This post may contain affiliate links and CorporetteMoms may earn commissions for purchases made through links in this post. As an Amazon Associate, I earn from qualifying purchases.
I think of mules as sandals for the office.
This structured, almond-toe mule from Frame is made from a rich brown leather with an eye-catching crisscross detail. In addition to being office-friendly, its low one-inch heel makes it perfect for commuters. Wear it with a flowy midi skirt or airy wide-leg pants for an outfit that will take you right into air-conditioner season.
These mules are $275 at Nordstrom and available in most sizes 5.5–11 (quantities are limited for some sizes).
A more affordable option for a brown almond-toe mule is from Sam Edelman; it’s $140 at SamEdelman.com and also comes in sizes 5–11.
Sales of note for 4.18.24
(See all of the latest workwear sales at Corporette!)
- Ann Taylor – 50% off full-price dresses, jackets & shoes; $30 off pants & skirts; extra 50% off sale styles
- Banana Republic Factory – Up to 50% off everything; extra 20% off purchase
- Eloquii – 50% off select styles; 60% off swim; up to 40% off everything else
- J.Crew – Mid-Season Sale: Extra 60% off sale styles; up to 50% off spring-to-summer styles
- Lands’ End – 30% off full-price styles
- Loft – Spring Mid-Season Sale: Up to 50% off 100s of styles
- Nordstrom: Free 2-day shipping for a limited time (eligible items)
- Talbots – Spring Sale: 40% off + extra 15% off all markdowns; 30% off new T by Talbots
- Zappos – 29,000+ women’s sale items! (check out these reader-favorite workwear brands on sale, and some of our favorite kids’ shoe brands on sale)
Kid/Family Sales
- Carter’s – Up to 70% off baby items; 50% off toddler & kid deals & 40% off everything else
- Hanna Andersson – Up to 50% off spring faves; 25% off new arrivals; up to 30% off spring
- J.Crew Crewcuts – Up to 60% off sale styles; up to 50% off kids’ spring-to-summer styles
- Old Navy – 30% off your purchase; up to 75% off clearance
- Target – Car Seat Trade-In Event (ends 4/27); BOGO 25% off select skincare products; up to 40% off indoor furniture; up to 20% off laptops & printers
Waffles says
What makes you feel chic?
Here are my things:
Applying Dior nail glow to my toenails.
Putting lotion on all over before leaving the house (I know, this should be a daily thing, but… it just isn’t).
Wearing a matching bra and underwear set (another thing that maybe should be basic, but is a rarity in my world).
Putting on jewelry (beginning to see a pattern here…).
A fresh haircut that I actually like.
What makes you feel chic? Thanks in advance!
Cb says
Oof I don’t think I’ve felt chic in quite some time. I think a great coat and scarf makes me feel chic. And a good swishy hair day.
Anon says
Having my nails done, for sure.
Anne-on says
A thoughtfully chosen outfit (including shoes and accessories) – I try, but this happens rarely during work at home as ‘working’ at home usually also includes child and pet duties that make wearing my ‘good’ work clothes impractical.
Blush, mascara, and some eye makeup
Hair styled and behaving itself (vs. scraped back in a claw clip as it is 80% of the time)
Anonymous says
Wearing mascara
Having a professional pedicure
Showering before 1PM ;)
Anonymous says
Mascara and eyeliner
A professional manicure, which will never happen again now that I WFH and never travel and am always cleaning and doing dishes
Wearing a dress, even a t-shirt dress
In general, wearing any outfit that is appropriate to the occasion, current in style, well-fitting, and not shabby
A good haircut that can stand up to humidity
Nice glasses
Nice sunglasses
Activities also make me feel chic:
Dining on a patio
Doing a fun trendy workout, yoga or Les Mills or Burn Boot Camp or any type of HIIT with loud music. When I used to go to group fitness at the Y one of the instructors would yell “this is how rich people work out!” which always made me smile.
Sitting outdoors with an iced coffee, which I am currently doing while attempting to work
Pogo says
heels and a nice bag.
Anon says
Painting my fingernails (rarely if ever happens because I have no patience for chips and I usually chip within the first 24 hours, but my toes are always painted and that’s up there with daily showering as a life-requirement for me)
Hair not in a messy topknot
Wearing a pretty maxi dress
Wearing my favorite “natural but better” color lipstick
Eating outdoors in a pretty dress where the weather is warm enough for no coats but cool enough to not sweat (all of like 5 days where I live).
If helpful, things that make me feel decidedly not chic even though you might think they would:
– wearing makeup (too worried about it smearing, rubbing off on my husband or kid, feeling heavy)
– wearing necklaces, bracelets, dangly earrings or rings other than my wedding band (feels heavy, worried about my kid yanking on it or myself catching it on something or it falling off, now that I’m 5 years into bare minimum jewelry after having a grabby kid who still climbs all over me)
– wearing clothes that are fitted, particularly if they do not have stretch, like a suit jacket, sheath dress, structured top, etc. (I like to be able to freely move and not be restricted)
– wearing high heels (in theory great, in practice I have never found a pair of heels that was truly comfortable, even if some are most definitely less comfortable than others and the pain ruins the chic factor for me)
AwayEmily says
Wearing a pencil skirt with a shirt tucked in, and flats.
Anonymous says
This used to be my go-to work outfit, and I am now realizing that I haven’t worn it in ~4 years. Even pre-pandemic, my office location moved from HQ to a super casual, over-air conditioned satellite, and I switched to 90% jeans. boo
Elle says
Coming over from the main site, my 12 year old niece asked me to read a book that she has read because the ending confused her. I’ve read it and agree that the ending is disjointed but I understood what the author was going for. I’m seeing her again in a few weeks, what is the right balance of explaining versus asking her to take the lead? I would love to keep reading books with her so I don’t want to mess it up.
avocado says
How awesome! When discussing literature with tweens and teens I like to focus on asking questions rather than explaining. If they are confused or missing the point I tend to use more leading questions to get them to come up with an answer (not necessarily the “correct” answer, but an answer) on their own. Don’t just focus on getting her to understand the ending; take the opportunity to get her thoughts on the book as a whole. You can sometimes, but not always, find good conversation starters by searching “[title] book club guide,” “[title] discussion questions,” and “[title] discussion guide.”
Mainly, avoid lecturing and don’t overthink it. What a fantastic way to connect with your niece, and how nice that she reached out to you!
Anon says
I’m the Anon st 9:20 below. And per usual someone else said it better than I did! +1 to all of this.
Anon says
This is so thoughtful of you! I’d say just listen more than you speak. You can ask leading questions, for sure, to help her get to what you think the answer is, but mostly, just talking about it with her is great IMO. What book is it? So curious.
Anon says
Was it The Giver? There’s a long-standing debate about whether the kid dies or not at the end (the author I believe wrote another book later featuring the same character, implying he didn’t die, but I still maintain it was written as he did).
To answer the original question, I don’t think you can mess this conversation up! She clearly already values your opinion. I think just asking her thoughts, sharing yours, acknowledging the confusion and why it might be that way is all good. And tell her you enjoy reading what she’s reading too!
Cb says
I’m team you on this one, the kid definitely died.
And OP, I love this, you are clearly such a trusted, supportive figure in her life!
Anonymous says
He obviously lived!
Spirograph says
oooh I should re-read the Giver, it was one of my favorite books in elementary school. I thought he lived, but left the community. I wonder if I would interpret it differently as an adult.
