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Anon318 says
Permission to ignore the elementary school’s optional summer reading log? How do you handle summer reading requirements/recommendations from school?
I’m sure I’m coming at this from a place of Mayhem/Maycember hangover, but I’m really struggling with having my kids keep up with these reading logs. They are good readers, on track or ahead of grade level, and they read for 20+ minutes daily without prompting. I feel like after the structure of the school year that making reading about anything other than enjoyment may just take the fun out of it. I know I gravitate toward fluffy fiction brain candy during or after demanding seasons and it seems that is exactly what DS is dealing with right now. Neither kid is keeping up with the logs on their own. They would be recognized in the first week of school and get some kind of reward if they turn in a complete log at the end of the summer, but neither seems particularly motivated by that. Thoughts?
Boston Legal Eagle says
Elementary kids? Definitely skip, unless they are interested in a particular book. I agree that this seems to make reading a chore vs. encouraging a love of reading (whatever book you want). My kid (2nd grader) hasn’t had any of this yet, and I don’t think it starts until middle school.
Cb says
Just let them read fun stuff! They are exhausted, and I think we shouldn’t let perfect be the enemy of the good. Reading is reading.
And if they are a bit disappointed the first week back, you can remind them of that feeling next summer.
Anon2 says
Permission granted. Let them be the driver to complete or not. Maybe after the initial burn out wears off they’ll want to start working on them in a couple weeks, or maybe not. The fact that they are still reading for fun is the important part. (And in case you’re feeling mom guilt that the teachers will judge you — the teachers will absolutely be able to tell that your kids are reading this summer, log or not.)
Anon says
Full permission to ignore, it doesn’t sound like they need this. The only exception would be if they generally enjoy structure and checking boxes on a list, which might be a reason to consider starting it in a few weeks when summer has settled in.
Cb says
Yeah, my son loves a tickbox and needs a bit of nudging to read. Our school doesn’t do summer homework, but I’m doing a fun reading challenge with cool custom images – a great use of my ChatGPT subscription. Some book + film pairings, and book + outing pairings.
Anon318 says
This challenge sounds so fun!! Please share details and anything that worked so we can copy your great ideas!
Cb says
Book Party on substack had some good ideas. I’m doing an Olympic themed one – I’ve got a myth nerd and it’s summer olympics. We did some fun “read a book under a tree” challenges, as well as some reading adjacent tasks – make a family tree of the greek gods, finish Percy Jackson read aloud and watch the first film, read a poem, write a letter.
Anon318 says
This is a great point – the summer is long and they can pick up the log later if they want. I don’t expect DS to care, but DD may want to get into it later this summer.
Anon says
I would not feel any pressure to turn in an optional reading log if your kids are reading anyway and don’t care about the prize for doing it.
We are making my rising first grader do the summer homework packet and spend 15 minutes a day practicing reading (with rewards for completing), but she’s not a particularly good reader for her grade level, and she wouldn’t do any reading if it were up to her so I’m worried about her losing ground over the summer and not being on track in our high-performing district next year. If she was self-motivated to read, I wouldn’t care about recording it.
Anon318 says
I think we land in the same place. We are keeping up with some daily math facts practice for DD (also with fun completion rewards) because she was not where she needed to be at the end of the school year. She’s the youngest in her grade and I’m proud of where she is in reading. Thanks for the permission to allow the reading part of school to just be easy!
Nope says
Ignore!!! I feel like any benefit/fun from this would come from the kid taking the initiative and pursuing their own goal, so if they’re not into it, definitely don’t push it. Let them enjoy reading without making it a chore.
Waffles says
I remember slogging through some awful, forgettable summer reading book during middle school. When school started, the English teacher was like, that book was terrible. Let’s read another one. That was the end of that.
The reward at the end is bland acknowledgement. The teacher probably won’t care. The kids will learn on their own. You don’t even care. Skip!!!
GCA says
They’re intrinsically motivated to read – just roll with that! Skip the log. Its purpose is to motivate kids who gain something from the structure and extrinsic incentives. Go to the library, check out all the books they want, throw in one that might tempt them to broaden their reading – this is my approach with my avid readers.
Anon says
My kids are voracious readers, and I never made them do those things. In fact, I found them counterproductive, and threw them away when they came in. Regular trips to the library or local book stores did far more to facilitate creating life long readers than those logs.
Anon says
on the flip side, my rising first graders are SO excited about the idea of filling in a reading log, that they want to try to read all the books in one week…lol. granted, their books are much shorter than those that older kids read. we are still at the read out loud to mom and dad stage, which they dont always want to do, even though they love books. i would not like a log that told them which books to read.
anon says
We don’t have summer reading logs, but I would 100% opt-out if we did. My kids love books and read at least an hour before bed every day, plus on any car ride over 15 minutes or other times they’re stuck somewhere and bored, but it would be a major fight to get them to fill out a daily log.
Mary Moo Cow says
A requirement to read the class book and complete the book report, I require. The generic “read 20 minutes a day and here’s a list of suggested books” I don’t log. My kids are good readers, reading above grade level, and like to read, so I have them participate in the library summer reading program, the Barnes and Noble summer reading program, created a best places to read bracket from Young House Love, and printed a twenty-minutes a day coloring page for my artsy kid. I don’t push this stuff, though; I just offer it to them at the beginning of the summer as a way for them to have a visual attaboy for reading.
The week before school starts, can you recreate/jot down as much as you remember what they read and hand that in? I learned this past fall that at my school, you get a certificate even if you finish only, like, 80% of the summer work. So maybe if they turn in even a halfhearted log they would get something?
Anonymous says
What do they have to log, exactly? Have they write down the books they read. At the end of the summer just ballpark the time it took based on the average length of the books they read. Everyone wins.
My kid just saves the library checkout receipts on her desk all summer and writes down the book titles the night before school starts. One yeah one teacher had some kind of page count tracker so she looked up each book online to get the page count (she only did this because she read like 10k pages and wanted to be recognized).
My other kid prefers audiobooks so we just record what she’s listened to and the length of the audiobook is on the box. Boom, done.
Anon says
In very stressful unpleasant news, a random Google search just informed me that my POS father has recently moved to a city about an hour away from me. 30 years ago he was a violent abuser who deviously skirted the edge of legality. Now he has a felony record for CSA, but I don’t know any details. Obviously he can live where he wants, but I don’t know of any thing that would draw him here besides me and my kids.
