifter, although she seems to have gotten some of it out of her system with her first two grandkids (my BIL’s kids). For her first grandchild’s Christmas, she bought a pink princess potty, a play kitchen, and a tricycle. My niece was all of two months old and my BIL and his wife have next to no storage in their small home (and are also too polite to say or do anything about it).
Vicky Austin says
This allows me to (re?)share the story about our sweet older neighbors (the wife worked with my dad for a time) who liked to bring us kids Christmas presents until they retired permanently to Arizona. Every year around the 20th, the husband would come over with three packages. One year, it was a CD player for me, a boombox for one sister and a working toy piano for the other. I vividly recall him saying to my mom as he handed the gifts over, “This year’s theme is noise.” I don’t know how she didn’t murder him right there on our front porch.
Pogo says
My own parents got my son a set of golf clubs for his very first Christmas. They’re the size for like, an 8-10 year old.
They won them at some charity auction but STILL. They’ve been in our attic this entire time.
Anonymous says
My MIL, at my baby shower, presented me with literally everything that had been in my husband’s nursery when he was a baby, including wall art, crib bumpers, the terrible polyester outfit he came home from in the hospital, etc. It took FOREVER for me to unwrap all this stuff- we kept literally one thing and the rest of it went straight to donation/garbage (I felt bad that they hauled house to house for 35 years but we sure didn’t ask for it!).
And then when I was a kid, my grandma would give each of her kids a set amount of money to buy gifts for the grandkids, so she didn’t have to do it. Which would have been fine, except my aunt always added to it but my parents didn’t, and during joint unwrapping, her kids would be presented with a stereo system “from grandma” while my brother and I would unwrap a book.
anon says
An uncle-in-law bought an electric piano for our then-4-year-old. It was cute because it was a child-size version of a real piano; however, it is still as large as some of our furniture. It collects dust, sadly.
Anonymous says
My terrible FIL is notorious for trying to buy his kids’ affections. For my son’s first birthday he got him a full sized guitar (but not a nice one: think it was from a garage sale). It came complete with a lengthly monologue about how great it would be if his grandson was a famous guitarist. Not that grandad would ever know, as he only visits us once a year and is always “too busy” being retired when we’re in his city visiting. My son is now five and grandad still goes on about how my son needs to take guitar lessons.
anon regular poster because my family could tell this one hahah says
There are too great.
One aunt has bought all of us nieces various years: a diva cup, a Go Girl, and a glass straw for loose-leaf tea (looked like dr*g paraphernalia of some kind..very odd). Lol…great intentions but odd to open a Diva Cup when you’re like 15 in front of the whole family….
My MIL is a wonderful person, so please don’t out me in real life if you recognize these kid gifts! First, she used to bring a gift every time she visit the baby. I had to pretty much beg her to stop. The worst was this bright orange plastic cat (“Catch-me-Kitty”) that makes noises and moves around! It’s a loud tripping hazard and I hate it. Of course the kids and husband all think it is the funniest toy on the planet, and it has been literally pulled out of the garbage/donate pile several times now! Agh. *makes mental note to hide in the trash next week*
SC says
My grandmother probably takes the cake by buying my cousin a dog without asking my aunt. I remember the puppy being under the tree in a little box/crate, wrapped with holes in it. My aunt refused to let the dog live with her, so my grandparents got themselves a dog for Christmas. My cousin went to my grandparents’ house after school everyday, but she never actually took care of or particularly liked the dog.
Test Confusion says
My period is late (about a week). Over the weekend I took a pregnancy test and was thrilled that it was positive! I have no idea why I did this, but a couple of hours later I took another and that was negative. Then the next morning I had a negative test. I ordered some of the strips as I was using digital tests prior so I haven’t taken one yet today. What does this mean? I still haven’t gotten a period and am definitely feeling some of the typical early symptoms (mostly nausea, but also mild cramping). I figure I should just call my doctor but wanted to see if others had similar anecdotes and what the outcome was.
Anonymous says
I’d make an appointment with your doctor. By a week late, you should be getting a clearly positive test. It could be a fluke and everything is fine, it could be that you are having a very early miscarriage, or as a worst case it could be an ectopic pregnancy. I don’t want to scare you because really everything is probably fine, but I had an ectopic and my first sign was that my pregnancy tests were staying very, very faint even as time went on and you would expect them to get darker. My doctor followed my beta HCG levels via blood tests and saw that HCG wasn’t rising as much as it should, and then it dipped and then began to slowly rise again. That kind of wonky HCG pattern is a sign of an ectopic pregnancy, which is best caught and treated as early as possible. Wishing the best for you!!
anon says
I have had this happen several times, and unfortunately each time was a chemical pregnancy. Ie a very early miscarriage.
Anon says
This. So sorry.
Anon says
I’m sorry. It may be a chemical pregnancy – happened to me. I hadn’t gotten a period but the pregnancy test lines were very faint rather than getting darker.
anon says
Based on my prior experiences, unfortunately that likely means you had a chemical pregnancy. It would be unusual at this point not to have a positive test if the pregnancy had stuck. I’m sorry – I have been there several times, and it is so disappointing if you were hoping to be pregnant.
Isabella says
ISO books that talk about the meaning(s) if fatherhood? Open to most types: religious or woke, prose or poetry, just looking for something with depth beyond stale cliches.
Mary Moo Cow says
Pappadaddy’s Book of Advice for Dads by Clyde Edgerton is a gem. It’s a reflection on his many years of being a father, being a young father and being an older new dad. DH likes to give it to his friends when they become dads and every now and again when I’m feeling low, I read it for the affirmation that it’s not the day to day but the long-term investment you are making. (Also cause it makes me laugh to imagine Clyde Edgerton cutting up a kids vitamin and saying, “Bad kitty.”) Michael Chabon’s Manhood for Armatures is another one I enjoyed.