Anne-on says
I agree with everyone else on asking questions and listening vs. talking. But it also might be appropriate to talk literary criticism with her – at that age I thought if you were a published author your books were automatically ‘good’. It took until late middle school/early high school before teachers discussed how sometimes we read books that had weren’t ‘great’ or had weaknesses because of other pieces – they illustrated a theme well, or the author did a great job of writing dialgoue, or it’s a prime example of a specific genre, or the author was influenced by historical events at the time, or the author was the first (not always best) of a specific movement/trend. Same thing in art – we studied pieces where they got perspective right for the first time in early renaissance art (even if the rest of the piece wasn’t very techincally good).
Anon says
Agree – I think it’s a great opportunity to 1) validate her perspective that the story was kind of confusing and 2) demonstrate that adults don’t know everything bc you were also unsure what it means and then 3) discuss together what it could mean.
Also it may be that this was just her way to connect with you and it’s a bid for time/attention, so you should feel very special! Maybe couod continue the conversation by planning an outing to the library or a book store?
AnonMom says
We spent some time with another family this weekend and I am really concerned about their older son. This 8 year old alternated between being an outright bully to the other kids around and completely melting down at the slightest rejection (when the other kids politely decided to play a different game than one he suggested, he sat in a corner crying and hitting himself saying “nobody likes me, I’m bad”). This was ignored by his mother as normal behavior that he would grow out of. He also spent some time pulling wings off flies and tearing worms in half for fun. When he asked his parents for something to do, they handed him a phone and he played video games for hours while the other kids ran around outside. We haven’t seen this family much since the pandemic and the kid’s behavior has really changed since then — he previously was a really sweet, if hypersensitive, kid. He’s not in any sort of therapy and it was clear that his parents are not concerned about his behavior at all. If you observed this, would you do anything? I feel like my spidey sense was going off that this kid is on a tough path, but I don’t know what resources might exist. I’m close enough to my friend to have a tough conversation if need be.
Anon says
The parents might be concerned and might not be sharing their concerns with you. If other children are getting hurt (physically or emotionally), you are not wrong to say something, but don’t be so quick to judge the parents.
AnonMom says
I guarantee they are not concerned. Not just because of what they said to me, but others present who spend more regular time with the family know that to be true. The boy’s family has always overshared, so I am confident that if they were concerned, everyone would be aware.
Anon says
That is not something you can ‘guarantee’.
If you don’t enjoy being around this child, don’t hang out with them. You have an obligation to protect your own kids. But you really don’t know what’s going on beyond the scenes in the family and I think you’re majorly leaping to conclusions here.
Anon says
+1. We are dealing with some issues (not these, but issues) for a similar age. I can assure you, I do not discuss them with everyone, including some of my best friends. My kid deserves more than adding to any gossiping stigma. I really only talk about it to a select couple of close friends that I know factually are going through similar so we don’t all don’t feel alone and can share advice.
Spirograph says
This is such a weird assertion, to me. Do you talk with other friends about the child of this friend when she is not present? I talk with my husband about our friends and their kids, but I can’t imagine talking to friends A, B and C, about friend D’s parenting/kids.
As has been discussed here on a few occasions, people get less comfortable talking about their kids’ challenges as the kids get older because it is not their story to tell anymore. The fact that friend was vocal about potty training, sleep issues, or preK behavior does not mean that she will be equally open about an 8 year old’s struggles.
Anne-on says
This. I’ve been asked by my kid NOT to tell other parents about his diagnoses because he feels it’s private and is very sensitive around it. His teachers know obviously but it isn’t something I talk about with other close parent friends who have kids he interacts with. At some point it’s more his story than mine and I respect that.
Anonymous says
This. I have a kid who got a late-in-life diagnosis and it explained a lot to us. It is also incredibly stigmatizing and people who are otherwise ultra-woke will make horrible comments about people with this condition. You sort of earn my level of candor and unearn it and it is generally no one’s business (and yes, kid is old enough to have a say).
When you have a non-vanilla kid, you KNOW. I trust that they do and they are choosing not to tell you anything about it.
Anonymous says
“When you have a non-vanilla kid, you KNOW. I trust that they do and they are choosing not to tell you anything about it.”
THIS. And I would be beyond annoyed if a friend with seemingly vanilla kids came at me with suggestions I hadn’t asked for. A general expression of concern/support is fine, but leave it there unless she explicitly invites you to come on this journey with her.
Anonymous says
I personally wouldn’t say anything but if they suggested hanging out again I would say no, and explain it was because their son’s behavior made me uncomfortable
Spirograph says
The only thing you should say to your friend is “how are you doing?” or if you want to be slightly more bold “my kids have had a tough time the last couple of years, how has [son] handled it?” or “[son] sure has grown up a lot in the last couple of years, I still think of him as a sweet little 6 year old!” or maybe “I was concerned about [son] the other day because he seemed really upset, I hope he’s having a better day today”
That gives your friend an opening if she wants to talk about any challenges she or the son are going through specifically, but for all you know, you saw him on a day where he was overtired or hungry or whatever. I would not read too much into this based on a one-off observation.
Anonymous says
+1 to this. There are so many possibilities for what could be going on behind the scenes.
Anonanonanon says
This, or if it’s a super close friend I wouldn’t hesitate to say “(kid) seemed to be having a tough time last weekend, is everything OK?” You’ll be able to tell from her reaction how much/little she wants to share.
Anonymous says
If this kid were fat, would you have this same level of “concern”? A lot of what you’re describing is out of the parents’ control. They may or may not be managing his behaviors. Feel free to not hang out with them if you think it’s affecting your kids. But you need to keep your gossiping about it limited to anonymous online boards.
Anon says
+1
Anonymous says
Who lets their kid go around ripping worms in half for funsies? They were clearly not managing that behavior. I have less of an issue with the video games when he is bored and not getting on with the other kids in an awkward social situation. Getting upset when the other kids don’t want to play the game you want and sulking a bit is also normal.
Spirograph says
Did you really never cut worms in half as a kid? I never ripped off fly wings because there’s no way I could catch a fly, but I definitely chopped worms in half with a shovel with my siblings & neighbors. And pinched them in half with my bare hands when I was using them as fishing bait. This is not a behavior I would feel the need to “manage.” It’s not like he’s killing kittens!
This thread stuck with me all morning. It makes me really uncomfortable that all of these behaviors are within the range of perfectly normal, and after observing (by her own admission) a single afternoon with a family she’s seen very infrequently in the last 2-3 years, OP knows everything about how they parent and wants to stage an intervention. I would never want anyone to bury their head in the sand and ignore signs of abuse and neglect, but if you know the parents and believe them to be pro-social, responsible adults, why not assume that they know their kid and their situation 1,000x better than you do as a casual observer and trust them to handle it like pro-social, responsible adults?
Anonymous says
Yeah, I thought all kids cut worms in half to see what would happen!
AnonMom says
It wasn’t a single afternoon, it was upwards of 20 hours over several days, and the behaviors I describe were part of a clear pattern. Maybe it was catching him in a rough patch. It’s just really hard to see a kid self-flagellating and watch the parents literally shrug and ignore him, without offering any comfort. Also hard to watch another kid bully your and other kids (and his little brother, though there are obviously sibling dynamics at play there) and watch the parents not engage at all to redirect his behavior or step in. Literally every other kid’s parent at some point had to step in and protect their child from hurtful words or physical aggression. So yes, there were some raised eyebrows among the other parents and short exchanges about how this kid is having a really hard time playing well with others.
I like your suggestion to come from a place of empathy and I appreciate your perspective.
Anon says
Exactly.
Anonymous says
Pretty sure that cutting worms in half was a middle school science lab project. I don’t think I would’ve been able to catch a fly, either, but I know I thoroughly examined 17-year cicadas at around 8 or so. The video games probably wouldn’t worry me, either, since it very well could be that the parents wanted to focus on spending time with friends and felt that their kid’s boredom wasn’t a battle worth fighting that day.