He hasn’t contacted me or done anything threatening that I know of, but this is too close for my comfort, and I want to lay groundwork to protect my family. I plan to tell daycare about the whole situation, and provide them with a current photo. I’m considering how to up our home security, probably with cameras not with guns. Any other suggestions for preventative measures?
Anon says
I would look at the details of his felony record and decide on measures. It may be informative, although of course upsetting. Agree on home security and notifying daycare and anyone else who may be involved in your kids’ care.
Anon says
I would also not allow daycare to post any pictures of my child.
OP says
We’ve dug as far as we can with regard to the criminal record, and very little info is publicly available (even to the criminal lawyer, who knows where to look). Obviously that’s primarily for the sake of the child involved, but my dad’s a weasel who has always been unbelievably good a hiding his bad behavior. Minimizing the record would have been his primary concern in plea bargaining.
Eek says
No suggestions, but I’m so sorry you’re dealing with this.
Anon for this says
Unfortunately, I can speak to this more than I want to be able to… Foster parent who has had a couple very violent biological parents who have specifically threatened showing up at my house to ‘take what is theirs’ and/or actively sought out my address.
Google your name and your children’s names. Try to get any mentions online removed. Our home purchase was recorded in the local paper and it was a PROCESS to get that removed from a google search. I also would think about names. Do they know your married name? One way I actually stay safe is that I use my maiden name professionally. People are able to find my married name (which is luckily not super unique) but it’s not associated with my professional profile at all. This isn’t probably relevant to you, but we also referred to the other child living in the home as a nickname so he wasn’t findable (‘Buddy’ is hard to find at an elementary school.) so the person looking for us wasn’t able to locate him.
We have cameras on all windows and doors, always make sure that the cars are in the garage and LOCKED, and (while we were going through all this) didn’t allow or post any pictures of our children on social media. One thing I will tell you is that between custody disputes and general crazy relatives, schools and daycares are much better at this than I would have expected, so that was a relief.
Also, this sucks and I’m sorry you’re having to think about it.
Op says
Thanks for these detailed suggestions. Unfortunately I’m certain he found out my married name and my husband’s name about 3 years ago. We both have public-facing government jobs and the house is deeded in our own names, but there’s nothing else online. Kids so far have no record beyond birth certificates.
I should give some thought to vehicles and parking. Thanks for mentioning that.
I’m optimistic about dealing with daycare– they are generally amazing, and also I know they have dealt with this kind of thing before. As you know, it’s more common than it should be.
Anonymous says
Fully support taking whatever measure you want but moving an hour away doesn’t sound to me like it has anything to do with you.
Op says
If only that were true. Enjoy your innocence.
Anon says
I think it depends where. If she’s in Boston and he moved to Providence that seems much more innocent than if she’s in rural Oklahoma and he moved an hour away — basically is there any reason he’d move to that region except her? It sounds like there’s not, which would alarm me too.
Anon says
Yeah, no. Just because they haven’t narrowed down exactly where they live yet doesn’t mean it’s innocent and happenstantial.
Anonymous says
I would install home security (not just cameras, but an alarm system), make everyone in the family (as well as your address) difficult to Google, wipe your social media presence, and work closely with school/ daycare. I might also consider getting a dog, if you don’t have one already. I’m so sorry.
Op says
Thanks. I think I need to look further into our options about home security. Our dog is impressively loud and reactive (although actually a lousy guard dog).
Anonymous says
I don’t think a dog that is kid-safe and easy to live with will be helpful in this situation. Unless you train it as a guard dog, the main use of a dog is as a warning system, and dogs that bark every time someone walks by the front door tend to be difficult to manage. A calm, easygoing dog that is not a pain in the @$$ is likely to welcome an intruder. Our sweet livestock guardian dog only registers animals as threats, not humans.
Anonymous says
FWIW we grew up with a loud big black barky dog…who was a total pushover. But nobody actively messes with a house with a big black barking dog.
Anonymous says
Yeah that’s my experience as well. It’s more about perception and about the alert you get from their barking.
OP says
Ha, you’re absolutely right. My poorly trained barky dog who dislikes kids is a whole nother problem. But he is loud and sounds big, for whatever smidgen of increased security that’s worth.
Anonymous says
It sounds like your kids may be too young for this but I’d consider working with them on protocols re: strangers. Consider putting an AirTag on them if you are truely concerned and want to be hypervigalent. Idk that it’s practical for you but a mom friend of mine has made one that velcros to her kids waistband tag. He’s special needs and she’s afraid he’ll wander.
Anonymous says
We tried putting an AirTag on our dog and it was largely useless. Even though we live in a densely populated neighborhood with lots of Apple devices, it did not update the location in a timely fashion and did not reliably issue notifications when the dog left the geofence. I would find something more reliable than an AirTag if you want to track for safety reasons.
Anon says
I also had no luck with an AirTag on my dog.
OP says
Thanks, that option hadn’t occurred to me at all.
Anonymous says
Definitely remove your social media accounts and be VERY explicit with other parents not posting your kids.
Anonny says
I have a friend who lives in South Dakota and owns a private company that performs security consultant services for homes and self defense courses for people. I wouldn’t necessarily recommend this person, but it may be useful to know that this profession exists! Perhaps you can find someone local to your area that would come listen to your concerns, inspect your property, review your daily habits, and make recommendations based on your situation.
Anon says
I wanted to offer you virtual support, as I have a very similar situation with my dad, except he went to jail when I was a young teen for assaulting me. He bounced all around the country, creating several new families and half-siblings I’ve never met (the state took away 2 for awhile along the way)…while being in continued contempt of court for not paying child support for his existing kids, quitting jobs when the state attached his wages, and putting companies in his new partners’ names.
Now 25+ years later, I learned 2 years ago that he moved to my state. He’s now in his 70s (!) and my mom is basically waiting for him to die to get some of his SS. He is on our state’s top deadbeat parent list if you google (who knew that was a thing).
I was terrified to have him near. Like you, I’m in a public service role and very google-able.