Anonymous says
Moms of elementary school bookworms! Help me out! I have a very strong reader who is in 3rd grade. We need book recs of all types- she’s a very strong reader but doesn’t necessarily need books at the top of her reading ability, just long and can engage her.
We’ve done all the classics (Cleary, Dahl, babysitters club, those kinds of books) but are looking for newer series or long chapter books that she can work on for a few days instead of zipping through them.
She’s liked the “I survived” series, Emily Windsnap books, and we are far enough along in Harry Potter that we read them together so we can discuss what’s happening as it happens. She’s read the entire Series of Unfortunate Events and the Penderwick files series and liked them but I think would like a bit more variety.
She could read, but I don’t like them for her yet, the Percy Jackson books.
We’ve asked the librarian and gotten some of the above as successions in the past. Her teacher….was not super helpful.
Anon says
while they have some controversial topics (maybe good discussion points?), I loved all of the Little House books at that age. I was also a strong reader and while I think I was maybe in 4th grade, I really liked Little Women, Little Men and the Louisa May Alcott books in that series. Granted, this does not at all answer your question of something newer. I did not really like fantasy type books, but if she does, Narnia? If she likes mysteries, there is Nancy Drew (but again the writing is a bit old). My kids are still young so i’m not up to date on the 3rd grade reading trends.
Anonymous says
She’s read some little women and we read the narnia series together a few years ago.
Good recs but not new books :).
Spirograph says
Check out March Book Madness middle grade lists. Also Newberry lists.
My 4th grade son has liked the Spy School and Wings of Fire series. He’s an average reader, and was reading both of them by end of last school year, so your daughter could certainly handle them. Neither is great literature, but they’re engaging reads.
I’m curious why you don’t like Percy Jackson books for her? My kids are obsessed with them… Percy’s crush on Annabeth gets a little heavy-handed in the later books (and the writing/story goes a little downhill, IMO), but the first 2-3 books are great adventure stories.
Anonymous says
Land of Stories is good and wings of Fire.
Anne of Green Gables as well.
My 3rd grader plowed through Harry Potter on her own. They were more grown up then I realized when I finally read then during the pandemic.
Anonymous says
OP here. My kid can read Harry Potter no problem, but our rule is that we read books 4 and up together because of the content. We read 1&2 together, she read 3 herself. With 4 I would read with her then let her read a chapter or two herself but make sure to be there to tread together some of the dark parts and all of the death scenes.
Anonymous says
Yeah I’m the OP and we read Harry Potter 1 & 2 together, she read 3 alone, but we are having her read the rest with us (with some chapters where she can read alone). Depending on how long it takes to get through them she’ll end up reading the later books alone but in 4th/5th.
Spirograph says
I agree, beyond book two or three, they’re a little heavy for a younger elementary school kid to read alone. The last couple books are just straight-up dark. I don’t want my kids to learn spoilers before they’re old enough to read them independently, and it seems like many parents do not share my You Must Read The Book Before Watching The Movie opinion. We’re reading the whole series aloud to all the kids. Currently halfway through Goblet of Fire and I’m enjoying the re-read! except… the descriptions of Dudley are awful. I actually had to pause and talk about how Dudley is not a nice kid, but that’s because of his actions, not his appearance, and the author constantly making fun of him being fat is just as bad. yuck.
EP-er says
We go to the library together weekly. It is a low risk way of trying new books! Around that age, she read a bunch of series: Lost in Rome/Ireland/etc, Heide Hecklebeck, Goddess Girls, Wings of Fire, Percy Jackson, other Riordan series, Beasts of Olympus. Pretty much we just wander around and see what looks good? There are so many series out there. I skim some of them so we can talk about them, but I can’t keep up with all of her reading, plus mine!
Anon says
Land of Stories. Magical Misfits. All of a Kind Family. Anne of Green Gables.
I like Percy Jackson!
Vicky Austin says
Lucy Maud Montgomery!
Anon says
Ballet Shoes!
Elle says
I really liked the dear American and the Royal diaries series around that age!
Anon says
Not at all new, but my third grader bookworm enjoyed:
The Secret Garden
A Little Princess
The Mixed Up Files of Mrs. Basil E Frankweiler
Hatchet (and sequels)
Redwall series
Faraway Tree series
My Side of the Mountain
Treasure Island (partly with a parent)
Anon says
I’ll also add Pippi Longstocking and Wayside Stories from Wayside School to my prior list.
My kid also enjoyed Land of Stories, Warriors (which I didn’t like), Wings of Fire, and Dork Diaries. Gregor the Overlander is a great adventure series that she loved.
She’s also enjoyed the My America series, though I find some of them to be pretty dark (see The Starving Time and the one about Marie Antoinette being shipped off naked as a child bride).
GCA says
welcome to my childhood! Around 3rd or 4th grade, my parents utterly lost track of what I was reading – my mom is a great reader but her first language isn’t English, and my dad is a great reader of scifi and what we call ‘dad science/ history’ books but also a molasses-slow reader. And they both worked. So I read everything in the school library, the local library and whatever I could persuade them to get at the bookstore: Beverly Cleary, The Hobbit and then Lord of the Rings, all of the Goosebumps and RL Stine, Babysitters Club, pulp science fiction, the thrillers my grandmother left lying around… Not all of the books I inhaled were necessarily ‘good’ books with ‘appropriate’ themes, but they certainly kept me occupied. So I’m here to say that even if she explores a ton of poorly plotted pulp science fiction, it will be ok! Luckily, you do have loads of good options here already – and I would add Shannon Hale and Kate diCamillo’s middle grade books, maybe Kelly Barnhill.