Bullying and hitting himself saying “nobody likes me, I’m bad” would raise a bit of a red flag for me, but if this isn’t a family you’ve seen recently, I’m not sure it’s possible to do much more than say, “Hey, it was great seeing you all the other day. Seemed like Joey was having a rough day, hope he’s doing better today/hope everything’s ok.”
Anonymous says
oh god, if the kid was expected to be “on” for 20 hours with a bunch of other kids and parents in the course of a weekend, I actually would give him more grace for this. I’m an introvert and this is my idea of h3ll. Does he need to learn better coping skills? yeah, because he’s 8.
FVNC says
I disagree that expressing concern over external behavior that potentially affects other kids is the same as expressing concern over a child’s weight. That said, I agree with Spirograph’s approach(es) above. Since this is a super close friend, ask how she and her family are doing! It’s okay to show concern, and sometimes an outside perspective is helpful.
SC says
I disagree. My son exhibits some of the same behaviors at various times. Maybe he’ll grow out of those behaviors to some extent. But this kid is hitting himself and saying he’s bad. He’s internalizing the other kids’ reactions to his behavior as something negative about him, not just something negative about his behavior. He’s also taking those negative feelings out on other kids (bullying) and animals. He needs helps (age appropriate therapy) to both differentiate the person from the behavior and to manage his feelings and behaviors.
So, I’d say this is more the equivalent of an overweight child self-punishing, harming others, and engaging in negative self-talk over his food choices.
I like Spirograph’s and Anonanonanon’s suggestions above for reaching out to the parents without overstepping.
Anon says
My daughter is going through puberty and is feeling all the feelings. A major source of friction has been that her friends’ parents are more permissive than our family, and we do not allow daughter to do all the things her friends do. Any tips for how to navigate? There are a few things we’ve compromised on but we’ve reached our limit (until she gets older/more mature).
Anon says
The best advice I have for you is to know there’s always going to be friction and you can try not to play into in but can’t avoid it. The whole point of teen years is to gain independence which results in rebelling against parents. Try not to take it personally, try not to escalate the fight, try not to dig your heels in for no reason, but also know that you’re doing the right thing by keeping reasonable boundaries in place.
Anonymous says
Something that stuck with me from the Girlology seminar I attended with my daughter: People blame “hormones” for all of the emotions tween and teen girls have, but it’s actually caused by the massive brain development that’s going on during this time. I like this idea because it’s so easy for adults, especially men, to dismiss girls’ feelings as “just hormones.”
As always, I will plug the book Untangled by Lisa Damour as the best guide to parenting tween and teen girls.
Anonymous says
Oh man, my dad dismissed every single emotion I had as a pre-teen and teen as “just hormones” and it was so, so damaging to our relationship.
Anonymous says
I think you treat her like the almost adult she is and explain why things are not permitted, and listen to her arguments for why they should be. And try to find common ground where you can.
And also look for opportunities you can say yes to. Is there an activity you could support her being more involved in? Opportunities for socialization outside of school?
Because for sure all she cares about is not being left behind by her friends, and at that age it’s a real worry.
Anonymous says
This. If you let her make as many of her own choices as possible it will be easier to say no when it really matters. During lockdown I had success giving my tween more responsibility to plan and execute chores and projects independently. It gave her a feeling of autonomy and self-efficacy that counteracted the restrictions to some degree. Sleepaway camp or a job will usually have the same effect.
anon says
What kinds of things isn’t she allowed to do and why? Have you explained to her the why?
Anon says
It’s okay to say “in our family we do/believe X. Other families make different choices.” Something that I’m trying to work on, based on advice from mothers farther down the path, is to intentionally create a family culture. The rules and beliefs, yes, but also the good, fun, quirky, bonding things about your family. Your daughter will surely push back on rules, but ultimately boundaries make toddlers and teenagers feel secure – especially if it’s grounded in a true loving and secure family.
Anonymous says
It is ok, but a teenager isn’t likely to listen to a fancy version of “because I said so” with any real respect.
Anon says
Agred but did she say she had a teenager? Kids can go through puberty starting around 9 these days.
Anonymous says
Oh good point!
Anne-on says
This, I got my period at 11 and was in puberty at 10. Certain ethnic groups also tend to develop earlier.
Pogo says
eh, I remember being super angry around age 12-13 that my friends who lived in the rich part of town could walk to school and shops and had money to buy their own stuff at said shops. My mom explained, we are not moving across town so that you can hang out with your friends, and I still pouted. I was a kid, and I had no idea the full picture of real estate, SAHMs, and generational wealth that led to some of my friends having a different lifestyle. I think a certain amount of “because I said so” is ok when you know the kid is not going to accept reason and/or “life is unfair”.
Anon says
This.
Anonymous says
Yep. Otherwise what are you going to do, let the child run the household?
Anonanonanon says
If your reasoning is based on safety concerns, my mom usually told me exactly why she felt that way and what she was worried would happen. I didn’t always respect it at the moment, but I’d remember the stories when I reached a decision point and it usually led to more responsible decision making. She was an ER nurse, so she had a horror story for everything lol.
Anon says
yesterday i told my 4 year old she could accompany me to run some errands, and she didn’t understand why were getting in the car and not running…love how literally she took it. i also then took her into a clothing store to return something with me, maybe for the first time in 3+ years, and she kept saying “wow. this is interesting” and we rode an escalator, which she found petrifying. this is one of the things I find fun about having kids – seeing the world through their eyes
Anon says
Yes my 4 year old takes things hilariously literally too. I used the expression “you’re pulling my leg” in front of her for the first time recently and she’s like “no mommy I didn’t touch your leg at all!” We also have a major fear of escalators over here. It’s frustrating because we travel a lot and airports are filled with them.
Cb says
Ugh, we have escalator fear as well, which is problematic because our commute involves an escalator into the train station… he’s ok if you hold him but he’s nearly 5 and with work stuff…
My grown up husband has elevator fear so we’re all a mess around here.
Cornellian says
Hahah this weekend I took my 5 year old to return a dress in person at Nordstrom at a mall. I’m not a mall shopper but it seemed easier than mailing back. He kept being like “This doesn’t look like a store!” and “why is the building so big?” “Why is the parking lot so big and empty?” I realized he’d never been inside a mall! It’s actually hard to explain what a mall is to someone who’s not familiar!
Cb says
Ha! Sometimes I fantasize about taking my Scottish-born child to Target and watching his little brain EXPLODE! He can confidently navigate through a train station, picking out our train on the departures board, but he’s not had that classic American suburb experience.
Pogo says
We took our kiddo to buy something at the Lego store for a friend’s birthday and he was blown away by the mall. He wanted to keep riding the escalator over and over.
Spirograph says
She might really enjoy the Amelia Bedelia books — Amelia takes all kinds of idioms literally to hilarious effect.
I agree that one of the most fun things about having kids is seeing the world through their eyes! One of my favorite things these days is asking my 5 year old to recap chapter books that we’ve read/listened to together. 1. he has a much better memory than I was expecting, and 2. the things that he thinks are important or worth including in a summary are VERY different from what an adult would take away.
OP says
yes, I literally thought of Amelia Bedelia when she said that. I will have to get some of those from the library for her
Anonymous says
My issue with Amelia Bedelia is that the idioms were outdated even when I was a kid! Dressing a chicken? Dusting powder? Putting out the lights?
Anonymous says
They do require explaining but I have never heard my child laugh as much as reading the first Amelia Bedelia at age 5. And maybe we are old fashioned but I do still say dress a chicken or trim a steak!
So Anon says
I took my son with me to vote when he was about that age (pre-pandemic), and I told him we were going to vote and that other people were also voting at the high school. As soon as we walked out of the high school, he burst into tears. He thought we were going boating. Standing in line to fill in a few bubbles is such a let down compared to being on a boat!