Let me reassure you, he’s never reached out, contacted me, showed up at my work, sought out my family- all the things I’m afraid of. I’m not even sure if he knows he has a grandkid (my child will never meet him). I processed a lot with my therapist. It raised a lot of what “little Anon” was feeling as a kid. Ultimately, that was a helpful thing to deal with. I really hope you have a similar experience. Plan for the worst, but expect the best, is my take.
Anon says
Let me also add that I already had the full works for home security, sensors on every window, cameras inside and out that I can watch on my cell, alarm being monitored in real time, etc.
OP says
Is it a joke in poor taste if I say “wow, are you my half sister?” Thanks for sharing your story, and it was actually comforting because that would be my ideal outcome too. I dont usually think about him often, but I have been low-key waiting for the day his poor choices kill him.
Anon says
to perhaps be overly cautious, are your kids’ finger prints (and perhaps yours too) part of a registry if g-d forbid needed. OP I am so sorry you are dealing with this.
Anonymous says
If your mom is now unmarried, she should look into Social Security spousal benefits.
Anon says
Wow, a dagger I didn’t need this morning – I mentioned a sensitive subject to a relative who has never been pregnant, which is the fact that we are debating whether to get an amniocentesis when the risk of conditions seems low but we lost a prior pregnancy due to miscarriage for genetic abnormality. She comes back with “I didn’t realize that the previous miscarriage was actually a true miscarriage – wasn’t there another name for it? And I nuts in thinking that it was not an actual pregnancy?”
She saw the freaking ultrasound photo! Why are people.
Anon for this says
1. that stinks and was def not the response you needed
2. Assuming good intentions here – is this generally a conscientious person? Is it possible she just got confused and/or mixed you up with somebody who had a chemical pregnancy? And genuinely didn’t remember that it had been to the point of an US? Also, yes – for many people chemical pregnancy losses are miscarriages, not minimizing that, but others treat them differently. It sounds like this is what she was thinking of…
We all say boneheaded things. I hope this was a one off and it sucks that you didn’t get the support you needed.
Anon says
She is a close relative I speak to once a week. She was fully aware of the circumstances surrounding the first pregnancy at the time. Unless she had a stroke that caused medium-term memory loss, there is no sense that I can make of her message.
And even if she heard the phrase “chemical pregnancy” somewhere and decided that sounded right, why TF would she hit send on that email?
Anon for this says
Yeah, I got nothing. Stupid email to send.
I’m sorry – Pregnancy after loss is a minefield and I wish you all the best.
Lily says
I’m sorry, that would hurt. Maybe she forgot about the photo, and was looking for the term “chemical pregnancy”?
Anon says
Or “blighted ovum”, but if she saw a baby in an ultrasound photo it definitely wouldn’t be that!
Anon says
And even then, you don’t have to go out of your way to tell someone you think their pregnancy was nothing – just shut your mouth! Say no words.
Anon says
+1 even if it WAS a chemical pregnancy, this is a terribly insensitive thing to say
Anon says
Ugh that really stinks. Yes, she was probably thinking of a chemical pregnancy, but there is no way that was a comment worth sharing.
As someone who has had multiple miscarriages, lots of people say kind things, but you do get a contingent of people who say really awful things. “Maybe it’s for the best” (???) “Oh well it was still early so it’s not so bad” “oh well at least you’re fertile” (????) “maybe you need to stress less” etc. etc.
The only thing there is to say in that circumstance is “I’m sorry, that really sucks, please let me know if there is anything I can do to support you”
Anonymous says
This is why I don’t understand why people share early pregnancy news or miscarriages. Human nature means that people don’t always say the right thing or the sensitive thing, so why set yourself up for that? After 12 weeks or so it’s impossible to hide, but most miscarriages occur before that. But I am also a person who doesn’t share other personal health information, so maybe I am just unusually private.
Anon says
So that they don’t have to carry around something horribly painful in silence. At least, that’s why I wish I would have told more people.
Anonymous says
Hi all, I need opinions because I’m not sure if I can be objective in this situation. Thank you in advance.
My parents frequently fly from their hometown to visit my family, mostly to see my 2.5yo child. When they are here, they stay for about 7-10 days and are available to watch my child. My family does not need help with childcare, as we pay for preschool fulltime, but my parents (and especially my mom) like the 1:1 time with their grandkid, so I let my parents take my child out of preschool midday most days that they’re here. All that to say, my parents are very involved grandparents.
Over the weekend, my mom joined me and my child at our neighborhood playground. My child is on track (if not advanced) from a gross motor perspective, and I generally let him navigate the playground by himself, but constantly watching him and staying within a few feet in case he needs help. My mom, upon seeing how I was handling playground time, became visibly upset and began hovering over my child. When I told her to please not worry and that I had the situation under control, she began audibly gasping and sighing. She also made comments like “[Child’s name], you can’t do that,” even though my kid was 100% capable of doing what she was referring to, and making comments like “It only takes one incident” to me. It started devolving into a bit of a scene, and I calmly asked her to leave. She eventually did.
I feel hurt and offended, like my mom was suggesting that I’m negligent and don’t care about my own child’s wellbeing and safety. From a more practical perspective, her behavior is odd to me since I’m of course more in tune with what my child is physically capable of doing than she is. Then of course there’s the issue of undermining me in front of my kid.
Thoughts? Should I just let this go, or am I right to feel like this is a red flag and need to assert better boundaries and maybe some distance going forward? Thank you.
Anon says
Ugh, sorry, that sounds awful. I’d talk to her about it, tell her how you feel, and then let it go unless it’s a repeat incident.
Anonymous says
I think you set a boundary in the moment and she respected it, so I would be inclined to let it go. It is really easy for grandparents who don’t see a child often to underestimate how much they can do since they change so fast. I also wouldn’t worry too much about her being overprotective when she’s taking care of your child since it is so sporadic. In another year, your child will push back hard on rules they see as unreasonable too.
Anonymous says
Thank you!
Anon says
Agreed. My MIL does this too and it’s a little annoying. My daughter plays with a playset in our yard, she is very used to it and I know that, and MIL is always going OMG, she’s going down the slide alone, do something, like I’m a terrible mother. It does tick me off a little, but I think it’s because she doesn’t see my daughter as much as I do, so she doesn’t know how much she’s evolved since last time. I would also have been irritated in the moment but would try to let it go.