GCA says
Also, if she likes animals, James Herriot. Maybe Gerald Durrell (My Family and Other Animals)?
Anne-on says
FYI I thought about giving my 5th grader my James Herriot books and then did a quick re-read and realized just how much of the later books were descriptions of his newlywed love life and the earlier books had LOTS of colorful language and descriptions of the brother’s exploits with the local womenfolk. Uh, no. There ARE children’s versions, those should be fine ;)
GCA says
Clearly the parts about shoving uteruses back into cows made much more of an impression on fourth grade me than the parts about his dating travails!! :D
Anonymous says
My Side of the Mountain, the Anastasia Krupnik series by Lois Lowry
Vicky Austin says
Ooh, I LOVED Anastasia Krupnik! Not new, but newer than L. M. Montgomery.
I’ll also throw in a second for Shannon Hale. I don’t know how long she’s been writing, but I’m young enough to have read her books stolen from a little sister for whom they were age appropriate at the time, and I bet your daughter would enjoy them.
Forgot about these, but have you explored Ann M. Martin’s non-BSC titles? I recall really enjoying Longer Letter Later, for example.
Tea/Coffee says
Just don’t be my mom, who was on the hunt for “books long enough to engage me” in 4th grade and wound up with the Clan of the Cave Bear box set :-)
Dave Barry “The Worst class field trip ever” or something like that
Charlie Thorne and the Last Equation
+1 to Land of Stories
Dork Diaries?
My 4th grader lived, but YMMV, the Hunger Games series.
Spirograph says
If you’re not ready for Hunger Games yet, Suzanne Collins also wrote a middle grade series: Gregor the Overlander. I read it as an adult and liked it, none of my kids have gotten into it yet, though.
Gordon Korman has been writing for a loooong time. I haven’t read any of his most recent books, but “I Want To Go Home” was one of my favorites as a kid, and I can’t imagine his sense of humor has changed much.
Anon says
My third grader loved the Gregor series. Holes was also a hit.
Mary Moo Cow says
Nancy Drew (both the Clue Crew and the originals), Secret Garden, The Little Princess, Nim’s Island series; Harriet the Spy; Amelia Bedelia and Friends; Kate DiCamillo (Because of Winn-Dixie and the like). Maybe the Wrinkle in Time series? The Doctor Doolite or Mary Poppins series?
Anonymous says
Thanks, we’ve hit a lot of these and the rest are either bombs or they are / will read in school so we’re skipping on purpose. I was a huge bookworm too and already went through the books I read and loved as a kid so I was hoping for suggestions from people with kids that recently were in 3rd-5th that are reading some of the newer books out there. We do pester the librarian and get good recs already.
Anonymous says
If she hasn’t yet read The One And Only Ivan (and the sequels), I highly recommend them! This was a teacher read-aloud at school that my kids liked so much they also requested I get it for their Kindles so they could re-read.
Anon says
At her age I loved Nancy Drew, Little House on the Prairie series, and My America/Dear America series. I was a kid 20 years ago, though obviously Nancy Drew and LHOP way pre-date my childhood so I echo the previous poster’s comment about not sure how well they’ve aged. But, I did remember liking that all 3 series had some strong female protagonists!
Anon says
My fourth grader enjoyed Dragonrider by Cornelia Funke. It is long, so will take some time to read. He is also enjoying the Endling series by Katherine Applegate. Spy School is a popular series amongst his age group, so might be worth trying. My kid read one book in the series, but didn’t get really engaged in it. My son has read a lot of the Warriors series. I haven’t read any of them, so not sure how good of quality they are. An old series, but my kid likes Animorph books. He also enjoyed the City of Ember series.
Anonymous says
omg Animorph! I had completely forgotten about those, but I remember I picked them up when my younger brother was in the target age group. They were fun :)
Anon says
The Warriors series seems to be engaging for kids, but isn’t especially well written and is both violent and gross. My kid plowed through several sets but I was thrilled when she moved on to something better.
Anon says
Maybe skewing a little older but Ann Rinaldi (historical fiction) and the Tamora Pierce (Alanna series) and (maybe younger) the older American Girl doll books, Nancy Drew and Hardy Boys and were favorite authors in late elementary.
Anonymous says
I’m late, here are a few other series I haven’t seen listed: The Real Mccoys, Sixty Eight Rooms, Sisters Grimm, Animal Ark (this one isn’t new, actually out of print. But they’re pretty recent and I bought lots of 20+ on eBay for cheap in Covid times. There are over 100 and my kids both like them).
Anonymous says
Moms who are one and done… do you ever feel inferior because you don’t have two kids? Like, you “can’t handle” more than one so you’re less than? 95% of the time, I feel confident in my one and done decision. But then I see someone who has the same education (like we went to the same college and law school) similar level of local family support, lives in the same city (so same cost of living/life/commute logistics), and feel that I should be able to handle it because they are able handle it. And that’s where the doubt creeps in.
anon says
No. Our decision to be one-and-done is about us, not other people. Comparison, thief of joy, etc.
Anonymous says
I’m the opposite- a mom of 3- but wanted to chime in that having 1 kid isn’t lesser, it even better, it’s just a different kind of family life. I have friends with one kid and they have so much fun as a trio! Will they ever be the hot mess rolling up with a minivan of soccer shin guards and yesterday’s breakfast and random water bottles and ballet slippers that fall out when you open the door too fast? Almost certainly no. And that’s not a bad thing.
You do you!!