Anonymous says
When one of my kids was young I told her we were going to vote for the president. She thought there was a Present.
Allie says
I had a similar experience taking my 3 and 5 year olds to TJ Maxx a few months ago — they were amazed that a store could have clothes! toys! housewares! weird food! Just totally amazed. Pandemic kids . . . .
Anonymous says
I took my toddler to pick up pre-ordered plants last weekend. She had a meltdown the whole way home because she thought we were actually going to plant them at the pickup location, and not drive them home. Guess she wanted to dig in the dirt somewhere other than our yard or daycare for a change! Pandemic kid hasn’t really figured out the concept of errands, yet.
Anon says
I know this has been discussed before but now that I’m at this place, what the heck: how and when did you decide you were done having kids?
I’m pretty/definitely/maybe sure we’re done with two but I also keep playing through the “what ifs”. My husband is #3, my sister who I’m so close to is #3 etc etc.
Anonymous says
I desperately wanted more children after my first. Four years later we had twins who don’t sleep, and I’m definitely done. My oldest is angling for a sister and I told him we could get a girl dog. I love all three of them but each one is a handful in a different way. I could not effectively parent one more. And we have a lot of financial resources to make up for lack of family help. I guess my advice to you is hang out with friends and acquaintances who have more kids than you. Even my friends who are good parents seem a bit overwhelmed. And the heart wants what it wants. If you feel like you could handle a high needs child and all that entails, and your spouse is on board, go for it.
Anonymous says
I remember the exact moment when I knew I was done. It happened while I was pregnant. It was a 100+-degree day in July and I had to sit down in the middle of walking downstairs to avoid passing out and/or vomiting, possibly both at the same time.
My husband came to his own realization gradually over several years as his unrealistic expectations of what parenthood would be like were gradually dispelled by reality. Modern life with two working parents is much different than being a dad decades ago with oodles of money, a stay-home wife, and full-time hired household help.
Anon says
Probably doesn’t help you, but as a data point I’m an only child and never wanted more than one. I saw the balance my parents had between getting to experience parenthood but still getting to largely keep their pre-kid lives and I wanted that for myself. I do think in a utopia where I had unlimited money and didn’t have to work (ha), I might have a second because the experience of parenting is so different if you can have a night nurse, bring a nanny whenever you travel, have tons of time to yourself because you’re a SAHM with a housekeeper and lots of childcare, etc. But that’s not how we (or most people) live, obviously.
AwayEmily says
We thought we were probably done after two (75% sure), then changed our mind. I knew from about halfway through my pregnancy with our third that this was definitely it, our family was complete. I have not wavered since. To be fair I was also 41 so there were biological reasons a fourth would have been harder. Anyway, is just waiting for awhile an option? Our first two are 19 months apart, but there’s 4 years between our second and third — it took us that long to figure it out.
Pogo says
I wish I knew. We go back and forth all the time. The day to day is a slog but every night we lay in bed and tell each other all the cute/funny things the kids did that day, and they’re growing so fast… how can this really be “the last” for everything? I can’t bring myself to donate anything in good condition that I would potentially use for a 3rd.
I know for me 3 would mean another few years of really tough juggling, but I also (hope) it gets easier as they get older and in retrospect it won’t feel like it was that long?
I should add I am privileged in that we could swing it financially and reproductively (frozen embryos waiting). It’s really a matter of how many more years of sleepless nights and incessant whining can we take in exchange for the most awesome, adorable kiddos we could have asked for.
anonM says
Pogo, this is pretty much how I feel! Let me know how you end up deciding, ha!
Anon says
I’m the anon below who is pregnant with my third. We thought 4, but after this pregnancy, nope. Three it is. With 2, I just felt like there was someone missing from our family and I was really eager to have another one, even knowing that we’d be losing sleep and it would be logistically more difficult.
Boston Legal Eagle says
The older my kids get, the less I want to go back to the pregnancy/b-feeding/sleepless night stage. And some things get easier when they’re older, but now I’m thinking about the logistics of their various activities and future school drama, and it just feels like too much. My kids’ personalities are so different and my oldest is pretty “spirited,” so I struggle a lot with how best to parent them. I like the idea of a big family in theory, but I think I’m at my own personal emotional capacity. With a third, I think we’d have to hire a nanny, or at least someone else to help out in the evenings and weekends, and I just don’t know if we’re that family (not everyone with 3 kids is, obviously, but just my own situation).
GCA says
This is me, too – I don’t want to go back to the pregnancy and no-sleep stage.
My kids are 3+ years apart and already they’re in quite different places with activities and logistics. And I want to be present to parent the kids I have — one is high-energy, the other is…uh… very 3. Plus I look at my kids getting along (well, the 60% of the time they are sweet to each other) and I wouldn’t change that dynamic. When did I know for sure? When I got to hold or see friends’ new babies and be happy for my friends, yet relieved the babies aren’t mine!
NYCer says
Same here. In a different version of my life, I might have three or four kids, but now that my younger daughter is 3, I have a hard time envisioning starting again.
Anonymous says
I’m at the same place but with one kid. 95% sure we’re one and done after multiple miscarriages and an extremely traumatic pandemic pregnancy and postpartum experience. Unfortunately, kiddo has reached the age where people think it’s reasonable to ask when we’re going to have another, and every time we vaguely say we’re not sure OR something like how we feel that our family is complete/we’re not having another, everyone (even close friends who know exactly what we went through) says we’ll regret it/it’s selfish to only have one (even though they know I’m an only child and DH doesn’t get along at all with his sister)/all newborns are hard, we start to second guess ourselves. Time is not on our side at this point, so while we might have another if we could wait 4 years, we’ll probably just never get around to deciding to go for it.
Anonymous says
We knew we wanted 2-4. I’d just had my second and she was TOUGH. Still is. We decided to go for #3 before things got easy with #2 or we’d never want to go back and revisit the baby years.
Fwiw our 3rd is the stereotypical low key easy going 3rd child. She taught herself to swim and her sisters taught her how to ride a bike. She tells me how beautiful I am all the time in the most sincere voice. DH calls her the “victory lap of parenting.” ;)
Spirograph says
My 3rd is like this too!
I “always” envisioned my family having 3-4 kids. DH was done after 3, so that meant I was done after 3. I wasn’t at peace with it until my youngest was around three years old. Two things happened then: pandemic, and (aside from pandemic life) it noticeably easier when all kids were potty trained and did not need constant close supervision. I couldn’t imagine going back to wrangling an infant.
Now that the youngest is turning 6 in a few months and we’re pulled in a million directions with career, hobbies/activities, kid & partner emotional needs, etc, I can see that DH was right that we wouldn’t have been able to be the people & parents we want to be with a 4th kid; there just aren’t enough hours in the day. (This is not at all to say that 4 kids is a wrong decision for everyone, but it would have been a wrong decision for us.) If you can be very clear-eyed about your priorities and your limits, that will get you a long way to the answer. If both you and your partner want another kid just because that’s what your heart is telling you, and you don’t have a solid reason to say no, I’d go for it.
Anony says
We are deciding by officially not deciding. We didn’t go into parenthood with a family size goal – we wanted to have a baby and figured after we had one, we would decide if we wanted another. It turned out that getting pregnant was very difficult for us, and we eventually conceived our child through IVF. Before, our family felt incomplete to me – it felt like missing someone I had never met. Infertility and IVF sucked, pregnancy and delivery sucked, and my postpartum experience was kind of traumatic. I really love being a parent – and I now feel complete and fulfilled and not like I’m missing anyone anymore, so I don’t really want to do those things again, especially if it would mean sacrificing any time with my existing family. We aren’t officially closing the door to changing our minds, but I’m also okay with the idea that time has possibly closed it for me already or will soon.