Anon says
Your reaction seems extreme to me honestly, but I don’t know how your dynamics are with your mom otherwise. I definitely do not think you need to create distance from her because of this. Maybe if it were the opposite and she were letting your kid run wild without supervision, but does it really matter if she hovers over your kid more at the playground than you do? There is such a range of parental behavior at playgrounds, and sticking close to a 2 year old is definitely within the realm of normal (as is giving him more space). I would look at this more of a “you do you” thing with your mom. She can hover when she is babysitting him or in town visiting, and you can give him a bit more freedom the rest of the time.
That being said, she shouldn’t have made a scene at the playground. I would try to have a calm conversation with her away from your kid and agree that it shouldn’t happen again. And maybe skip going the playground with her again. ;)
Anonymous says
Thank you! Yes, we have an oftentimes rocky relationship, which is why I wanted others’ opinions on this specific issue. I don’t want to overreact. Thank you.
Anon says
+1. Everything about your post seemed very typical, until I got to the second part of your post. Almost all of my friends have kids, and all have generally good relationships with their parents — and I honestly don’t know anyone who is perfectly aligned with their parents when it comes to raising/watching their kids.
But the fact that a seemingly minor disagreement escalated into a scene at the playground that required you to ask her to leave, and your second paragraph are red flags that there is more going on here. If it’s just hurt feelings, then I agree with the poster above — it’s fine to have different rules, and you just kind of have to manage how you feel about it. My mom (with whom I’m really, really close) used to make comments that hurt my feelings about the fact that I stuck to a sleep/eat schedule with my kids, and she never did a schedule when my brother and I were little. I finally figured out that it hurt my feelings bc it felt a bit like a ding on the fact that I was a working mom and she was a SAHM (she used to say stuff like “Oh, I never had to follow a schedule bc we could just have you nap whenever you were tired”), but I realized after some time that she was feeling a little insecure bc I got frustrated when she forgot to put the kids down with a nap, for instance. Anyway, realizing we were both doing our best, but trying to figure out how to synthesize different parenting styles for a kid we both loved deeply, helped.
Anon says
It seems extreme to me too. Your kid is 2, not 12; hovering at the playground is pretty normal, even if unnecessary. And she isn’t his daily caregiver, and doesn’t know what he can do, so it’s normal for her to be more cautious than necessary.
Anon says
Wow, that is infuriating. I can’t stand excessive safety-ism around kids – I feel like girls especially get so much “be careful!” “not too fast!” and “is that safe?” instead of encouragement to take age-appropriate risks. You have my sympathies. The “[name], you can’t do that!” is especially grating – I can literally hear the condescending, exasperated tone.
That said, if you said anything rude or excessive in the “scene” you mentioned, I would apologize for those words. You don’t need to apologize for parenting choices.
Anonymous says
Thank you. I didn’t say much of anything at all, I was so stunned that she was second-guessing me.
Anon says
I am not saying it’s okay, but I am here to say it’s extremely common for parents to second guess how their kids parent. I’d work on how you want to respond in the moment so you’re more ready in the future and not caught off guard. There’s no one right way for all situations; sometimes it makes sense to ignore, accommodate, or push back. Think about what really matters to you and what you can roll your eyes at because this is certainly not the last time you’ll be in this sort of dynamic !
Anon says
I am not saying it’s okay, but I am here to say it’s extremely common for parents to second guess how their kids parent. I’d work on how you want to respond in the moment so you’re more ready in the future and not caught off guard. There’s no one right way for all situations; sometimes it makes sense to ignore, accommodate, or push back. Think about what really matters to you and what you can roll your eyes at because this is certainly not the last time you’ll be in this sort of dynamic !
Anonymous says
if you want to laugh about it, callmekristenmarie has some extremely hilarious skits on instagram about exactly this subject.
Anonymous says
This sounds like an incident that happened between my SIL and her mother, except that SIL was angry that her mother was letting her 5-year-old go down the slide by himself. It was driven by SIL’s anxiety and controlling tendencies as well as unresolved mother-daughter conflict. Similarly, your incident seems like a symptom of deeper issues. Ordinarily, if a mother and daughter were not in alignment about playground safety precautions it wouldn’t escalate to a shouting match. “Boundaries” are the way to go if you want go low-contact with your mother, which it sounds like you want a reason to do. If you don’t want to go low-contact, you need to have an honest conversation with your mother to come to terms with the underlying conflict.
Anonymous says
I have a pretty fraught relationship with my mom, and she has anxiety. Something that has helped is having a lot of conversations with her about my parenting choices. I’ve noticed I can’t address things in the moment: I have to bring it up conversationally. And then I’ve also relaxed a lot. I give my kids lot of unsupervised access to my mom. If she wants to hover on the play ground then so be it. And then there are some things, like eating out, that I simply don’t invite my mom to do with us because she makes it kind of miserable. All that to say, you may not need to apologize and also the relationship isn’t ruined. I’d drop it and keep inviting your mom around.
Anonymous says
I agree with this. My parents are wonderful grandparents, and they also are very anxious and emotional (and becoming more so as they get older), and the kind of people who always, always need to be doing something. I really value having a more relaxed, slower-paced lifestyle (we have big jobs that can be stressful, so it’s really important to us that our home just be a lot more chilled out). There is definitely some tension around our different approaches. At the same time, I know that they adore my kids and I want to support that relationship. So I’ve figured out which activities we can do where either we’re on the same page or I can easily let it go if they’re making me a little nuts, and which activities we just don’t really do together (also eating out for us). Sometimes I do feel like I need to say something because maybe a kid needs to hear it, but then I very deliberately change the subject. I think this is one of those things that is tough but doesn’t have to be relationship-tanking, especially if you’re prepared for it in the moment (which I think maybe was not the case in this situation, but it could be in the future).
Anon says
My mom does this. It’s incredibly annoying, but it’s just who she is. She has some issues with concentration and maybe it was the way she used to remind herself to check that we weren’t dead all the time, I don’t know. It’s also been a while since she had kids and has pretty much forgotten what kids are like developmentally. I’ll reassure her that they’re fine, but if she wants to hover than I tell her to go on ahead and knock herself out. Just because she’s panicking doesn’t mean that I have to.