Anon says
Hot mess mom of one here representing.
Anon says
Hard same. I read something on a one and done forum about how they felt confident and good about their parenting when traveling, because they saw all the moms of big families being hot messes. And I was thinking “um, I AM the hot mess.”
Anonymous says
That was my post. I was a hot mess with one but 3x the kids is 3x the everything. My kids each have two pairs of shoes in the car, plus dance shoes and cleats. That’s over 20 shoes in my car right now. I also have 2 softball bags, 2 soccer bags, three soccer balls, 4 sideline chairs and a case of water.
Anon says
Nope! I guess I don’t feel like I “couldn’t handle it.” It’s more just that I would enjoy my life less if I had two, and I would rather just have one and enjoy my life more.
The main thing that bothers me about one & done is people thinking/saying negative things about my kid, like “only child are spoiled/selfish/socially awkward.” Fortunately our friends and family aren’t rude and we rarely have to deal with comments, but whenever my kid has an issue sharing something or behaves in a bratty way in front of people outside our immediate family, I feel so guilty and stressed and worry that everyone is thinking to themselves “ooh what a stereotypical only child” even if they’re not saying it out loud. Rationally, I know she’s 4 and all 4 year olds can have trouble sharing or act bratty at times, but it’s hard to push aside the guilt and fear that everyone is judging me and blaming all my kid’s negative behaviors on her only child status. I feel like she’s under a microscope in a way that kids with siblings aren’t, if that makes sense? (Which is sort of silly if you think about it, because a newborn baby isn’t teaching a 3 year old anything about sharing.) It doesn’t help that she’s very strong-willed/spirited so she tends to act out more than a lot of my friend’s laidback oldest kids so there was a time when she was definitely the problem child in our group (although many of my friends are now getting humbled by strong-willed second kids!)
Anon says
And replying to myself to say that also the flipside of this is that even positive comments can sting. We saw extended family this weekend and my kid and her second cousins that she’d never met before hit it off immediately, and shared a jewelry-making kit that was officially a gift to my kid. My husband’s aunt was like “We’re so impressed with how social she is and how well she shared her new toy! It’s just amazing for an only child.” Like they can’t just give her a compliment, it has to be tied to “…for an only child.”
Seafinch says
If it makes you feel any better, we get the opposite of this. My MIL is firmly of the (loudly publicly spoken) opinion that all children after the second are accidents and no one in their right mind should want more. We have four and are constantly criticized any time any of them does somethings she doesn’t like that it’s because there are too many of them (to control, to discipline, to parent etc). She dislikes my 8 year old and it has never occurred to her that he bristles at her because of this palatable dislike, not because he has three sisters and we are terrible parents. You can’t win! People love to judge one another and will find a way. The singles I know are all nice kids!
Anon says
Ugh, sorry you get that. I feel like two kids, maybe three, is what’s socially acceptable, and any more or less than that and people love to criticize you.
Seafinch says
100%
Boston Legal Eagle says
I have 2 but, as a general life matter, you don’t need to do anything just because you “can.” Could I be a biglaw partner working at night and sign my kids up for 5 sports at a time? Sure, I probably could – I’m a smart, organized person. Do I want to? No. And those other people you see “handling it” might be overwhelmed too, have fewer vacations, fewer resources, or maybe not, there’s so much about other families that is not apparent.
Anon says
+1. I can’t imagine doing something just because I “could do it.”
Pogo says
Right, I *could* run a marathon, but I choose not to. Because I don’t feel like it.
Anon says
+3. I could definitely be and do a lot of things, but I choose not to.
Anon says
i have twins and often feel like i’d be a much better mom if i was a mom of one so i am kind of jealous. i love love my kids, and am so indecisive and wasn’t sure if i wanted one or two, so its probably a good thing we had two at once or i’d be stressed deciding, but you do you! do i think it is easier to have one child (assuming the child is generally healthy, etc.)…yes, but do i think you are inferior or less than, most certainly not
Anon says
Ha, and I’m one and done but jealous of twin moms. I know it’s SO HARD in the early years (not trying to minimize that) but I do love the idea of kids having a built-in playmate without having to go through two pregnancies or having to extend the (IMO, difficult and exhausting) stage of life when you have a kid under 4. I was one and done before we even started trying to conceive, but I would have been secretly thrilled if it had been twins.
Mrs. Jones says
No. A thousand times no.
Anonymous says
No. But I also work in the arts and know a lot of accomplished people who are childless by choice; this is just not an area where I feel competitive. I’m sure I could handle it if I had to but I don’t WANT to.
Cb says
Someone told me 1 kid was an accessory, 2 was a lifestyle and it was meant to be rude but I was like “yep, sounds about right!” I love my one kid, and it allows me to do way more career-wise than I could with 2. So I just try and focus on the positives.
Anon says
The one and done subr3ddit got so offended when Meghan Markle said that, but I kind of think she’s right? Yep, that’s why I did it! Haha.
Anonymous says
OP here – thanks all for the thoughtful responses. I think the specific question I ask myself is “what do they have that makes them feel confident in their ability to raise two kids that I don’t have”?
I am confident in my decision 95% of the time, but definitely feeling the 5% doubt heavily this morning.
AwayEmily says
It seems like both you and your 2-kid friends are doing a good job knowing what works for you — and that’s naturally going to differ between people. For example, I would not be able to handle being a SAHP. I would snap at my kids, be constantly irritated, and be low-level depressed. I even felt this way during maternity leave. Thus, I send my kids to daycare and we’re all happy. Who knows what the happy SAHPs have that I don’t. But I also don’t really care, because I’ve figured out a life that works for me and my kids. And it sounds like you have, too! I guess what i’m saying is that the relevant counterfactual to consider here isn’t “a different you who can handle two kids.” You are you and that’s probably not going to change change. The relevant counterfactual is “you with two kids,” and it sounds like that would not be enjoyable for you, just like being a SAHP would not be enjoyable for me. I think it’s awesome you’ve figured this out!