Anonymous says
We were pretty sure we wanted 2 from the start. Then I had three rough high-nausea high-exhaustion pregnancies (one early 2nd tri miscarriage) with a really terrifying delivery for my second kid and there is no way I’m doing THAT again.
Anon says
I’m 20 weeks pregnant w/ my third kid. We just found out the sex and it’s the same as our other 2 kids. How do we deal w/ the comments of “how sad, didn’t you want a XX/XY instead?” I’ve been replying that we love our 2 kids and can’t wait to have another to add to our family. The complication here for me is that this pregnancy was so different from my first two that I had basically convinced myself that it must be the other sex. So, I’m still kind of processing that while dealing with the obnoxious comments. And this pregnancy has been so physically tough on me that I know I’m totally done after this. To be clear – I am super happy to be pregnant and adding a third kid to our family and none of these comments are coming from my husband. He’s awesome.
anonM says
My mom still remembers these types of comments with irritation, so totally understand your desire to think of some responses ahead of time. If me, I’d be sarcastic/sort of funny. “Yes, SO SAD. I ought to just return him/her!” or “SO SAD, let me call up *higher entity of your religion* and change my order! Something must have been messed up in the paperwork!”
Spirograph says
I like this. These people are probably just making conversation, and don’t actually mean to imply you only wanted a third kid if it was the opposite sex. As long as your delivery as the appropriate amount of wink, and you quickly pivot to a different topic, this registers that the comment was unoriginal and slightly obnoxious but doesn’t shut down the conversation. (Although if you *do* want to shut down the conversation, the right delivery would do that!)
Best wishes for a healthy pregnancy and baby #3, and a third use out of all the kids clothes!
Anonymous says
This. These comments are just silly and thoughtless, and a lighthearted response is the easiest way to make that point and move on.
Anon says
my friend dealt with something very similar. she had two boys and then was pregnant with her third boy. someone else i know had two girls and they decided to go for #3 bc both mom and dad came from families where kid 1 and 2 were girls and #3 was a boy and figured theirs would be the same, but they are pregnant with girl #3. depending on the person and your relationship with them – “given how different my pregnancy has been, I was initially a bit surprised, but we are all super excited to have a gaggle of girls or to see the brother relationships grow.” you could also leave out the pregnancy part of the response and just say, “we are so excited to have another X. our current two love each other so much and we already have all of the stuff”. but really people should just keep their thoughts to themselves. when people heard i was pregnant with twins, everyone wanted to know if they were natural…and while i knew what they were getting at (which is none of their business), i kind of wanted to respond, no they are synthetic
Anonymous says
Don’t tell people. Why would you invite criticism or comment? What are you having? A baby! Can’t wait to meet it!
anonM says
Omg, we did this with our first, and us knowing but not telling others (until the shower) invited all kinds of criticism and comment as well! Don’t recommend it.
Anonymous says
“It’s a surprise!”
Anon says
Yeah this makes people so mad! It definitely won’t shut down the comments.
OPAnon says
Hmm, I would love to do this; unfortunately the kids know and they are way too excited to keep quiet about it. But if they aren’t around, this could work.
DLC says
I think depending on level of snark I feel, I would give the classic Carolyn Hax response of “Oh, interesting. Why would you say that?”
But also, I think I’ve come to realize that gender can’t be something that I get to define for my child, so I think if the situation felt right, I would point that out. “Yeah, who knows what this baby will be when they grow up!”
But yes, agree with above that the easiest way to deal is not to disclose- I think it’s okay to process something for yourself before opening it up to the world!
AwayEmily says
I don’t have any good advice but WOW people are so thoughtless. Sorry you have to deal with this. FWIW I think you are well within your rights to say something that subtly underlines how insensitive they are being, like “Actually, this pregnancy has been really tough so I’m just happy that the baby’s doing well.” (tho of course you may not want to disclose that to people you don’t know well!)
Pogo says
It’s insane, we have two of the same and even casual work friends who I normally love are asking me when we’ll try for a third so we can get the girl. I get that it’s conversation but ugh. cmon.
Anon says
The easiest answer to those comments is “We’re going to save a fortune on hand-me-downs. It’s awesome we’re having another ____!” It’s suitably trite and undeniable, and immediately shifts the conversation to a discussion of baby and kid gear.
Mary Moo Cow says
When she found out we were having our second girl, my MIL said, “Oh, I’m sorry if you wanted a boy.” DH said, over his shoulder as he walked away, “We didn’t.” I got a few “aren’t you going to try for the boy?” comments. People gonna people. When walking away wasn’t an option, I thought, bless your heart, and smiled and said we simply were happy to be welcoming a healthy baby who had the best big sister a kid could ask for. No one pushed it past that.
Katarina says
I said that the first two are so great I would be thrilled to have another like them. My youngest is three and I still get a lot of these kinds of comments.
Anon says
We’re considering becoming a one car family. We live in a suburban area with nothing within walking distance of our house except a park/playground, so this isn’t something we would have thought of before the pandemic, but I now work 100% from home and my husband works from home three days a week in the school year and all summer so it seems like we could manage it. Has anyone done this? The biggest issue I foresee is when my husband or I travel solo we’ll either need to take a shuttle to the airport or have the other person drop us off, but I don’t think that will be a huge deal because it doesn’t happen very frequently.
Anonymous says
How many kids do you have? We have only ever had one car. We have 3 kids and now that the oldest (6) and middle (4) are both getting into activities, there are times I wish we had a second. For example, the other day, kiddo 1 had sports and kiddo 2 had a play date, at the same time. I ended up walking to the play date and DH picked us up after, but I’m envisioning more and more similar conflicts as kids get older.
Spirograph says
How many children do you have and how old are they? We were a one car family pre-kids, but unless you have good public transit or your kids do zero extracurriculars, I think it would be really hard to make this work. No harm in trying it out, though!
OP says
Sorry should have mentioned. Only one kid who is 4 and currently in daycare at my husband’s office. Next year will be in K about a mile from our house.
Cb says
Can you walk/scoot/cycle there? We do a mile ride to school everyday and honestly, I think that exercise is great for his focus and attention.
OP says
Yes, the hope is that we will walk or scoot to elementary school in decent weather, but we live in the upper Midwest so it won’t be possible year-round. We also have another year of daycare to get through first and that’s not scooting distance from home (but it’s at my husband’s work, so he can easily do both drop off and pickup on the days he goes into the office).
Anonymous says
So say your husband is at work with the car and you’re home working. Do you want to walk a mile to school to pick up a sick kid? And then walk home with them in the middle of the day?
OP says
In that circumstance, my husband would have to bring the kid home, but I think he’s fine doing that since it would only be two days a week and the other three days I would manage it. That’s roughly how we divide sick kid care even with two cars.
anonamommy says
We have one car and are in a dense suburb of DC. DH drives in 2 days a week, so very similar to you. If DH can’t pick up kiddo from aftercare then I walk the mile there. The hardest days for us are days when kiddo has an activity that starts shortly after school ends and DH isn’t home yet — these days are rare but they do happen. We have a spare booster seat to be able to use Uber/Lyft easily.
Summer days also require extra planning. Like if I want to take kiddo to a birthday party for 2 hours, everyone needs to be in agreement that other errands can’t be done at that time, or we need to plan ahead. Not impossible, but something to be aware of. There are way more social activities in K then there ever were in preschool.
Anonymous says
I think this is doable with planning. We live in a similar situation and my comparison is that during the summer, we have our nanny drive one of our cars, so we always leave it available. Typically what we do is the following: (1) DH works in the office in the AM so has the car; (2) DH works from home in the afternoon and the car is mine. This works becuase I work 100% from home except a few days every quarter when I drive to my office 3 hours away. On those days, DH either didn’t plan to use the car or just coordinated with nanny. It also works because DH’s schedule is fairly flexible. I’d encourage you to just try it for 1-2 months. Don’t use one of the cars and see how it goes.