GCA says
OP, is this a pattern or the first time she’s acted like this? My mom also freaks out about anything remotely adventurous or physically ‘dangerous’; it may be a generational thing. (My dad, conversely, would’ve blithely turned us loose at the beach or in the park.) It drives me up the wall. But the boundary if any is between you and her, not her and your family. If my mom wanted to come hang out with my kids every few months and do this to them, I would have her take them to the playground solo – I would not want to be on the playground at the same time because that specific behavior would be too much for me. Kids will grasp that different caregivers have different standards, and most of the time it’s worthwhile to strengthen a kid-grandparent relationship.
Anon says
I agree with the last point (kids will grasp that different caregivers have different standards). My sisters are both the “blithely turn them loose” types. (Speaking of being driven up walls, literally my nephews were part of a children’s parkour club before they were in grade school…) I am proud of them but also reluctant to be the one supervising riskier physical activities if their parents are not around. My sisters are themselves athletic, whereas I have some physical limitations, so I know I have less of a basis for judging how safe they’re being, where their own limits lie, and also slower response times if I need to step in… I imagine a lot of older people feel similarly eventually! I realize that is different from getting anxious while a parent is present, but not being present might be a happier path forward in this scenario.
Lovey says
Good morning, all. I am the person asking last Friday about your experiences with your baby crying when you pick her up from her grandparents’ house, and I wanted to thank you all for responding. After spending a lovely weekend with my baby 24/7, I feel much better, too.
Yesterday morning, I was running with my daughter in the running stroller. I mostly listen to a news-like program, but yesterday was listening to music. Usually you hear of “Dad rock,” in the context of the type of music that particular kinds of Dads are listening to. Well, yesterday, there I was, running with my baby and listening to Mom rock. It just kind of hit me in the middle of my run, listening to “old” music by a band that doesn’t exist any more: OMG, I am running to Mom rock. Ha ha ha ha ha.
How was everyone else’s weekend?
Cb says
Oh fun! I find it funny when I’m in a cool cafe and they’ve got early aught indie bands playing and I feel like an oldster. We’ve got 14 more days of school… so just trying to survive til the end of the year.
We went fake camping (pre-pitched tent, in a country park with fancy brunch) and it was really nice to have family-time. My son has been in a grump and I think the time away, just playing in the dirt, seemed to help. I don’t love camping – it seems so much work – but it was nice. Our phone usage (as parents) is pretty mild, but my son’s become the phone police and asked us to turn our phones off for the trip, and it was really good to properly disconnect (my husband DEFINITELY skirted this prohibition).
And today he had sports day and was so stressed about the sack race (last year, he got stuck and had to be carried over the finish line by his teacher) and he rocked it today. He got to the finish line and did this amazing victory dance and kept catching my eye and giving me thumbs up.
Clementine says
Weekends aren’t long enough! We finished out our last spring sports tournament and kid did excellent. We lasted through the full season despite some hiccups. The fact that neither little sibling stormed the field is also a win.
We didn’t get enough done (does one ever??) but a college friend is having her first baby and I am able to unload the last of the baby stuff on her. WHEE. We’ve been pulling stuff out of the attic and it feels so freeing.
BTW – I know many people who talk about the bittersweet feeling of being done with babies. I know I used to be so sad to put away tiny little outfits… I know I must be done because WOW. The absolute joy I am getting from ditching the baby gear is now like 99% sweet, 1% sad.
Cb says
Ha! That’s how I knew I was happily one-and-done, the joy I felt freecyling baby stuff as soon as my son had outgrown it.
Anon says
Ha, same.
Mary Moo Cow says
Now that I have elementary school kids who are enjoyable little people with some weekend extracurriculars (but still all the birthday parties), I feel ya that weekends aren’t long enough. Weekends with toddlers felt long and exhausting, but now weekends are short and merely tiring.
Anon says
Not great! We came home from vacation to discover our fridge/freezer wasn’t working, so I spent the weekend cleaning up the mess and throwing away hundreds of dollars worth of food, and I’ve spent today coordinating appliance repair people and shopping for a new fridge while dealing with the first day of camps and kids who are not yet familiar with their summer routine. My husband is on a work trip to Puerto Rico and is sending me texts about how he saw an octopus while snorkeling. Read the room, dude.
Cerulean says
I thought about your post last night when we stopped by my mom’s house for what was supposed to be a few minutes… and it turned into kiddo digging her heels in about leaving and an impromptu sleepover/date night!
GCA says
Packed but enjoyable! Did a 5K with kid 1 on Saturday morning while DH and kid 2 had some quality brunch-time; finished some house chores/ projects; spent time with family; and then we all went to watch a local women’s soccer match. We had the good fortune of sitting right behind the official fan club – flags, scarves, loudhailer, trombone, everything – and every time the team scored a goal the crowd went wild. So much fun.
Rat Race says
I’ve been in a rat race job for the last ~15 years. Increasingly people I respect have been leaving the company to do other things related to the same Widget/product, and people I barely respect are taking over in leadership roles, which makes life really hard day to day. It’s exhausting. We just completed our family, me having given birth last fall to my third/last. I’m such a hustler in my core – working up from an admin position in my financial services firm to my current role of MD in a total man’s word. I’m really proud of my trajectory and hustle, and “I’m going to prove them wrong”-driven aspirations that got me to where I am. But, today? Today I’m tired. Like, just totally disheartened by and exhausted of the race.
Is this turning 40, which I will at the end of this year? Having kids/having the view that my family is now complete so it’s time to live, so to speak? I also had some professional acquaintances literally drop dead in the last 6 months at young ages – one in his 30s and one around 55. I feel like I’m oddly, uncharacteristically introspective at the moment – finding myself asking, “what’s the point?” of the race I’m in if I can’t enjoy life outside of work. I’ve for so long identified by myself by my job and hustle, but it just feels way less fulfilling to do that these days.
I’m not sure what my question is. Does this resonate? It’s time to explore a change, right? DH is currently in the midst of a job change after a decade at his company so I’m trying to not put all of these feelings on him at the moment (he knows I feel this way but he’s not as available to go deep with me as he’s readying for his own change). I think if I made a move I’d still make really good money, albeit less than what I make now, but that’s fine. What would you do if you were me?