Pogo says
They probably don’t feel confident at all! Anyone can get pregnant with multiple kids, they don’t make you take a test beforehand to prove you can do it.
And as someone w/ 2, they are SO different – I think if we had stopped with my oldest, I would feel like you, constantly asking myself what I did wrong (I mean, I still do this). He’s challenging – but my second is a happy go lucky little dude, and so much more ‘normal’ on the developmental scale, that I can guarantee it’s nothing I did right or wrong, kids are just…. kids.
Mary Moo Cow says
Oh, honey, I have 2 and look at friends with 3 and 4 kids and say, “what do they have that gives the the confidence to raise more than 2 kids that I don’t have?” So I think that isn’t limited to having one child. Hugs.
Anon says
Currently trying for number 2 and I’m not confident in this! At all! Our trio is very happy, I feel like I’m finally getting my personhood back, I’m worried/expecting the 2nd child is going to make things a lot harder. Everyone I know who had a 2nd acknowledges what they gave up for them (attention for the 1st, time for self care, money).
Anonymous says
This is probably going to be taken the wrong way, but most of my friends with 2+ kids just aren’t thinking about it that way – either they didn’t think about it at all, or they have a clear vision of what they want their family to look like (or what they think a family “should” look like) and just go for it. Once they have 2 (or whatever number they end up with), there’s no real option other than to muddle their way through.
Anon says
Yeah, for a lot of my friends there was a strong sense of obligation to have a second as a gift for their first child. Not that they didn’t want two, of course they did, but they weren’t really assessing it in terms of what they could handle because they felt very strongly that their first child needed a sibling. As an only child, I never felt that sense of obligation because I know only childhood can be happy.
Anony says
I’ll be the outlier and say I totally feel this way sometimes! It’s not rational. I know, in my head and in my gut, this is the right decision for us – our family dynamic makes me happy, and I don’t feel the pull or desire for a baby that I did before my only at all. And I don’t want to live life on the highest difficulty setting anyway – we’ve had some challenges with family health and other issues over the past 5 years and I’m thrilled that things have settled and gotten easier. But on hard days when I feel overwhelmed, which I’m sure happen to absolutely everyone, I definitely wonder, how do people with two or three or four kids handle this when we’re struggling to take care of our one while managing our careers and other life things, are we just less capable than they are? It’s jarring to me because I’ve always thought of myself as a capable person who can do hard things. I think the answer is that we rise to meet challenging moments (like we did for our not-child-related challenges), and it’s not necessary or even helpful to plan or envision how, we figure it out.
And on the other hand, I’m not bothered by people saying negative things about onlies because they just sound so deeply stupid to me because my two closest friends are onlies and they’re the best people. I think we all have different things that bug us.
Anon says
The friends in my life who were only children loved and appreciated their childhoods. They’re also hubs of the community as adults. My husband and I are both from big families and have noticed that we find it easy to neglect friendships / community / society at large because siblings fill so many roles for us, which makes life easy in certain ways but not always in a good way when we end up feeling a bit isolated or disconnected in our insular family world.
Anonymous says
Thank you for articulating this, Anon! I’m an only (not by my parents’ choice), and DH doesn’t get along with his sibling at all (sibling is naturally difficult and always has been, and they have zero shared interests). Pre-kid, it really seemed like we’d be able to create a “family” from our extended family (I was close with several cousins) and friends, but now that everyone has kids, they spend most of their time with their own siblings, and we’re the ones feeling a little isolated. We’re now leaning toward one-and-done, but I can’t help but worry that we’re setting our kid up for more isolation.
Anon says
Only with an only here. I’m introverted and have never felt the need for the large social circle some people want, but I don’t feel isolated at all. I have a handful of good friends who are like sisters to me, a wonderful husband and kid, and my parents are local to us and very involved in our lives (although I realize they won’t be around forever). My husband does have a sibling and they don’t hate it each, but they aren’t close, and by the time my SIL has kids (if she even has them) my kid will be so far past the baby/toddler stage that they won’t really be playmates.
Your kid can have a big family if s/he wants one! My daughter very confidently informs me that she’s going to have three kids because three is the “correct” number of kids to have (no idea where this comes from as most of her friends are onelies or have one sibling). To which I say “Great!” (and “good luck” hahaha).
Anonymous says
OP here… thank you! This so articulates how I’m feeling. Like, I’m smart, I’m capable, and I’ve always done hard things. I don’t, as you perfectly stated, want to live my life on the “highest difficultly setting.” I also know that one child is the right choice because I only want a second when my one is being especially adorable, and never when he’s being a pain. It’s just that when someone has two, I wonder what makes it something they feel capable of doing and me not. It also feels weird, after 3.5 decades of doing the hardest thing to prove that I can and not taking an easy way out, to take what might be viewed as an easier path.
Anne-on says
I feel this way too sometimes, usually around the same time that I’m beating myself up for not being able to flawlessly parent/work/volunteer/work out/craft/cook all meals from scratch. I COULD sleep less and do more but neither I nor my family would be happy with that version of me. And in reality, being a family of 3 is pretty sweet and we are all more than ok with it (my child is vocally happy about being an only and it does make my work/life SO much easier than juggling multiple schedules).
Aunt Jamesina says
My goal is not to have as many kids as I can handle, which sounds like a recipe for misery. It’s to have the family size that is the best fit for us.