Anon says
so we were a one car family and went to a two car family when we moved and i could no longer walk to work. how many kids do you have? what if DH is working in-person and has the car and there is a kid emergency at school, who is closest to get the kid? once we had kids, being a one car family sometimes made me nervous bc DH usually had the car and even though our kids were home with a nanny, once she left for the day, we were kind of prisoners
Anonymous says
We only have one car. We live in a city so slightly different circumstances, but my husband grew up in the suburbs and his family only had one car. His parents still only have one car. It takes a little bit more discussion and planning sometimes (if I want to go out of town, will my husband need the car for any kid errands? Can he take public transit, or can I instead?). But literally never once has the occasional inconvenience made us want to deal with buying, insuring, parking, and maintaining another car.
I say do it- it’s so much cheaper. And if you find you really need another one, you can get it (yes, cars are hard to get now, etc, but it’s still very doable).
Anonymous says
You can always rent a car to go out of town, too. It is an added expense, but still much cheaper than owning another car!
Anonymous says
We live in a DC suburb (1 mile from a metro station) and only have 1 car. We have 1 kid in preschool, I work from home and husband works downtown. In the morning, I drop husband at metro and drop kid off at school, then go back home for my work day. I pick up kid at the end of the day and husband walks home from metro. If I end up having to go back to working in an office, we may end up getting another car, but for now this works fine for us.
Cb says
We have one car, in the country, and I don’t have a drivers’ license in the UK, so my husband is the only driver. But we can hop a bus into the city and the pedestrian and cycling infrastructure is decent. We never use a car for the school run, and try not to use it in town. I’m trying to convince my husband that a Rad bike would make sense to give us a bit more range.
The only time it’s been problematic is when my husband hurt himself and had to go to the hospital – but a neighbour took him and that was 1 time in 8 years of marriage, nearly 5 years of parenting.
Yes, e-bike ftw! says
Off topic, but you should absolutely get a Rad bike (or another cargo e-bike) to extend your range! 3-kid family, one of whom bikes extremely well, but we still just got a second kid hauling e-bike so we can fit all 3 across 2 bikes and it’s amazing. We can now go basically anywhere in town & neighboring towns on bikes, without being limited by biking kid’s range, and I love it. (And I am not a particularly bike-adept person!) You should absolutely get one!!!!
Cb says
I’m desperate for one… but can’t quite manage the cost at the moment and not sure we could make a convincing case for bike to work funding.
Kiddo is a strong cyclist but not yet road worthy (nearly 5). But luckily our route to school is in the national cycle network, so just three road crossings and the rest is trail. I’d love to be able to get to the beach and back on an ebike but think those bucket ones aren’t ideal.
Pogo says
+1 to cycling and especially a cargo or e-bike (or cargo e-bike combo). Cycling as transportation is a mind shift, but once you get there, it becomes second nature. I biked to and from school or work, year round, for almost 10 years. The key is not to give yourself the option of the car (especially on bad weather days).
Cb says
Definitely! I have a cycling cape for rainy days and a great basket set up which means I can get a week’s worth of groceries on my Dutch bike.
anon says
For the 2 days a week your husband is at work, does he take the car? If so, do you have a way to pick up the kids to take them to the dr when they get sick at school or daycare? Our one-car family worked because it was possible for the wfh parent to walk or transit to daycare and the pediatrician if the parent with the car at work couldn’t get back.
Anonymous says
Do you really want to be stuck at home with no way to leave ever? That’s so wildly limiting.
OP says
Hmm maybe I will feel differently once it actually happens, but it doesn’t seem limiting to me. I can walk or bike and I could call a Lyft if I need to go somewhere fast in an emergency.
Anonymous says
Oh weird. You said there was nothing in walking distance. So.
Anon says
Yeah going off “nothing in walking distance” and one 4 year old, I’d caution against going down to one car. I have two kids, 1st and 3rd grade. I wfh every day, DH wfh 2-3 days/week. We live in the suburbs but have most things within walking distance.
Yes for the first year and a half of pandemic, when we were dealing with daycare and kindergarten for my youngest, we could totally have been a one-car family. But as things are picking up and the kids are in “real” school, there is no way to survive with one car. School hours shifting to summer camp hours alone is enough of an argument – I was not prepared for the amount of days there would be no school or early school. The need to go pick up “within 30 minutes” if they’re sick is a real constraint. Add in sports activities, stores with inconvenient hours, kid birthday parties all over the surrounding suburbs, etc.
All of that is with the bonus that we can walk to most errands like grocery stores, shops, restaurants, etc. I know we have two kids so the chaos is intensified, but I would not want to be stuck at home on a rainy day while DH sat at a 7 year old birthday party for three hours on a Saturday afternoon, after him being stuck at home while I took the kid to piano lessons that morning.
OP says
I appreciate all the things to think about! I think we must have very boring lives (and Covid is probably a factor) but I honestly can’t remember the last time DH and I both left the house on a weekend at the same time and went to different places. I’m sure it was before the pandemic, and I think it may have been before our kid was born. We do have an increasing amount of kid stuff on weekends (activities, play dates, etc.) but usually both parents go or the other parent just stays home. I would not want to be stuck at home, as in unable to leave my house, but as long as I can walk around the neighborhood I don’t think I’d feel trapped. DH’s big hobby is running, which doesn’t require a car. I totally see how it would not work at all with two or more kids who have conflicting activities and social calendars, but with one it seems pretty manageable to me.
Anonymous says
FWIW, my neighbors have one child and were a one-car family until very recently. Their child is in 3rd grade. We live in a close-in DC suburb and there is a bus line through our neighborhood to the downtown area/metro station, and bike-ability is decent (they didn’t bike, though), but things like grocery shopping are not walkable. Pre-pandemic, one parent used public transit for commute, but this year he changed jobs and that wasn’t a great option. Clearly it worked for them for a long time, though! They would occasionally borrow our car in a pinch, but it was just a lot of deconflicting and communication.
Anonanonanon says
My main concern would be if a kid is home sick and has a doctor’s appointment, you need to go pick up a prescription for them, etc. Or if you get the call to pick up the kid from school because they’re sick, and the partner has the car and can’t come get the kid because they have an important meeting. Might not want your sick kid to walk or bike a mile home from school, and schools usually have a hard time limit on how soon you have to come pick them up. Calling a Lyft would be a pain in that situation as well.
Kindergarten is a lot different than preschool. How will you handle early school dismissals, etc? Is your husband off all of the same days your kid’s school will be off? Teacher workdays, weather days, etc.
Anne-on says
This. Daycare hours/days off/dismissal times are so WILDLY different from a school schedule that I wouldn’t make any decisions until you’ve done a year of school AND summer camp AND after school sports/activities (also camp is it’s own separate logistics hell that is hard to understand until you’ve done it). Also if your kid does get into sports, parent carpools make that a lot easier, and you might not be able to participate easily with one car.
OP says
The situation is that my husband’s car is very old and needs significant repairs in the near future and it doesn’t make sense to invest that much money in such an old car. So the question is do we get a new car right now or not. If we don’t get one now we can always change our mind in a year or two, but if get a new car right now we can’t undo that. So we’re leaning towards not replacing it immediately.
Anonymous says
We briefly considered becoming a one-car family when my husband and I both went permanent WFH. We quickly changed our minds when one of our cars needed a windshield replacement that had to be done in the shop and took all day.
Bean74 says
We’re a one-car family in NoVA (so with decent ride-share availability and public transportation). We’re not in area that’s super walkable with a kid. It was all good pre-pandemic but the reduced service on public transportation due to the pandemic and other factors have thrown a wrench into things. And last month our one vehicle ended up in the shop for 10 days while they were waiting for a part to arrive which meant getting and paying for a rental.