Anon says
If I were you (I am in a similar circumstance, as are many on this board), I would stay. Can you use the good will you earned at your company over the past 15 years to lean out a little? What would allow you to enjoy life outside of work more? WFH, Summer Fridays, flexible schedule, more vacation time, take on fewer projects, etc. It would take a long time to earn that type of freedom if you started at a new company. I know it’s hard to watch people you don’t respect take on leadership roles, but that will happen no matter where you work. If I took a pay cut to go to another company there would have to be a significant benefit other than working with new people.
Anonymous says
I don’t know if this article about midlife career crises will resonate with you but I found it really insightful and have been meaning to share it here: https://hbr.org/2019/03/facing-your-mid-career-crisis
To answer your question more directly, what is the downside of thinking about a change? For me, it has been helpful to try to imagine a wider range of possibilities, even if I don’t know exactly what I want yet. (For context, I’m 47, and have fallen into a rewarding but niche nonprofit role that offers limited further advancement potential. I’m trying to figure out what I want the next 20 years of my working life to look like).
Anon says
just read the article. thanks for sharing!
Mary Moo Cow says
I’m not married to my career and my ambition and hustle tanked after having my kids, so YMMV, but I would see what I could do to lean out this summer and then reassess in the fall, when you’ve hit the one year back at work after mat leave mark. If you’re still feeling tired and way less fulfilled, then start looking. Spend some time this summer daydreaming about your pie in the sky and some time meditating/journaling/talking with others about what you like about your job, your career, what you don’t like, what you thought you would do as a kid and in college, and see what comes out. Maybe it’s going part-time, maybe it’s leaving for another full-time gig, maybe a gig with a slower pace, maybe it’s a pivot to something new.
Also, spend some time this summer running models of what it would look like if you took a paycut to go part-time, if you became an independent contractor, if you quit totally for a period, etc., both financially and shifting the household duties.
Finally, solidarity. I’m 41 and in my job for at least one more year, until my loans are forgiven. Talking about dissatisfaction with friends in other fields has given me some avenues to explore and also helped me bide my time to thoughtfully consider what might be next.
Anon says
i think this is a really common feeling, especially if you’ve achieved what you set out to achieve both professionally and personally. do you have hopes for leadership higher than MD at your firm or at another firm? if not, this is like the first time in a long time where there is no obvious next step. it is obviously hard working for people you don’t respect/like, but this seems be common when you’ve reached a goal. DH is kind of struggling with this right now too. I agree with spending some time exploring, running financial models, etc. i also agree with leaning out (which i’ve also suggested to my DH but he doesn’t seem to understand the concept)
when you say “what’s the point of the race if you can’t enjoy life outside of work”? –> what do you mean by that? that you are always working so there is no time to enjoy life? what would enjoying life outside of work look like to you? how can you add more of that to your life? also- what is your childcare situation like outside of work? i really hope you are outsourcing everything
Clementine says
Ugh, on the ‘life is short piece’… I know I’ve shared on here that husband is working on a big career shift. There were a lot of big drivers of it, but two of the final straws were 1. Missing big holidays (again) and 2. the sudden death of a few of my friends. I had a rough week where 2 people, both in their 30’s, unexpectedly passed away. One of them left behind a 2 year old.
Husband has been financially successful and was very good at his prior job which he also really liked… but similarly, it was the ‘what’s this all for’ question. He’s working on shifting jobs (still job hunting for the right fit… I’m not stressed at all, def not stressed…) but for our family, him taking a 50% or more pay cut was worth it for having him around.
OP says
I had a longer reply that hasn’t posted, or maybe I deleted? Sorry if this goes up twice but here’s a shortened version:
Thanks for the response (and everyone else!). I should say that I’m 100% commission and my perceived “pay cut” would actually put me at parity with what I’ve made the last 18 months, though a pretty sizeable drop from my 5-year look back average as we’re in a down market. That said, we’re living really comfortably on my current income (+ DH’s) so we’ve sort of already tested the water at this lower income level… which is still really solid by any measure. I think that’s partially why I’ve let my head wander a bit. We’re in peak childcare (nanny!) cost years and we’re making it work without needing any savings.
It’s hard to lean out being 100% commission. We’re also a butts-in-seats firm when you’re not seeing clients. I’ll lean out where I can but it’s just so exhausting all the time. I have a vacation in a few weeks and expect I’ll work for a large chunk of it because I’m at my clients’ beck and call… and I can’t trust others to cover in my absence because of the rat race, and all (this was not always the case but with leadership changes and whatnot, it’s just worse in the last few years).
Have not been able to read the HBR article but will tonight. I appreciate having the space here to talk it out – clearly something I needed, and hard to do in real life because I know DH and I are so fortunate to have had such high paying jobs for so long. I have a lot of trusted friends I talk to about a whole lot of things, but my job is a hard one to understand sometimes.
Anonymous says
There’s a real difference between your first post and this one. In this post, you’re focusing on being exhausted because you can’t get real time off or take a break or lean out. That’s a different issue from what you brought up in your first post, where you were asking “what’s the point,” talking about things not being fulfilling, and wondering if there was a different way to get your identity than by hustling at work and proving people wrong.
I’m pointing out the difference so that as you process all this, you can sort out what it is that you’re processing. Are you merely tired and if you had energy you’d be satisfied, fulfilled, and happy with the trajectory of your life and where you’re getting your identity? Or is something more fundamental going on about what you value and who you are, and getting rest really won’t solve that?
Anonymous says
Day care called me for the third Monday in a row saying my twins have “fever” of 100.3 – after being outside in 90 degree heat for an hour. Would it be wrong of me to say “please put them inside in the air conditioning and call me again in an hour.”? They were both totally fine this morning. I even took one temp because he felt warm and he was 99.3 There’s no way my kids are magically fine every weekend and mysteriously become sick at 9:30AM every Monday.
Anonymous says
If his temp was 99.3 first thing in the morning I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s actually sick. Temps go up over the course of the day.
Anon says
Yeah, I run low (97.5 baseline), but 99.3 for me in the morning definitely means I’m sick, and will be well over 100 by the evening.
But I do think taking a kid’s temperature right after they came inside from 90 degree heat is a little nuts. Ask them to recheck in 20 minutes? It doesn’t take an hour to cool down.