Anon says
Eh. Just because you “can” handle more doesn’t mean you “should” – unless you want to. I knew I wanted to be a parent of multiple children…literally the moment I had kid #1 in my arms. And I will say, my second kid is way more fiesty/”work” than their older sibling, has needed a push on milestones where older sibling didn’t, throws food, etc. I love having my two kids but I also completely get it’s not for everyone.
I know this is only my perspective but the only children in my life have expressed that they wished they had siblings, more community, etc. – however, I don’t think it means all onlies don’t have that as a result, as seen on this board. It’s very dependent on the parents and how they decide to structure the unit for themselves and their child.
Anon mom says
Any moms of 4 kids here? I would be really interested to hear about your experience and decision making. My plan had been to stop at 3 and my youngest just turned one and I just don’t feel “done”… but not sure if I ever would?
Anon says
I have a friend who has 4. She didn’t feel done after 3, but said she felt immediately done as soon as the fourth was born. She did leave her job after having the fourth, but I’m not sure if it was the baby that motivated that. Her older two kids were in elementary by then, so it may have been motivated more by the childcare challenges for elementary age kids.
Anon says
I have four! Baby just turned one. What do you want to know? I definitely felt done after 4 and was open to more after 3 but not convinced we’d do it. We decided to go for four during covid when we realized we were pretty happy hanging out at home as a family unit, and we’d like more of that. Our older two are very close and we also kind of wanted a buddy for the youngest or to even things out a bit so there wouldn’t be an odd man out (and I already think that has worked). We go G B G G, so we weren’t going for one sex or the other. Four feels like a big aggressive move, but we love the baby! Our oldest is 7.
OP says
So good to know! I have a 5,3, and 1 year old now and my husband and I both work full time. We had planned for 3 and 4 would be a stretch in all ways, but I just don’t feel “done”… I’m also pushing 40 so time is a factor.
Curious if you always planned for 4? Also how was the jump from 3-4?
Me again says
Definitely didn’t always plan for four. We’re both from families of 3. We just liked the idea of a big family – and four truly makes you one of those, for better or worse! We decided to go for the fourth after having the third.
Jump from 3-4 was our easiest transition in most ways, although it does add a couple big stressors – going out of town for a weekend is a bigger production (going out of town without kids, which we’ve done twice, even more so!) But overall transition was not bad at all. Feels the same as 3. I will admit, our three year old is not getting to do saturday morning soccer, which her older siblings did, because we have too much going on. But I think that on balance that’s probably a good thing?
Anon says
i don’t, but my daughter is in a class with a youngest of 4 and the mom is a surgeon. it seems like she had 2 closer together in age, waited a bit, and then had two more closer together in age
Anonymous says
Both my parents’ families are like this, with a 5-7 year gap between the older and younger pair of kids. A few of my friends/my kids’ friends have this type of age split, but it’s a first and second marriage thing. I often wonder if my husband would have been more open to a 4th if we had left more space between 2 and 3.
We stopped at 3, which was my husband’s choice, not mine. By the time baby #3 was about 3years old, I did feel done, so it *is* something you may come around to.
OP says
Thank you! My husband would be totally happy stopping at 3. I’m trying to sus out whether I’m dealing with grief over this period passing or whether I truly want to have another child.
Anon says
My comments in mod. But we have four! And I’m still working full time. I really like the dynamic of four kids, but in a lot of ways I chose it for the kids, not for us, if that makes sense. I don’t think I put that earlier, but it’s true.
Parent of four again says
Oh one other thing, which the post below about a three year old reminded me of. We are legitimately better parents now. Like I know what to expect from a three year old, know how to respond. My kids are all very different, but that makes us better at parenting too – we have a lot of perspective on things? You kind of have to be good at seeing the big picture with four? Anyway, that might sound silly, but it’s nice having a baby and really knowing what you’re doing! Don’t think it changes how the kids will turn out obviously, but it’s a good feeling.
Anon says
I have three, my youngest is 1.5, and I really want another (still working on my husband but I think it’ll happen…) I don’t feel done, either. I’ve wanted to be a mom for so long (like, since I was three it was my primary life goal) and I hate the thought of the baby season being over already. I also think three is a hard number in that someone is often left out (I’m one of three girls), and like the idea of having an even number, or at least more options for kids to pair off.
I do think I’d feel more ready to be done after a fourth, whereas I’ve always had the thought of “at least one more” up to this point.
Vicky Austin says
I’m also one of three and being an odd one out was tough on all of us at one time or another, which is why I’d like to have four eventually. But we’ll see how #1 goes – I might change my entire mind!
Boston Legal Eagle says
2 is a nice even number :)
Vicky Austin says
That’s true! I loved being part of a bigger bunch with camaraderie, but my husband and his one sister have a GREAT relationship and always have, so I need to be open-minded. Thank you :)
OP says
You basically summarized my feelings/experience right now! So nice to at least feel like I’m not alone.
Seafinch says
I commented twice already today and you read my comments above which explain my thinking somewhat. We have four, I am expecting our fifth. I thought I wanted five but was unsure if we would get there. I have had 7 miscarriages (late first trimester) so have been pregnant 12 times. It’s generated of medical investigation and management. I am about to turn 45. I never felt done. It was a deep yearning. I love having babies. We really enjoy the newborn period and the first year (in contrast to lots of people) and can afford it and have flexible jobs (see above comment: leave in the fed gov in Canada is incredible). It’s been a great experience and going to three, and then four, was a breeze. Our life is very different than a lot of people with two or even three kids but it works for us.
OP says
Thank you so much.