My suggestion would be to live like you only have one car for a while. Long enough to see how much you’d really need it and perhaps experience some of the weird, one-off things that come up to see if the solutions would be okay for you.
Anonanonanon says
^This last bit is excellent advice. Can you hold off the repairs for a month or so and see how one car life is before committing?
Anonymous says
We had one car in a suburban area for a few years when my oldest was a baby/small toddler. I found it quite isolating to be honest- and we did have good public transit within a mile. We really had to plan our weekends. If one of us was off playing a sport or doing a volunteer activity, the other one was stuck at home with a small child (or could bus somewhere or walk a long way to the subway, but that was not always a good use of time with small children). It made it really hard to have a social life or even get errands done – and if we’d have had kid activities on weekends, particularly multiple kids, i don’t know what we’d have done. It also meant that only my spouse could do daycare drop off and pick up since daycare was, for affordability reasons, in a different suburb nEar his work (he drove to work) and I took the subway downtown to work- I had no way of getting to/from daycare. If you are in an area that takes a long time to navigate by public transit, if you can afford two cars i would recommend it. I stuck that out for environmental and $ reasons until we moved away but it was a pretty sad and isolating time.
Anonymous says
Same poster- an ebike could definitely have helped here! But wasn’t in the budget at the time.
anon says
We’re a one-car family and we barely use our car at all! I think it part town infrastructure and part mindset. We moved to the suburbs from NYC where we had no car so we are incredibly used to walking/biking/uber/public transportation. Husband walks to the train station for work, I WFH, we chose a preschool that was walking distance, and we bought a house that was in a walkable part of the town because we don’t like driving.
If I had a sick kid, I could definitely walk and pick them up from school or use the car which stays at the house all the time.
If I had to pick up a prescription and was home alone with the kiddos, our pharmacy delivers, or I could load them in the bike trailer and go pick it up.
We always take ubers to the airport and have our guests do the same. I very selfishly like to have that hour of my or my husband’s time to relax at home. :-)
These scenarios are possible because of the infrastructure in our town and the location of our house. In my hometown growing up, none of this would have been possible so YMMV.
anonyc says
Curious what town this is! We’re currently in NYC with two small kids, not planning on leaving but there’s always the what if… and if we were, i’d want it to be somewhere like you’re describing!
Forever a Mom says
I am 35 years old and my mother packed my lunch for me (and is keeping my kid for the week!) since I was going straight to the office after a weekend away at her house, and she slipped some surprise cookies in there for me. Best day ever. I hope to be such an awesome adult-mom/grandmother in 30 years too. Kiddo is going to have such a blast this week.
Anonymous says
I love this so much. One never outgrows delight at surprise cookies, and your mom is great!
Cb says
Haha, that is lovely! I have housemates in work city and one of them packed me up a cinnamon roll when she knew I had a crazy day.
Anon says
tips for when you are so tired you feel like you could fall asleep standing up? whole family had covid last week and since then, our 4 year old has been waking every hour or two. i’d not attend to her each time, except she shares a room with her sister and is quite loud and i dont want to keep the whole house up all night.
Pogo says
solidarity. Drink lots of water – both to stay hydrated and cold water can keep you alert. Coffee if you drink it. Get up and do a lap around the house or office. Stay strong. I was there not too long ago and it took some time – long COVID is real.
Anon says
For me, the trick is to stay extra hydrated, somewhat counterintuitively cut out caffeine which leaves me jittery at that level of sleep deprivation and if I can’t get a power-nap in somewhere, at least find time to be horizontal with my eyes closed. But your best best is to do a few 15-20 minute power naps throughout the day if you can sneak them in.
Anon says
Hire outside help. Getting rest in the weeks after Covid appears to be one of the ways to prevent Long Covid.
Anon says
Do you have a source for that? Last I heard the risk factors were all genetic.
Anon says
It is common knowledge among the ME/CFS community (which is what along Covid essentially becomes if you can’t get over it within a year). Since medical science has all but decided to label ME/CFS as the new hysteria, you won’t find the deep scientific record that you might be craving. But here is a link: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jun/21/long-covid-recovery-coronavirus
FWIW, the British Heart Foundation lists rest and pacing (which comes straight from the ME/CFS community) as a way to recover/manage from the fatigue of Long Covid: https://www.bhf.org.uk/informationsupport/heart-matters-magazine/news/coronavirus-and-your-health/long-covid#Heading10
I also wonder where you get the idea that Long Covid is all genetic? It is very new and science has long ignored post-viral illness in general so research simply isn’t available. So we have no idea what causes it, genetics or not.
If you want a guess from someone who spent a lot of time looking into what science is available and spent a lot of time in post-viral illness communities, genetics is a very small part of it. The rest is the overall health of your immune system, which itself depends on multiple things (including your prior history of viral infections, your overall level of body inflammation, your exposure to environmental pollution, your hormones and stress levels, etc).
Anon says
I mean, more rest is good. But these feel like pretty irresponsible assertions. There’s a lot of research going into long COVID and by definition people who join an online community for a disease are not a random sample.
Anon says
I think it is irresponsible to shrug off the hard won knowledge of patient communities (who have helped multiple people rest and pace to get out of the pit of Long Covid before they fell into what is likely a permanent state of ME/CFS with no cure). Also irresponsible to assume Long Covid must be genetic when the research is in the very, very early stages and what we do have implicates the immune system far more than genetics.
The knowledge is there for people that want to learn. And for the people that would rather hear glib lies for their own comfort, there is plenty of that on offer if you prefer. Back to normal until the disability levels are too high to ignore, I guess.
Anon says
Why do you think not taking anecdotal evidence as scientific fact is the same as ignoring long COVID? I’m not assuming it’s genetic either.
Anon says
I’m the anon at 1:52. With respect to your statement that “what we do have implicates the immune system far more than genetics”….”the immune system” and “genetics” are not mutually exclusive. For someone who claims to be a scientist, you seem to not understand very much about the human body. Immune function *depends* on your genetics. Many autoimmune diseases are highly hereditary. I was basing my statement on the fact that I was told by my doctor that a pre-existing autoimmune disease and asthma are the two biggest long Covid risk factors identified so far other than age and sex. I actually have both asthma AND an autoimmune disease (that my father, cousins, grandmother, and great-grandmother also had/have, so obviously a very strong genetic component) so this isn’t a lie “for my own comfort.” I have no idea why you’d assume that. It’s the opposite – I assume I’m more likely, not less, to get long Covid because of my bad genetics.
I don’t believe for a second that environmental pollution is a big factor. If it were, China and India would have way higher rates of long Covid than western countries and they don’t. It would be great for me if that were true! I have bad genetics and breathe relatively clean air compared to most of the human population. But I don’t believe it.
I agree that long Covid patients’ lived experiences should not be dismissed, but also agree with the previous anon that it’s obviously not a representative sample and can’t be treated as such.
Anonanonanon says
Ugh I’m so sorry. I have an autoimmune condition and when it flares I feel like that. Solidarity, it’s awful.
Do you work at home? Or can you justify working at home since you just had COVID? Sometimes I seriously have to take a 30-minute nap. I almost have no choice. Do you have a task you can work on that will justify blocking off your work calendar but also let you go at your own pace? During those times I will do something like audit contact information we have on file at work. I lay on the couch under a blanket, work as long as I can, short nap, repeat, etc. Always make sure to set an alarm if you feel yourself drifting off, though!
Coffee doesn’t seem to harm or hurt during these periods for me.
Sitting outside once in a while helps. Going for a walk doesn’t because with something like an autoimmune condition or long covid exerting yourself can exhaust you more instead of invigorating you.