Anon says
What is your daycare’s cut off for being sent home? Ours was 100.4. 100.3 would have resulted in a call/message just to give me a heads up that if it got any higher, we would have to come get her. One time my 1.5 year old had an elevated temp after playing outside on a very, very hot day. It wasn’t 100.4 or over, so I told them to strip her down to her diaper and give her something cold. She was fine within the hour. A temp of 99.3 could mean a lot of things. Are they teething? My kid had an elevated temp while teething even though they say that they should not. It could also be her body fighting off an infection. It doesn’t mean she’s too sick to be at daycare, but I also wouldn’t be surprised to be called to pick her up later. What I think is key is that it has happened multiple times and with regularity. I’d be pushing back on it for sure.
Anonymous says
I would want to know why they are taking the child’s temperature – is this something they do routinely or is the child acting sick? If the former, that sounds tough – my son is 12 and I have never had to deal with pandemic-era daycare. I don’t think anyone ever took his temperature unless he was acting sick.
Anonymous says
This. Day care never took temps unless the kid seemed sick.
Anon says
I did have a kid in pandemic-era daycare and other than a few months in 2020 when everyone had a forehead thermometer scan at the door (and those run super low, IME), they never took temperatures except when kids acted sick.
I think it has more to do with the attitude of the provider than the pandemic. The providers who are constantly taking temps seem like the lazy ones who are looking for reasons to send kids home. High quality daycare providers don’t take temps unless a kid seems sick, even in these semi-pandemic times.
Anonymous says
Our pediatrician said to expect two illnesses a month for the first two years of day care, and that turned out to be pretty accurate.
Anonymous says
Unless your kid always runs warm, I bet he’s sick. When my kids truly measure above 99 they feel crappy, even if they don’t have “a fever” on paper.
Anon says
+1
Anon says
Isn’t the cutoff for a fever 100.4? I would thank them for letting you know that they have elevated temperatures, and ask them to take it again after they have been in the air conditioning for an hour.
Also what is the threshold for fever in their handbook? Ours is specifically listed at 100.4.
Anon says
I’m an older FTM wondering when to give parental leave notice. When did you tell your boss you’re pregnant and will need leave? I’m almost 20 weeks, not showing, and I only go into the office 1-2 days a week anyway. I will have been at this job for a year in Sept., so still not protected by FMLA.
We do not have paid leave or STD. We have “unlimited PTO”, which we can’t use for leave. I’ll likely take the max 12 FMLA unpaid leave weeks. Our employee handbook requests 30 days notice for leave.
Should I wait until Sept.? That was my original plan, but I suspect I’ll be showing by then, and I don’t want to be lying to people. It feels like a lie by omission.
Anon says
I had to tell my boss the second I found out I was pregnant because I needed to bow out of a business trip to a very rural part of a vehemently anti-abortion state. She graciously covered for me and swore to keep the secret until I was ready to tell the rest of our small company, which I plan to do after the 20-week ultrasound. I think telling around 20-25 weeks is probably best.
Anon says
i think in an ideal world i would’ve waited until 20 weeks, but i worked fully in-person and was pregnant with twins so I think I was able to wait until 15 weeks, but I was so sick and starting to show so i couldnt wait much longer
Anonymous says
25 weeks is awfully late. If you wait that long you run a very real risk of having to disclose in the context of requesting FMLA for bed rest.
Anon says
You’re right, that is a legit concern. I’m high risk and being seen in maternal fetal medicine after my regular ob referred me.
Anon says
Ugh I’m sorry! My sister is in an abortion ban state, and she’s had several miscarriages. I’m scared for her and for all women in states that don’t recognize our rights.
Anon says
Nesting fail
Anon says
Completely – I had had a miscarriage just prior (that required medical attention) and I told my boss I was absolutely not taking that risk 2,000 miles from home in a state where I couldn’t even quickly cross a border to care. She was 100% understanding. It’s so awful for women who don’t have that choice, though.
Anon says
I would tell your boss sometime in the next few weeks after your anatomy scan rather than waiting until September.
Anon says
My anatomy scan is in a few days. I’ll make a plan to tell them after that.
Anon says
My guess is that plenty of people already know. I’ve never been surprised about a pregnancy announced after about 14-15 weeks and often know sooner. But that’s ok, you don’t need to tell just because some people know.
I would tell after your 20 week scan. I understand waiting until after that, but that’s the last big milestone for a healthy pregnancy and waiting until September to announce a baby coming in late October or early November seems very late to me.
Fwiw, I told my boss at 16 weeks and his response was “congrats, I was wondering when you were going to tell me!” And I’m tall, didn’t gain that much weight and was still in my regular jeans at that point.
Anon says
My concern about waiting comes from feeling unprotected until I’ve been there a year. I don’t think I would get terminated for this, and I’m getting good feedback on my performance, but it worries me.
I wouldn’t be surprised if people knew. I’ve had nausea and vomiting a few times at work, but I also have a known severe food allergy. I’ve explained it off as cross-contamination (something that has legitimately happened before at work).
Anon says
Yeah, I understand that, but I think people are not going to be happy if you announce in September that you have a baby coming in <8 weeks. It may not give people enough time to prepare for your absence. After the anatomy scan is kind of the last standard time to tell, and people will understand waiting until 20-22 weeks, especially if you're older. But waiting longer than that is really pushing it.
Anonymous says
You are going to create some mistrust if you wait much after 20 weeks to disclose. You will come off as cagey and not a team player for not giving people time to plan for coverage, especially if something goes wrong and you have to go out on leave early.
Anonymous says
What reasonable employer would terminate you for getting pregnant, even if you are not yet covered by FMLA? Wouldn’t that be an actionable case of pregnancy discrimination?
Anon says
I’m in a pretty dysfunctional work environment, thus my concern. I’m at a small company that doesn’t fall under FMLA, although we opt into it, given we have >50. Fully half the staff have quit since I’ve been there, and no positions rehired for. We don’t have an HR person. I think pregnancy discrimination is hard to prove if my boss says, today is your last day, with no reasoning. I’m in an at-will state, no union or contract protection.
I do see the point that there needs to be adequate transition and leave planning time given how small we are.
Anon says
I think the bigger question is do you want to come back to this place? Sorry to say, but any place that would be tempted to show you the door for getting pregnant is going to treat you terribly once you become a mom, and it will be a much less clear cut case of discrimination. Firing someone soon after they announce a pregnancy has no possible non-discriminatory explanation; firing a mom who’s underperforming because her baby isn’t sleeping through the night and she’s constantly sick from daycare germs is a lot more arguably legal.