Anonymous says
I had two and did not feel done. We had our 3rd and I would purge baby stuff the day she outgrew with with 0 additional thoughts or regrets and DH got a vasectomy when our 3rd was 3 months old.
I see babies now and want to hold them and give them back. My youngest is 4 and keeps asking for a baby. We are getting a puppy.
If a 4th child came into our lives, we would easily fold him/her into the bunch but it was an easy decision to stop at 3.
Seafinch says
I can relate, We never find out sex and this time I would really like to know so I purge now; before its born! I am fantasizing about getting rid of so much stuff.
AwayEmily says
Same on all counts. We thought we would be done at two and then both of us just…weren’t. But now after having our third, I have the “our family is for sure complete” feeling every day. I’m so glad we had our third and I’m so glad we aren’t having any more. so yeah, in my experience the “done” feeling CAN come.
Anonymous says
My husband has been getting frustrated with our 3-yo’s meltdowns lately. Kid is curious and fun but can be pretty stubborn when he doesn’t want to do something. I feel like it’s probably normal for a (young) 3 year old to be 50/50 on new activities, but it’s really making my husband feel bad. For example, we took our kid to the Udvar-Hazy Center (a Smithsonian museum in an airplane hangar with a ton of old planes and space things) and our kid was into it for about 10 minutes before completely melting down (like lying on the floor refusing to move). I had kind of expected it to happen, so I just rolled with it and got him excited to go back to the car by talking about what kind of music we would listen to. But DH was really disappointed that our kid didn’t want to see the planes and stuff with him, and it spiraled into a worry that our kid has behavioral issues. What are y’all’s thoughts?
Anon says
Your kid sounds completely normal.
Anon says
I’d expect a well rested and fed 3 yo to make it more than 10 minutes at Udvar Hazy. I would not return to the car after driving out and paying for parking because the kid wanted to leave. No way. If they threw a tantrum then they could sit on a bench to calm down until they were ready to participate nicely.
Anonymous says
He’s worried that your kid has behavioural issues because kid had a tantrum at a museum that kid was not interested in? Kids are not always interested in what their parents like and vice versa. I had to listen to my 8 year old chatter nonstop about planets last night. DH thought it was interesting and I was bored to tears (but put on a brave face). Kids and parents don’t always like the same things. 3 year olds don’t do well when they are bored.
Anon says
ha we went there this summer while visiting my dad with my 4 year old twins. while we did walk through for a bit, i think my kids whined almost the whole time. yesterday we took them to a festival at an art museum and they spent most of the time asking to go home (day light savings was torture for us). last week i picked my daughters up from ballet and one of them was literally laying on the floor, complaining bc they got their recital costume and it is white and she wants it to be colorful. i am definitely not always able to maintain my cool, but i am trying a lot harder to stay calm, not be reactive, hold boundaries and let kid react, whereas DH gets annoyed out too quickly when kids cry/shout/protest
Anonymous says
I think that’s normal for 3. Udvar Hazy is overwhelming for me as a grown adult and IIRC there isn’t much kids can touch/interact with there. Kids that age are entertained by pretty simple things.
Anon says
Yes, I wonder if you’re doing too much? 3 year olds are really entertained by the simplest things. Like I remember at that age my daughter found a rock on a walk and carried it around/talked about it for weeks. If there’s someplace *you* want to go, it can be worth taking your kid along and seeing if they can hang, but at that age, we didn’t do anything specifically for the kid except playgrounds and the library.
Walnut says
If it makes your husband feel better, I have nearly the same reaction to this style of plane museum. Just substitute ‘lying on the floor’ with ‘sit on a bench’.
CB says
I think sometimes kids respond negatively to our hyping things up / the expectation that they should be SOOO excited? My son doesn’t typically tantrum but will get quieter and quieter when he’s taking everything in and the times I’ve pushed him to be demonstrably excited, he’s gotten super cross.
But I guess as people who had children slightly earlier/later than our closest peers, we didn’t always have a great gauage about what is normal for X age. My dad’s explanation for everything my son does is “he’s 5!!!”
Anonymous says
Normal. My daughter’s year as a 3 year old has been a wild ride. Lots of very difficult phases (some involving very angry, rage-filled tantrums), but each phase has passed with her learning more emotional regulation skills. It is disappointing, but your husband needs to adjust his expectations. And as hard as the tantrums are, three is also a really fun year!
Anon says
I will just say I hated 3, it was the worst year of my kid’s life for me by far, but 4 has been soooo much better. Same sweetness and snuggles, same little kid joy and wonder at everything, far more emotional regulation and ability to be rational. So even if you don’t enjoy age 3 at all, just remember that it’s just a year.
Boston Legal Eagle says
Normal for 3. Big places with lots of people can be really overwhelming for toddlers. My then 3 year old had a hard time at Disneyland (the supposedly most magical place in the world for kids!) because it’s just a lot. Give him time. My 6 year old had a blast there. Having a tantrum at 3 is not by itself a sign of behavioral issues, although it is very difficult to deal with as a parent.
Anon says
We took my 3 year old to the zoo and when asked what his favorite part was, he said it was eating lunch. I wouldn’t even attempt a museum yet.
Anon says
Oh if you wait until they grow out of that, you’d never go anywhere. Mine is almost 5 and (most of the time) a delight to take to kid-oriented museums and the theater and things like that, but if you ask her what her favorite part is she always picks something really trivial. We took her on a trip to NYC and her favorite thing was seeing a revolving door for the first time. I read an article by someone who took his 8 year old to Antarctica and she said her favorite part was watching Frozen on the plane. Kids are easy to please!
Cb says
We took my husband’s cousins to the zoo once and I asked the daughter what her favourite animal was, expecting penguins, pandas, etc. Nope, the random pig.