Take it easy outside of work. Order pizza and let the kids watch a movie and have a “floor picnic” while you doze off or lay there in the evening if you can. Let your kid stay in the bath as long as they want while you lay on the bathmat (half-joking? I’ve done it). Buy lunchables instead of packing school lunch. Give your kids a nutrigrain bar, some yogurt, and apple slices you bought from the store for breakfast. Buy convenience snacks, pre-washed and cut fruit, etc. Use paper plates. They’ll be fine.
Just survive, it’s temporary, you’ve got this.
Anon says
Also an autoimmune condition and I have also laid on a bathmat for a 90 minute bath while kid was super happy. And blocked off my calendar for a short nap while working on non-intense things. And fed my kid all the easy meals. And played games like statue where all I was supposed to do was be still, or had a cuddled movie night where I laid on the couch for 3 hours with them while we watched a disney movie or two.
Anon says
For those with kids in full time daycare: do you buy bigger toys like water tables, play kitchens, etc? If so, which specific ones have you bought? A lot of my friends who have nannies or stay at home with the kids have lots of these toys and I understand why.
I don’t think we need all of them since he gets to play with them everyday at school, but maybe would like to buy one or two things that would get a lot of mileage. I.e., My son loves his little tikes indoor slide—he rides it multiple times before and after school. Thoughts on whether play kitchen or similarly big toys are worth it if in daycare?
Anon says
We try to limit it, but as they get older you do need some bigger toys for play dates. We bought a play kitchen when DD was almost 2 and that’s gotten a decent amount of use. A friend gave us a water table that my kid really likes, and then we bought a giant inflatable waterslide during Covid that didn’t get much use until recently but has been a huge hit this summer at 4. It’s also pretty fun for the adults ;) We’re on the fence about a backyard swingset/play structure. I asked about it the other day. Our kid really wants one, but we like the social and physical benefits of regular trips to the playground. I know people said having a backyard set doesn’t replace the playground, but at this age we really don’t have much free time on weeknights so I feel like if we had a backyard play structure we’d definitely go to the playground less.
Anonymous says
+1 for play kitchen. 2 is the perfect age, and it will get used on play dates for many years after. A play tent or tunnel is another good thing for play dates and rainy days that folds up small.
I think a swingset is great because you can send them outside to play unsupervised, or you can sit and relax on the deck while they play. Much less hassle than schlepping to the playground.
Anonymous says
I forgot about the play tent/tunnel. We have one that folds up pretty small that we got during the January/February quarantines (lots of desperation toy purchases during that time!). It gets a TON of use.
Anonymous says
We have a Little Tikes play structure that’s a hand-me-down from a neighbor. I definitely wouldn’t have bought a new one, and we were on the fence about much effort we wanted to go to for a used one, given that we’d have to borrow my FIL’s truck to make it happen (a group of neighbors managed to get it precariously balanced on a wagon and walk it over to our yard). There are 3 playgrounds within a couple blocks of our house. Kiddo will probably get a small play kitchen as a 2nd birthday gift. I think the water table and sandbox at daycare is sufficient – both because of the mess factor and our small backyard.
Cb says
I wouldn’t have if not for the pandemic, when everyone was a stay at home mom. Now I’m looking sceptically at all these toys, when my kid is gone 9-5
Anono says
Pick a few options below!
Naps – even 30 minutes really helps.
An Americano from Starbucks – I don’t know how these are so much better and more energizing than regular coffee but they are.
Quick phone call with a girlfriend for laughs and encouragement
Open a window for fresh air and play music – it can really change your mood
Take a shower and put on makeup so you feel put together
Set a timer and work in short spurts
Spirograph says
You don’t need them at all, esp if they play with similar things at daycare, but if you have the space for them, I found toys like this kept my kids entertained without my involvement a lot longer than things like blocks, train tracks, dolls etc. We have/had a play kitchen, water table, and play tent+tunnel. We got rid of the water table a year or two ago because it was getting gross and the kids had outgrown it, but play kitchen and tent/tunnel still get fairly regular use. I asked my kids if I could donate the play kitchen recently, and my 7 year old was a loud no vote. So, ages 2-7 and counting for kitchen and tent. Their cost per use is very low. :) I’m iffy on the water table; the kids were just as happy to splash around outdoors with bath toys and measuring cups in some dishpans & shallow tupperware/rubbermaid containers.
Anonymous says
I think water table and play kitchen are worth it. We also tried to resist both but gave in (one was a gift, one I got on craigslist), and the amount they’ve played with them has made it totally worth it. Magnatiles are good too.
Anon says
Things that entertain my kid majorly on the weekends: Play kitchen (since 2, she’s 5 now and still going strong) with play food, magnatiles (small but expensive) and the backyard swingset. Plus her bike. The water table didn’t really interest her (she’s happy with just a sprinkler or a baby pool)
Anonymous says
I used to feel that way (such a minimalist POOPCUP) but we bought our then 4.5 and 1.5 year old a play kitchen in December 2019 and have not regretted it. 4.5 year old used it a ton between them and March 2020 and obviously a lot in 2020. Then 1.5 year old is now almost 4 and still uses it. Actually both do.
We also got a yard swing when playgrounds plus school had been closed for 6 months and I feared they wouldn’t open. Playgrounds opened within a month after that and it hasn’t gotten much use.
Indoor bars get a LOT of use but (a) they are in the main living area (b) I have very active kids. They were also free from a neighbor.
anonM says
I’d go with multi-use things over a water table — some buckets, a kid-sized table, and maybe a resale play kitchen or playhouse. Things that grow with them. Don’t feel obligated to buy a bunch of huge toys, especially new! Oh, and I really recommend buying “real” things as much as possible. The “kiddie shovels” aren’t that strong, but the short shovel from an actual home improvement store has gotten tons of use at our house. We got the kids the “safety” knives and cutting board, and they often “help” with dinner. If you do get the play kitchen, I’d really recommend limiting the toys for it — it is such a clutter mess when they really just use a few things and most of the rest just sit there gathering dust and occassionally getting dumped out everywhere. Save yourself from cleaning up 20 pieces of plastic fruit every day.
As was discussed previously, Hunt Gather Parent points out that kids having dedicated toys is a relatively new thing, and not necessary.
Anon says
Ugggggggggggh. My daycare just informed me they’re changing their hours in 2 weeks and opening half an hour later. I get why they need to do it but, ugh, this is going to screw over our carefully balanced schedules so much. Ugh ugh ugh.
Anon says
Sorry, I thought I was done ranting but I’m not. Ugh, ugh, ugh. Me being able to do drop off AND get into the office by 7:40 was very beneficial from a work standpoint. And my husband can hard out at 4:45 to go do pick up because he gets to work at 7 because he didn’t have to do drop off. I’m not able to hard out (I have to physically stay until the work is done). My husband’s text response was amazing “okay, do we need to alternate drop offs now?” but I feel like ultimately I’m going to still be in charge of drop offs and will just have to take the career hit. This sucks.
Anon says
Really sucks. Can you afford a morning babysitter to do a couple of hours of pre/drop-off?
SC says
I’m sorry. It does suck. I don’t know your job or the details of your schedule, but as someone past the daycare years, I want to encourage you that an 8:10-8:30 start will probably not result in a career hit if your husband is doing daycare pickups and you are staying at work until the work is done.
AwayEmily says
This sucks. I’m really sorry.
Anonymous says
I’m so sorry. On my team of 18 where 10 are working parents of under-5 kids, more than half have been affected by short notice daycare hours changes this year due to staffing. Ours was two weeks notice and it means we had to find a new daycare for next school year since I can’t keep being late to work forever (spouse is a teacher and can’t be late). I sympathize very very much!!