Anon says
I’m applying and interviewing for a new role, but I have to assume I will be coming back. I make significantly more than my husband.
Anonymous says
Other women, especially those who have been pregnant, will generally know by 8 weeks. It shows in your face. If you wait past 20 weeks people will think it’s odd and suspect that you are not a person of good will, but rather the type who will jump down their throats if they congratulate you or sue them for some perceived slight. If you want to be welcomed back warmly after your leave, you need to be reasonably forthcoming and participate in planning and handoffs. If you wait until the last minute you are setting up a cold, transactional, potentially litigious tone.
Anon says
I hear where you’re coming from. I’ve actually lost 25 lbs during pregnancy, and I’m plus size. Friends have commented on me losing weight. I really don’t think people can tell, but maybe they can.
Anon says
Yeah, the face and the boobs always give it away before the belly.
Cerulean says
Eight weeks? That seems pretty over the top.
Anonymous says
Fellow plus size person who lost 10 pounds in first trimester, always had a belly so no one was thinking pregnancy when they looked at me until at least week 24 or so. But still I agree with others that it would be strange to wait past 20 or so weeks to tell key figures at work (not normal co-workers, you can tell them on a case-by-case basis as it makes sense to you).
Anonymous says
I told my boss and team right after my anatomy scan in a similar situation. We had an in person leadership retreat at 20 weeks. The timing worked out – had the scan at 18 weeks, I told my boss/team at 19 weeks and told people in person in conversation at the leadership retreat at 20 weeks.
My main advice I give is that you just have to assume people are going to act with good intent and set the tone that this is exciting news and of course you will work on ensuring coverage is seamless.
My experience has been that if you work somewhere you are concerned about getting fired for disclosing, that’s going to be a risk whether you are there for a year or not; companies that discriminate in that way don’t care about the various laws preventing discrimination/job protection laws.
Anon says
I appreciate this feedback!
Anon says
I’m just here to say I think it’s ridiculous that you can’t use at lease *some* of your supposedly unlimited PTO for leave. If you were taking a long trip to Europe that would be paid! Gah, frustration.
Anon says
Yeah I’d be seriously tempted to take the bare minimum for physical recovery, come back for a day and then leave on a long “vacation.” Everything about this workplace sounds horrible.
Anonymous says
Just fyi, I thought I wasn’t showing much with my first at 15-20 weeks. Everyone knew! I was wrong. I’d just tell your boss at this point. Whatever will happen, will happen. People will appreciate time to plan more than you waiting.
Also, if something bad did happen, wouldn’t you need to tell your boss anyway and take a little time off? I think it’s freeing to tell managers.
Anon says
can someone explain to me what vacation bible school is? is it just like a camp with a religious theme?
Anon says
Yes, it’s a week long summer day camp held at a church. Not sleepaway camp, at least in my hometown.
Anon says
It’s camp run by a church with the express goal of teaching kids about the Bible. My area also has camps run by churches that aren’t as focused on religion. You have to be comfortable with hearing about Jesus at any church camp, but some of the church camps are mostly traditional camp activities with the religion kind of in the background. VBS is more focused on religion.
Anonymous says
It is exactly what the name says. It’s generally a free weeklong day camp run by volunteers at a church, like Sunday school except during the week. There is usually a theme and a canned curriculum that includes songs, stories, drama, dances, crafts, etc. Usually also snacks and playground time. It looks frightfully boring to me, but younger kids who don’t get to go to real day camp seem to love it.
anon says
yes, we are very religious (church multiple times per week, Christian school, etc.) and never send our kids to VBS because 1) it is kind of dumb (the curriculum is always very surface level and sometimes just flat-out wrong about the Bible/our theology) and 2) since it’s a one-off thing run by volunteers, it’s often kind of tedious (boring and also chaotic somehow?).
Some churches run a very sophisticated VBS but it depends completely on the church and the volunteers that year. Many churches use it as “outreach” because often parents will use it as free childcare even if they aren’t into the religion.
Anonymous says
Yes I’d say our church runs a pretty sophisticated and great VBS, but I could see how they vary wildly.
Anonymous says
It depends on the church and VBS. Ours is only morning for 5 days, lots of songs and crafts and learning about Jesus and God. It’s $50/kid for the week. Our church purchases a corporate VBS package so there’s a take home CD and t-shirt. It’s very lively and active. But it’s run by mostly teenagers getting their volunteer hours for graduation requirement. The only reason my kids are comfortable with it is because it’s our church and there’s a lot of familiar faces. Mine are 5/7 and love it! But the 5th graders usually seem a little meh.
Anon says
thanks all. i’m jewish and while there are summer camps run by the jcc and synagogues most of them are camp with a side of religion rather than the other way around (perhaps different if run by a super religious group), and I just think vacation and school in the same title is kind of an oxymoron…though one of my kids told me she wished she was going to school today instead of to camp
Anonymous says
VBS is not normal camp; it’s religious school. The analogue to a JCC camp is YMCA camp.
Anon says
I’m a Jew in the Bible Belt and the Y here is not really analogous to the JCC. I’m not sure if it’s because there are SO many churches and church-run things or what, but Y camps and activities here are completely secular in terms of the experience for the kids. There’s no mention of G-d or religion at all, whereas JCC is overtly religious, though it still functions like a regular camp, just with a dash of religion. There are church camps here that are more similar to the JCC. I agree that VBS isn’t camp though; it’s like Sunday school just during the summer weekdays, and much more focused on religion than both the JCC and the church camps.
Anon says
+1 to this comparison. The JCC camp in my area is not remotely religious, it is just a camp run by the JCC and attended a by a wide variety of children.
Anonymous says
It’s more like summer camp at the yeshiva I think, but it does vary widely depending on the church. My family was pretty liberal Episcopalian – e.g. never went to church in the summer when there was no Sunday school; stopped altogether when I was a teen – but when we were little we went to a friend’s church’s VBS a couple of times because it was fun and low cost. I think she was Presbyterian? I remember making lamb crafts or something with a Bible story tie-in but it wasn’t like Jesus Camp. I don’t think our own church ran one.