GCA says
This sounds 100% normal for a newly 3yo, and is not about 1. what your husband is excited about 2. your & spouse’s parenting. And it’s not a sign of behavioral issues unless there’s something else going on we don’t know about. I have a very stubborn 4yo (sometimes I look at her and see my own childhood attitude staring back at me – uh oh!) and her entire 3-4 year was like this. She would do things but only on her own terms.
Pogo says
I think this is very normal for a 3yo and DH needs to adjust expectations.
Anonymous says
Your DH needs to learn to be a better father.
Passport Problems says
Cross posting from the main site:
While validating my kid’s recently issued passports, I realized that one of them HAS THE WRONG BIRTH DATE. I panicked and pulled up the application I submitted and the correct date is listed there. I checked the birth certificate and IT HAS THE WRONG BIRTH DATE listed.
Current situation is I have a few rounds of international travel planned and one child with a passport and birth certificate with the wrong freaking birth date. This kid was an uneventful scheduled c-section, so there’s no chance I’m losing my mind.
What do I do?? To add to the fun, I don’t live local to the state where the birth certificate was issued, so showing up in person isn’t an option. The first round of travel is within three months and the second in six months so I’m not super optimistic that any of this can be sorted in time. Do I just roll with it for now and fix it later? Fix it never? What would y’all do in this situation?
Pogo says
My honest answer would be to ignore it so you can travel, because it definitely won’t get flagged or anything if the birth certificate matches the passport as of right now.
After the fact, you can definitely get it changed. I know someone who had the time of birth changed because it was off by like 2 hours and she “wanted credit for those two hours of pushing” (lol but also crying face emoji). I would get it changed so you child’s future information all matches their actual DOB. You would call the town or city hall where the child was born to initiate the process and yes, I don’t expect it to be quick.
Anon says
The current passport shouldn’t be an issue for travel. The customs agents don’t have anything to cross-check it against, so they’ll just accept the passport as is with the wrong birthday.
I think you address the birth certificate issue now, and once the birth certificate issue is fixed and you have a correct birth certificate, you start the process of correcting the passports. I probably wouldn’t mess with the passports until you have ~6 months without any international travel planned.
Chl says
The other person’s reply was better but I am lazy and would probably just tell my kid they have a new birthday now.
Anon says
If it were my kid she would demand two celebrations so I wouldn’t tell her about the mistake for that reason :)
Boston Legal Eagle says
Yeah… I don’t know if I would change it?! So much hassle, ha. Is the kid old enough to be aware of their birthday?
Passport Problems says
Nope, not old enough to be focused on the particular date, just that it’s coming up. Plus, we’ve always flexed the day we celebrate their birthday to accommodate life so my kids have never been super focused on the date that we celebrate their birthday, just that it happens.
Anony says
I’d ignore it. My dad had a passport with the wrong birth date for 10 years (it got fixed on renewal) and it never caused any issues. I don’t remember the exact mistake, but my brother told me he found out there was some mistake on his birth certificate at 28 – so somehow he went 28 years without it causing any problems in his other documents.
Anonymous says
On the other hand, I had a double barreled last name on my birth certificate but only one of the last names was on my social security card, school records etc (both names were there but only one in the last name spot) and it was a huuuuuuuuuuuuge problem when I tried to renew my passport. Somehow it was not an issue in getting my first passport.
Vicky Austin says
Inspired, slightly, by the bad kid gifts thread, I have to ask the hive what TF to do with my husband’s babyhood cradle (yes, actual cradle) that my ILs brought to us when they visited. It’s cute and sturdy and just the right height for having baby right at our bedside, but also just the right height for our large, inquisitive, dirty Lab to get his face into, so I’m not sure it’ll work as baby’s primary sleeping spot. Beyond that, I have no ideas for how to use it, except as another place to put baby elsewhere in the house. Any other ideas?
SC says
My grandfather was a woodworker and hand-carved a cradle for me. But I never slept in it–not sure if that was for safety reasons, or if it was just an inconvenient height. My mom kept it in my room for a while to store dolls and stuffed animals. At some point, it didn’t make a move.
Vicky Austin says
That’s a cute idea! Thank you. This one is also handmade by a family member (I forget which of husband’s grandfathers), so I don’t want to just jettison it, at least not yet.
Isabella says
My mom and uncle applied moderate pressure to get the family cradle transported to my house before LB arrived and I AM SO, SO, GLAD THEY DID! It was the only place he would sleep for months. And it’s not even a nice heirloom, just 70s plywood with my grandpa’s goofy modifications. I’m 100% a convert to team cradle!
Vicky Austin says
No kidding! That’s great to know!
Bette says
How sweet! I’d keep it handy for at least the first few months – I was surprised by how many baby-stashing stations I had to create all over the house. Basically any room where I wanted to use both hands to do something, I needed a safe place to put the baby down. Cradle might be more useful than you think even as a backup station!
Boston Legal Eagle says
Random but to AwayEmily and anyone else looking for little kid board games – Monopoly Jr. has been a hit with my kids (6 and 4), and it’s not annoying for the parents either! There is some reading, but my 6 year old is able to read those cards with some help from us, and we managed a few games altogether over the weekend (there was one incident of the 4 year old throwing the game over in frustration – oops).
Anon says
You should try Sleeping Queens with your 6 yo. Ita fabulous. Sequence Jr is also a hit in our house.
AwayEmily says
Ooooo nice, adding to my cart right now. Thanks!
Anon says
Is this meaningfully different than regular Monopoly? Wondering if we could just try to introduce my 5 year old to the regular game we already own.